Boalt 1Ls taking questions Forum

[Rotor]

First point - see bold. Maybe it is unlikely, but it can happen. Trust me.

Sorry Amy, I should have been more equivocal. Probably closer to "somewhat" than the original "extremely."

[d34d9823]

First point - see bold. Maybe it is unlikely, but it can happen. Trust me.

Sorry Amy, I should have been more equivocal. Probably closer to "somewhat" than the original "extremely."

What % of the class gets a P?

[Rotor]

Kronk and Rotor, thank you for taking the time to share.

Thank you guys again.

@Rotor:

Out of the handful of guys getting 1L SA in IP, why are they successful? WE? Background? This is exactly what I am going for, so the more informed I am, the better.

Thank you again!

I wish I could tell you but that would be a third hand guess. When you get here, track those folks down and ask them. BTLJ and BCLT are very active and they would likely be able to give you some good info.

[Tangerine Gleam]

First point - see bold. Maybe it is unlikely, but it can happen. Trust me.

Sorry Amy, I should have been more equivocal. Probably closer to "somewhat" than the original "extremely."

What % of the class gets a P?

60% of the class gets a P, unless the professor feels that a student deserves a sub-P. But that doesn't happen too often.

[Dayan114]

Thanks for taking questions! If you can help me, I've a one of some import:

What does Pope Gregory have to do with make-up classes?

[Rotor]

Thanks for taking questions! If you can help me, I've a one of some import:

What does Pope Gregory have to do with make-up classes?

Gregory XIII is best known for his reformation of the calendar, producing the Gregorian calendar with the aid of Jesuit priest/astronomer Christopher Clavius. The reason for the reform was that the average length of the year in the Julian Calendar was too long, and the date of the actual Vernal Equinox had slowly slipped to 10 March, whereas the computus (calculation) of the date of Easter still followed the traditional date of 21 March.[citation needed]

This was rectified by following the observations of Clavius, and the calendar was changed when Gregory decreed that the day after Thursday, 4 October 1582 would be not Friday, 5 October, but Friday, 15 October 1582. He issued the papal bull Inter gravissimas to promulgate the new calendar on 24 February 1582. On 15 October 1582, this calendar replaced the Julian calendar, in use since 45 BC, and has become universally used today. Because of his decree, the reform of the Julian calendar came to be known as the Gregorian calendar.

Bolded part is my best guess. Someone trying to be esoteric in naming the make up days.

[worldtraveler]

In regards to grades, it's also possible to do drastically better one semester than another. It's very hard to predict how you will do. Not that I did that or anything...

[d34d9823]

In regards to grades, it's also possible to do drastically better one semester than another. It's very hard to predict how you will do. Not that I did that or anything...

That's not unique to Boalt, though.

I am worried that the grading uncertainty will confuse employers.

[bilbobaggins]

In regards to grades, it's also possible to do drastically better one semester than another. It's very hard to predict how you will do. Not that I did that or anything...

That's not unique to Boalt, though.

I am worried that the grading uncertainty will confuse employers.

Employers are very familiar with Boalt's grading system. Other top schools also use it. People will debate about it on TLS, but most Boalt students seem happy with the system. It definitely results in people not talking about GPAs, rank, etc. with any regularity.

[d34d9823]

In regards to grades, it's also possible to do drastically better one semester than another. It's very hard to predict how you will do. Not that I did that or anything...

That's not unique to Boalt, though.

I am worried that the grading uncertainty will confuse employers.

Employers are very familiar with Boalt's grading system. Other top schools also use it. People will debate about it on TLS, but most Boalt students seem happy with the system. It definitely results in people not talking about GPAs, rank, etc. with any regularity.

Why is your Big Law placement worse than your peer schools, then?

[Ialdabaoth]

In regards to grades, it's also possible to do drastically better one semester than another. It's very hard to predict how you will do. Not that I did that or anything...

That's not unique to Boalt, though.

I am worried that the grading uncertainty will confuse employers.

Employers are very familiar with Boalt's grading system. Other top schools also use it. People will debate about it on TLS, but most Boalt students seem happy with the system. It definitely results in people not talking about GPAs, rank, etc. with any regularity.

Why is your Big Law placement worse than your peer schools, then?

I don't understand this "Boalt placement is worse than peer schools" argument. According to this chart http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/law%20sc ... page12.pdf (Feb. 2010 issue), Berkeley placed 50% of graduates at NLJ 250 firms while MVP placed 51, 52.8, and 50.8, respectively. To me those don't seem to be significant differences. Berkleley also tends to have a relatively high number of students focused on PI and a high PI placement rate, 11% (NALP). Boalt's numbers align very closely with NYU's numbers as well in that NYU has a 50.1% NLJ 250 placement rate and an 11% PI placement rate.

So, what's with the anti-Boalt rhetoric?

I'm just presenting the numbers (not anecdotes) I've seen and am genuinely interested in this question. Thanks.

[d34d9823]

I don't understand this "Boalt placement is worse than peer schools" argument. According to this chart http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/law%20sc ... page12.pdf (Feb. 2010 issue), Berkeley placed 50% of graduates at NLJ 250 firms while MVP placed 51, 52.8, and 50.8, respectively. To me those don't seem to be significant differences. Berkleley also tends to have a relatively high number of students focused on PI and a high PI placement rate, 11% (NALP). Boalt's numbers align very closely with NYU's numbers as well in that NYU has a 50.1% NLJ 250 placement rate and an 11% PI placement rate.

