WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
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OakBrook2021
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby OakBrook2021 » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:03 am

LET'S GET IT wrote:Some of them come to campus to intercview. I interviewed with the DOL, OCC, and NSA. People get that stuff, but not many people. So I wouldn’t necessarily come to WUSTL planning to get a bigFED gig. Or at least if that is your plan, have a couple backups.


Thanks for the response! I really want USAO or SEC but I'm fine with grinding it out in biglaw for a few years to get there. I also realize I can't plan on bigfed at any school so biglaw would be my backup; I know it's far from a backup plan at WUSTL and I can't assume I'll be in the top third after 1L which is why I'm hesitant about the school

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njdevils2626
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby njdevils2626 » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:31 am

OakBrook2021 wrote:
LET'S GET IT wrote:Some of them come to campus to intercview. I interviewed with the DOL, OCC, and NSA. People get that stuff, but not many people. So I wouldn’t necessarily come to WUSTL planning to get a bigFED gig. Or at least if that is your plan, have a couple backups.


Thanks for the response! I really want USAO or SEC but I'm fine with grinding it out in biglaw for a few years to get there. I also realize I can't plan on bigfed at any school so biglaw would be my backup; I know it's far from a backup plan at WUSTL and I can't assume I'll be in the top third after 1L which is why I'm hesitant about the school


FWIW, from anecdotal experience, SEC seems to be the most frequent federal government employer for WUSTL students (At least that I'm aware of). I have no idea whether it's simply because they hire a lot more attorneys than other agencies, because of our SEC internship program, or for whatever other idiosyncratic reasons there may be.

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PeanutsNJam
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby PeanutsNJam » Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:46 pm

I don't think USAO hires straight out of law school from anywhere. They always take people with work experience. I could be wrong, but if someone did get USAO right out of law school, it would be the extreme exception.

There are DoJ honors programs that are very selective, but anecdotally, they're not super law-school rank snobby, so I think if you have great grades, DoJ honors is well within your grasp. It's a different story when you get into specific components, though.

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Jmart082
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby Jmart082 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 2:38 pm

OakBrook2021 wrote:
LET'S GET IT wrote:Some of them come to campus to intercview. I interviewed with the DOL, OCC, and NSA. People get that stuff, but not many people. So I wouldn’t necessarily come to WUSTL planning to get a bigFED gig. Or at least if that is your plan, have a couple backups.


Thanks for the response! I really want USAO or SEC but I'm fine with grinding it out in biglaw for a few years to get there. I also realize I can't plan on bigfed at any school so biglaw would be my backup; I know it's far from a backup plan at WUSTL and I can't assume I'll be in the top third after 1L which is why I'm hesitant about the school

If you’re coming in looking for a specific outcome that is grade correlated and highly selective, I’d go with a T-14, if it’s an option.

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OakBrook2021
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby OakBrook2021 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 3:38 pm

Jmart082 wrote:If you’re coming in looking for a specific outcome that is grade correlated and highly selective, I’d go with a T-14, if it’s an option.


Yeah I've been accepted to Duke already so T14 is def an option; I just wanted to gauge how much harder it would be to achieve that at WashU (for free basically) compared to T14 where I'll be taking out major loans

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RareExports
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby RareExports » Sun Oct 22, 2017 4:55 pm

OakBrook2021 wrote:
Jmart082 wrote:If you’re coming in looking for a specific outcome that is grade correlated and highly selective, I’d go with a T-14, if it’s an option.


Yeah I've been accepted to Duke already so T14 is def an option; I just wanted to gauge how much harder it would be to achieve that at WashU (for free basically) compared to T14 where I'll be taking out major loans

This goes without saying, but is worth reinforcing: not all T14s are equal and the difference between Duke and Wash U is much less than, say, the difference between Chicago and Wash U.

I think there's a lot of false belief on this site (and I'm not attributing this view to you) that the choice is between a guaranteed good job outcome with loads of debt or a riskier career move with little or no debt. In reality, there is no dramatic drop off after T14; the downgrades in career opportunities are more continuous and begin at the very top. To be sure, by any metric Duke's job placement is better than Wash U's, but the difference is not as large as many make it out to be.

I think there's one additional point worth mentioning, that again, many disregard: If you're not comfortable with a job outcome near the bottom of class, the decision shouldn't be to go to a higher-ranked school, it should be not to go to law school. The outcomes at the bottom of the class at Duke are not much different than the outcomes at the bottom of the class at Wash U. (I am also convinced that, despite the unpredictability of any given person's law school performance, that that person will, all else equal, end up ranked higher in the class at a school with a less qualified class than at a school with a more qualified class.)

