UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
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skers
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby skers » Mon Nov 16, 2015 1:24 pm

Since we are reaching that time where y'all can start applying for summer jobs. If you haven't heard the advice yet, or just don't believe it, it really doesn't matter what you do 1L summer. You will get something. Don't get freaked out when other people get jobs, esp firm, jobs. It's a really random process. IMO, pick something paid over anything else and from there just do something cool/different/interesting.

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elterrible78
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby elterrible78 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 1:52 pm

skers wrote:Since we are reaching that time where y'all can start applying for summer jobs. If you haven't heard the advice yet, or just don't believe it, it really doesn't matter what you do 1L summer. You will get something. Don't get freaked out when other people get jobs, esp firm, jobs. It's a really random process. IMO, pick something paid over anything else and from there just do something cool/different/interesting.


Please take this to heart, 1Ls, to the degree that you can. By far the most stressful period in my time at law school was the 1L job search, but it really didn't have to be. And it doesn't have to be for you, either. I mean, don't be that guy and wait until the very last minute, but keep in mind that your 1L grades matter more than where you worked during your 1L summer, so prioritize accordingly (and don't stress toooo much about any of it).

Lawyerman08
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby Lawyerman08 » Mon Nov 16, 2015 6:47 pm

Can anyone who has taken Economic Analysis of the Law with Malani speak to how important the readings are for his exam? Can I do well if I've understood the lectures, or do I also need to go back and do the readings I haven't done?

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beepboopbeep
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby beepboopbeep » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:00 pm

elterrible78 wrote:
skers wrote:Since we are reaching that time where y'all can start applying for summer jobs. If you haven't heard the advice yet, or just don't believe it, it really doesn't matter what you do 1L summer. You will get something. Don't get freaked out when other people get jobs, esp firm, jobs. It's a really random process. IMO, pick something paid over anything else and from there just do something cool/different/interesting.


Please take this to heart, 1Ls, to the degree that you can. By far the most stressful period in my time at law school was the 1L job search, but it really didn't have to be. And it doesn't have to be for you, either. I mean, don't be that guy and wait until the very last minute, but keep in mind that your 1L grades matter more than where you worked during your 1L summer, so prioritize accordingly (and don't stress toooo much about any of it).


I know no one asked for advice on what I'm gonna say, but - on a similar note, I strongly recommend having a hobby first year (and, I mean, all the time, but 1L year especially). I watched so many classmates just throw themselves at work in the library and it seemed like at least a few were doing basically nothing fun, especially around this time in Fall quarter. I took a pottery class that ate up 10-15 hours a week the entirety of 1L, and went to bar trivia most weeks, and just having a couple activities where I could relax and think about things other than law school helped so much.

Main thing I'd say on job search would be, since skers and elterrible covered the important stuff - if you're thinking about bidding a market that you have weak/zero connections to, 1L summer is a way to answer the "why DC?" or "why SF?" questions that you'll get for every non-NYC screener. Don't freak out if you can't find something in whatever place - I worked in Chicago 1L summer and am going to a secondary w/o ties after graduation - but, it's a piece of advice I don't remember hearing from OCS/etc back during 1L.

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Robb
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby Robb » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:22 pm

Lawyerman08 wrote:Can anyone who has taken Economic Analysis of the Law with Malani speak to how important the readings are for his exam? Can I do well if I've understood the lectures, or do I also need to go back and do the readings I haven't done?

The readings better not matter. If the readings matter I am so fucked.

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Mad Hatter
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby Mad Hatter » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:51 pm

Robb wrote:
Lawyerman08 wrote:Can anyone who has taken Economic Analysis of the Law with Malani speak to how important the readings are for his exam? Can I do well if I've understood the lectures, or do I also need to go back and do the readings I haven't done?

The readings better not matter. If the readings matter I am so fucked.

Didn't read anything. Missed like 5 classes. Got a 18_. The reading and lectures are overkill if you had Levmore as a 1L--just slide and let do.

WheninLaw
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby WheninLaw » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:52 pm

Lawyerman08 wrote:Can anyone who has taken Economic Analysis of the Law with Malani speak to how important the readings are for his exam? Can I do well if I've understood the lectures, or do I also need to go back and do the readings I haven't done?


Did not do the readings. Did not go back over the lectures. Used god-given common sense. High 180's.

WheninLaw
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby WheninLaw » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:54 pm

skers wrote:Since we are reaching that time where y'all can start applying for summer jobs. If you haven't heard the advice yet, or just don't believe it, it really doesn't matter what you do 1L summer. You will get something. Don't get freaked out when other people get jobs, esp firm, jobs. It's a really random process. IMO, pick something paid over anything else and from there just do something cool/different/interesting.