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HenryHankPalmer
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby HenryHankPalmer » Sun Oct 22, 2017 5:03 pm

Can anyone talk a little bit about WUSTL’s placement in Texas? In my conversations with admissions, they intimated to me that everyone from Wash U that wants Texas BigLaw gets it, and that the raw numbers are relatively low because of self selection. How true is that in your experience? How well represented are the BigTex fiend at OCI?
Last edited by HenryHankPalmer on Sun Oct 22, 2017 5:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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OakBrook2021
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby OakBrook2021 » Sun Oct 22, 2017 5:12 pm

Thanks for the insight. Tbh I haven't really looked at bottom of the class outcomes so I'll start researching that right away

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Sprout
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby Sprout » Sun Oct 22, 2017 6:40 pm

HenryHankPalmer wrote:Can anyone talk a little bit about WUSTL’s placement in Texas? In my conversations with admissions, they intimated to me that everyone from Wash U that wants Texas BigLaw gets it, and that the raw numbers are relatively low because of self selection. How true is that in your experience? How well represented are the BigTex fiend at OCI?

This is absolutely not true.

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Jmart082
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby Jmart082 » Mon Oct 23, 2017 3:02 pm

OakBrook2021 wrote:
Jmart082 wrote:If you’re coming in looking for a specific outcome that is grade correlated and highly selective, I’d go with a T-14, if it’s an option.


Yeah I've been accepted to Duke already so T14 is def an option; I just wanted to gauge how much harder it would be to achieve that at WashU (for free basically) compared to T14 where I'll be taking out major loans

I would go to Duke. The strength of their alumni network is really impressive, and in the absence of strong academic credentials or even in complement to them, networking is key. I'd go with the school that offers more in that respect
PS: for the sake of transparency, i have to say that i have attended both of these schools.
Last edited by Jmart082 on Mon Oct 23, 2017 3:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Jmart082
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby Jmart082 » Mon Oct 23, 2017 3:03 pm

Sprout wrote:
HenryHankPalmer wrote:Can anyone talk a little bit about WUSTL’s placement in Texas? In my conversations with admissions, they intimated to me that everyone from Wash U that wants Texas BigLaw gets it, and that the raw numbers are relatively low because of self selection. How true is that in your experience? How well represented are the BigTex fiend at OCI?

This is absolutely not true.

Completely false. Total hogwash

monkeyboy123
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby monkeyboy123 » Wed Nov 08, 2017 3:10 am

Hey guys, this is a bit off-topic from what was being discussed here . . . but has anyone taken Bankruptcy with Professor Keating? I can't find a single outline in the Outline Bank and I don't know any upperclassmen who have taken the course. Can anyone give me some tips/advice or even possibly an outline? I would really appreciate the help.

chingwoo
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby chingwoo » Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:57 am

monkeyboy123 wrote:Hey guys, this is a bit off-topic from what was being discussed here . . . but has anyone taken Bankruptcy with Professor Keating? I can't find a single outline in the Outline Bank and I don't know any upperclassmen who have taken the course. Can anyone give me some tips/advice or even possibly an outline? I would really appreciate the help.


90% sure that Keating wrote Schermer's exam.

Second of all, it is super code based, I think a standard bankruptcy outline would most likely work. If its still multiple choice, there is a 300 question multiple choice book out for purchase.

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njdevils2626
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby njdevils2626 » Wed Nov 08, 2017 1:11 pm

chingwoo wrote:
monkeyboy123 wrote:Hey guys, this is a bit off-topic from what was being discussed here . . . but has anyone taken Bankruptcy with Professor Keating? I can't find a single outline in the Outline Bank and I don't know any upperclassmen who have taken the course. Can anyone give me some tips/advice or even possibly an outline? I would really appreciate the help.


90% sure that Keating wrote Schermer's exam.

Second of all, it is super code based, I think a standard bankruptcy outline would most likely work. If its still multiple choice, there is a 300 question multiple choice book out for purchase.


Didn't take it with Keating because he hasn't taught it in years, but as above poster said, 99% sure Keating wrote Schermer's exam anyways. PM me if you need an outline so I can remember to send one when I get home.

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HenryHankPalmer
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby HenryHankPalmer » Wed Nov 08, 2017 2:27 pm

Sprout wrote:
HenryHankPalmer wrote:Can anyone talk a little bit about WUSTL’s placement in Texas? In my conversations with admissions, they intimated to me that everyone from Wash U that wants Texas BigLaw gets it, and that the raw numbers are relatively low because of self selection. How true is that in your experience? How well represented are the BigTex fiend at OCI?

This is absolutely not true.

I may have put a few words in their mouth, I think that maybe ties were implied, but regardless, that brings me to a new question. Based on your experience and what you have seen or heard from your classmates, how well does Wash U place in Texas? I recognize that that is a bit of a niche question, so it isn't just for you, but any current students/recent grads.

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PeanutsNJam
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby PeanutsNJam » Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:06 pm

HenryHankPalmer wrote:I may have put a few words in their mouth, I think that maybe ties were implied, but regardless, that brings me to a new question. Based on your experience and what you have seen or heard from your classmates, how well does Wash U place in Texas? I recognize that that is a bit of a niche question, so it isn't just for you, but any current students/recent grads.


For my year (3L), anecdotally, with ties, people in the top 1/3 have gotten Texas regional biglaw (like the Thompson Coburn of St. Louis).

Without ties, people in the top 20% have gotten Texas biglaw (BB/V&E/Latham).

I know of 1 2L with a Texas biglaw offer, but have no idea what this person's grades/ties are.