Agree. Outside of $$, prioritize jobs where you get meaningful writing opportunities with meaningful feedback. Most of you have no idea how to write (I sure did not) and it's a great chance to learn.

n1o2c3a4c5h6e7t
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby n1o2c3a4c5h6e7t » Wed Dec 09, 2015 5:15 am

Thoughts/advice on this schedule for next quarter? How much reading will be required? Difficulty of grades?

Mergers and Acquisitions (Davis)
Federal Regulation of Securities (Henderson)
Judicial Opinions and Judicial Opinion Writing (Posner and Hochman)
Bankruptcy (Baird)

Any outlines would be appreciated.

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landshoes
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby landshoes » Thu Dec 10, 2015 6:06 pm

Does anyone know what textbook Helmholz uses for Property?

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daedalus2309
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby daedalus2309 » Thu Dec 10, 2015 6:38 pm

landshoes wrote:Does anyone know what textbook Helmholz uses for Property?


Burke - Fundamentals of Property Law
Moynihan is the supplement recommended by Helmholz.

I forget the editions but the latest ones

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2014
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby 2014 » Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:13 am

n1o2c3a4c5h6e7t wrote:Thoughts/advice on this schedule for next quarter? How much reading will be required? Difficulty of grades?

Mergers and Acquisitions (Davis)
Federal Regulation of Securities (Henderson)
Judicial Opinions and Judicial Opinion Writing (Posner and Hochman)
Bankruptcy (Baird)

Any outlines would be appreciated.

In terms of workload this is pretty brutal. M&A isn't that bad but the others are going to require more than a good faith effort.

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landshoes
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby landshoes » Sat Dec 12, 2015 1:22 am

daedalus2309 wrote:
landshoes wrote:Does anyone know what textbook Helmholz uses for Property?


Burke - Fundamentals of Property Law
Moynihan is the supplement recommended by Helmholz.

I forget the editions but the latest ones


Thank you!

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chicago-gunner123
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby chicago-gunner123 » Sat Dec 12, 2015 2:35 pm

How long do these 2L/3L classes with exams take to get grades back?

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Robb
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby Robb » Sat Dec 12, 2015 8:57 pm

chicago-gunner123 wrote:How long do these 2L/3L classes with exams take to get grades back?

IME a week up to the day after the deadline for grades, but usually faster than 1L classes since you get them as they come in rather than once everyone's grades are in. Stone is very fast.

n1o2c3a4c5h6e7t
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby n1o2c3a4c5h6e7t » Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:03 am

2014 wrote:
n1o2c3a4c5h6e7t wrote:Thoughts/advice on this schedule for next quarter? How much reading will be required? Difficulty of grades?

Mergers and Acquisitions (Davis)
Federal Regulation of Securities (Henderson)
Judicial Opinions and Judicial Opinion Writing (Posner and Hochman)
Bankruptcy (Baird)

Any outlines would be appreciated.

In terms of workload this is pretty brutal. M&A isn't that bad but the others are going to require more than a good faith effort.


Thanks for the advice. I might switch one out for something easier. Any suggestions for an easy course?

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2014
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby 2014 » Sun Dec 13, 2015 10:30 am

n1o2c3a4c5h6e7t wrote:
2014 wrote:
n1o2c3a4c5h6e7t wrote:Thoughts/advice on this schedule for next quarter? How much reading will be required? Difficulty of grades?

Mergers and Acquisitions (Davis)
Federal Regulation of Securities (Henderson)
Judicial Opinions and Judicial Opinion Writing (Posner and Hochman)
Bankruptcy (Baird)

Any outlines would be appreciated.

In terms of workload this is pretty brutal. M&A isn't that bad but the others are going to require more than a good faith effort.


Thanks for the advice. I might switch one out for something easier. Any suggestions for an easy course?

I'd probably switch bankruptcy for public choice (which is a GREAT class - unless you hate levmore) or a seminar. I heard good things about the PE one and I took a Baird one that was pretty low effort so those both could be corporate type options if that's your goal. I think Bankruptcy is a good class to take but it's not crucial going into the summer if you wanted to wait for Baird next year. I took it from Casey and would recommend that too if you aren't hell bent on Baird.

Tiny Dancer
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby Tiny Dancer » Sun Dec 13, 2015 10:41 am

Any thoughts on taking Securities with Henderson? Also, is Securities as important for corporate as everyone says it is?

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skers
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby skers » Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:14 pm

Tiny Dancer wrote:Any thoughts on taking Securities with Henderson? Also, is Securities as important for corporate as everyone says it is?


No class actually matters.

WheninLaw
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby WheninLaw » Fri Dec 18, 2015 1:40 pm

Tiny Dancer wrote:Any thoughts on taking Securities with Henderson? Also, is Securities as important for corporate as everyone says it is?


Great class, if you can stomach Henderson. Securities is a cool subject.

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segamebgeh
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby segamebgeh » Mon Dec 21, 2015 5:13 pm

Hi all,

I've been recently admitted, but am having some last-minute doubts about going to law school. Any advice would be appreciated.