I think if you have top 20% grades and you've got a convincing "I hate Chi/NYC/LA/DC/SF" story, you stand a decent shot at getting Texas biglaw. The people I know going to Texas legit did not like coastal cities, and I wouldn't be surprised if that came across in the interviews and played in their favor.

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sublime
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby sublime » Fri Nov 10, 2017 9:37 pm

That's about my anecdotal experience as well.

Menchie
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby Menchie » Fri Nov 10, 2017 10:50 pm

How accurate is the WUSTL room and board estimate of $14,400 per year? That seems a little high to me.

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sublime
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby sublime » Fri Nov 10, 2017 11:18 pm

Menchie wrote:How accurate is the WUSTL room and board estimate of $14,400 per year? That seems a little high to me.


Way high. I believe they overestimate col so you can take more in federal loans if you want to.

ETA: I had a nice, newly renovated 1 br quadrangle (university owned) apartment that covered all bills, half a mile from the school for about 1000 a month. Obviously if you want roommates or are less picky about location, you can find lower.

Menchie
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby Menchie » Fri Nov 10, 2017 11:23 pm

sublime wrote:
Menchie wrote:How accurate is the WUSTL room and board estimate of $14,400 per year? That seems a little high to me.


Way high. I believe they overestimate col so you can take more in federal loans if you want to.


Ooh that makes sense. Thank you! How do you like the Metro? Is it relatively painless to get around without having a car and paying for a parking pass?

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sublime
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby sublime » Fri Nov 10, 2017 11:41 pm

Menchie wrote:
sublime wrote:
Menchie wrote:How accurate is the WUSTL room and board estimate of $14,400 per year? That seems a little high to me.


Way high. I believe they overestimate col so you can take more in federal loans if you want to.


Ooh that makes sense. Thank you! How do you like the Metro? Is it relatively painless to get around without having a car and paying for a parking pass?


It's fine. Don't expect it to be a real subway system but it works well if both your start and end are near a stop. I didn't have a car while in ls and was fine, but it helped to be on the loop. Most ppl seem to have cars tho.

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sweets91
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby sweets91 » Sat Nov 11, 2017 8:10 am

Menchie wrote:
sublime wrote:
Menchie wrote:How accurate is the WUSTL room and board estimate of $14,400 per year? That seems a little high to me.


Way high. I believe they overestimate col so you can take more in federal loans if you want to.


Ooh that makes sense. Thank you! How do you like the Metro? Is it relatively painless to get around without having a car and paying for a parking pass?


I live about a mile from campus, so I didn't get a car and walked to school. Groceries/mall, I took the metro. Just work on timing - it comes around every 20 minutes, so if you miss it, it sucks to wait

ETA: also uber

Menchie
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby Menchie » Sat Nov 11, 2017 11:48 am

sublime wrote:
Menchie wrote:
sublime wrote:
Menchie wrote:How accurate is the WUSTL room and board estimate of $14,400 per year? That seems a little high to me.


Way high. I believe they overestimate col so you can take more in federal loans if you want to.


Ooh that makes sense. Thank you! How do you like the Metro? Is it relatively painless to get around without having a car and paying for a parking pass?


It's fine. Don't expect it to be a real subway system but it works well if both your start and end are near a stop. I didn't have a car while in ls and was fine, but it helped to be on the loop. Most ppl seem to have cars tho.


Thank you! Good to know :)

Menchie
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby Menchie » Sat Nov 11, 2017 11:49 am

Menchie wrote:
sublime wrote:
Menchie wrote:
sublime wrote:
Menchie wrote:How accurate is the WUSTL room and board estimate of $14,400 per year? That seems a little high to me.


Way high. I believe they overestimate col so you can take more in federal loans if you want to.


Ooh that makes sense. Thank you! How do you like the Metro? Is it relatively painless to get around without having a car and paying for a parking pass?


It's fine. Don't expect it to be a real subway system but it works well if both your start and end are near a stop. I didn't have a car while in ls and was fine, but it helped to be on the loop. Most ppl seem to have cars tho.


Thank you! Good to know :)

sweets91 wrote:
Menchie wrote:
sublime wrote:
Menchie wrote:How accurate is the WUSTL room and board estimate of $14,400 per year? That seems a little high to me.


Way high. I believe they overestimate col so you can take more in federal loans if you want to.


Ooh that makes sense. Thank you! How do you like the Metro? Is it relatively painless to get around without having a car and paying for a parking pass?


I live about a mile from campus, so I didn't get a car and walked to school. Groceries/mall, I took the metro. Just work on timing - it comes around every 20 minutes, so if you miss it, it sucks to wait

ETA: also uber


Ahh I see. Seems like it might be a good idea to get a cheap car while I'm there if I go. Thanks again!

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PeanutsNJam
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Re: WUSTL Recent Grad (and others) Taking Questions

Postby PeanutsNJam » Sun Nov 12, 2017 2:22 am

Most people eventually cave and get a car if they're not within walking distance. There's a metro stop that puts you real close to the law school, but trains run infrequently so it's not like a typical subway where you can just go. I used an app that told me when trains were arriving.




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