I went to UChicago for undergrad, and one of my favorite courses was "American Law and the Rhetoric of Race," which some undergrads were allowed to take. I realize they're different, but are required courses like Civil Procedure or Torts pretty far removed from the pace/rigor of electives like that?

And if anyone went to UChicago for undergrad as well, how would you say the workload compares? I've read on this board that the "fun goes to die" cliche is more accurate for undergrads than law students--did you have a fairly smooth transition?

Thanks for any help!

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UnicornHunter
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby UnicornHunter » Mon Dec 21, 2015 7:54 pm

segamebgeh wrote:Hi all,

I've been recently admitted, but am having some last-minute doubts about going to law school. Any advice would be appreciated.

I went to UChicago for undergrad, and one of my favorite courses was "American Law and the Rhetoric of Race," which some undergrads were allowed to take. I realize they're different, but are required courses like Civil Procedure or Torts pretty far removed from the pace/rigor of electives like that?

And if anyone went to UChicago for undergrad as well, how would you say the workload compares? I've read on this board that the "fun goes to die" cliche is more accurate for undergrads than law students--did you have a fairly smooth transition?

Thanks for any help!


The law school experience is fine. Some find it overwhelming, but that's more of a personal choice/how people respond to pressure. Impossible to say what your response will be. The doctrinal classes are very different from the law seminars, but you can take up to 9 law seminars while you're here if that's your thing.

That all being said, your concern is dumb. Law school either makes sense as a career move or it doesn't. If you want to be a lawyer and you're not giving up some great other career, Chicago's as good as it gets. If you just want to go because you enjoyed a class you took once but you don't know what you want to do with yourself, law school is a terrible idea. Make sense?

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segamebgeh
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby segamebgeh » Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:09 pm

Thanks for the quick reply, and that does make sense. Just to flesh out my concern a little more, I'm certainly not considering law school on the basis of a single class. I've been out of school for a couple of years, working essentially as a legal researcher. I very much enjoyed studying the field as a Law, Letters and Society student at UChicago and also like following the back and forth argumentation of briefs in my day job. I wouldn't say it's a great other career, but it's certainly a career with decent pay and job security, so there's a risk in giving it up. I do think I would do well as a lawyer, and it's the type of impactful career that appeals to me. But my worst fear is going to law school, finding it absolutely miserable, and leaving after a year with $25k in debt.

As I mentioned, I'm trying to sort out how much of this is normal levels of anxiety. I guess another way of getting advice on this, opposed to how seminars compare to core classes, whether any of you second-guessed yourself after you got accepted and things became more "real."

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skers
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby skers » Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:58 pm

segamebgeh wrote:Thanks for the quick reply, and that does make sense. Just to flesh out my concern a little more, I'm certainly not considering law school on the basis of a single class. I've been out of school for a couple of years, working essentially as a legal researcher. I very much enjoyed studying the field as a Law, Letters and Society student at UChicago and also like following the back and forth argumentation of briefs in my day job. I wouldn't say it's a great other career, but it's certainly a career with decent pay and job security, so there's a risk in giving it up. I do think I would do well as a lawyer, and it's the type of impactful career that appeals to me. But my worst fear is going to law school, finding it absolutely miserable, and leaving after a year with $25k in debt.

As I mentioned, I'm trying to sort out how much of this is normal levels of anxiety. I guess another way of getting advice on this, opposed to how seminars compare to core classes, whether any of you second-guessed yourself after you got accepted and things became more "real."


You should significantly adjust your worst-case scenario.

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segamebgeh
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Re: UChi Students & Alumni Taking Questions

Postby segamebgeh » Mon Dec 21, 2015 9:09 pm

skers wrote:
segamebgeh wrote:Thanks for the quick reply, and that does make sense. Just to flesh out my concern a little more, I'm certainly not considering law school on the basis of a single class. I've been out of school for a couple of years, working essentially as a legal researcher. I very much enjoyed studying the field as a Law, Letters and Society student at UChicago and also like following the back and forth argumentation of briefs in my day job. I wouldn't say it's a great other career, but it's certainly a career with decent pay and job security, so there's a risk in giving it up. I do think I would do well as a lawyer, and it's the type of impactful career that appeals to me. But my worst fear is going to law school, finding it absolutely miserable, and leaving after a year with $25k in debt.

As I mentioned, I'm trying to sort out how much of this is normal levels of anxiety. I guess another way of getting advice on this, opposed to how seminars compare to core classes, whether any of you second-guessed yourself after you got accepted and things became more "real."


You should significantly adjust your worst-case scenario.


If I attend, I'll receive $50,000 in aid per year, so I suppose the real worst case is a miserable three years and graduating with $75k in debt--but I'd like to think if things went south I would leave before then. But do you mind if I ask whether you got cold feet at any point in the process?




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