So, what's with the anti-Boalt rhetoric?

I'm just presenting the numbers (not anecdotes) I've seen and am genuinely interested in this question. Thanks.

Actually, I was surprised at how well Boalt has performed in the NLJ the last three years:

2010: http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/law%20sc ... page12.pdf
2009: http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843
2008: http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2428438260

My impression was from this compilation for 2005: http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/composite.pdf

Methodology: http://www.law.com/img/nlj/charts/Methodology.pdf

[mrmangs]

2010: http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/law%20sc ... page12.pdf
2009: http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843
2008: http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2428438260

This is helpful. Thanks.

[Ialdabaoth]

I don't understand this "Boalt placement is worse than peer schools" argument. According to this chart http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/law%20sc ... page12.pdf (Feb. 2010 issue), Berkeley placed 50% of graduates at NLJ 250 firms while MVP placed 51, 52.8, and 50.8, respectively. To me those don't seem to be significant differences. Berkleley also tends to have a relatively high number of students focused on PI and a high PI placement rate, 11% (NALP). Boalt's numbers align very closely with NYU's numbers as well in that NYU has a 50.1% NLJ 250 placement rate and an 11% PI placement rate.

So, what's with the anti-Boalt rhetoric?

I'm just presenting the numbers (not anecdotes) I've seen and am genuinely interested in this question. Thanks.

Actually, I was surprised at how well Boalt has performed in the NLJ the last three years:

2010: http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/law%20sc ... page12.pdf
2009: http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2443758843
2008: http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... 2428438260

My impression was from this compilation for 2005: http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/composite.pdf

Methodology: http://www.law.com/img/nlj/charts/Methodology.pdf

Ah, yeah, I can see what you mean from the older stats. Closer to 40% would be considerably worse placement. Thanks for the explanation! It will interesting to see how everything shakes out when the class of 2010 numbers are released. Should that be sometime in February again this year?

[WonkyPanda]

First off, I would just like to thank everyone (i guess even the trolls) for taking their time to give us any input on Boalt and what one can expect when going to this school. I just got accepted yesterday and I was beyond shocked to actually get in. Boalt was my reach school because I felt my 3.68 and 167 was too weak to be a strong candidate for their prestigious institution. I was wishing every day waiting for my SC or UCLA acceptance to get to me so I at least had a pick I could be proud of that was still in my state. Then, UCB literally blows me away with, probably, the most important email I have ever received thus far in my life. I just want to say that we can all split hairs and bicker with one another, but let's just sit back for a moment and just be truly honored to even have the opportunity to say "I got into Berkeley Law".

With all that aside, I have never visited San Francisco or Berkeley. Coming from UCLA, I am use to crappy apartments that are so overpriced that it boggles your mind. Are the facilities closest to campus at least relatively "nice" and comfortable enough for one to live in? Should one assume ~$1300 for a single-bedroom apartment? Is there an apartment that the majority of law students go to or is there a complex that is a favorite among the populace for price/niceness?

Also, I imagine that the library is where one would spend most of there time after school. How is the library at UCB? I know they did some new construction but I don't think any of it was for the library. Is it only for law students or do UGs come and try to crash the place?

That's it for now! I am still glowing over that acceptance so I'll think of more questions later.

[Rotor]

Also, I imagine that the library is where one would spend most of there time after school. How is the library at UCB? I know they did some new construction but I don't think any of it was for the library. Is it only for law students or do UGs come and try to crash the place?

Congrats, Wonky! I know exactly how you feel (my #s were actually a bit lower than yours and I didn't really buy into the "holistic" admissions thing until I got the email from Dean Tom).

I'll leave the rooming questions as it's too complex to deal with in the time that I have. In short though, coming from LA, I'm guessing you won't have much sticker shock. It'll probably be a bit more expensive for what you get compared to LA-- but not by much.

As for the construction, the underlying primary purpose of the construction is to expand the stacks of the law library. However, everything adjacent to the construction area-- from classrooms, to study areas, to the new student center etc.-- are getting a nice upgrade. They finished the new first floor hallway and it is really nice. I don't have any classes in the new hall classrooms, but they look nice. If they're anything like the new-ish rooms that have been completed over the past few years, they'll be modern and comfortable.

Even the old big lecture hall classrooms are OK-- as long as it's not 80+ degrees outside. Even then, they bought a bunch of silent AC towers just in time for the last real heat wave to pass. So next year, you'll be OK.

For 2014, you'll be the first class in quite some time to arrive at Boalt without a major construction zone outside. I'm just glad I'm not in 2011: all of the construction hassles, all of the tuition hikes and almost no benefit of the new spaces. At least we'll get it next year!

Edit: http://www.law.berkeley.edu/building/masterPlan.html

[WonkyPanda]

Thanks for the feedback, rotor!


As someone who is interested in IP Law, is it futile to get into that field without some kind of engineering background or PhD in a chemical science? I've heard different things but it seems like you're doomed unless you have some type of background in those fields.

[gymboree]

As someone who is interested in IP Law, is it futile to get into that field without some kind of engineering background or PhD in a chemical science? I've heard different things but it seems like you're doomed unless you have some type of background in those fields.

you're not doomed... obviously you can't sit for the patent bar, so no patent prosecution for you. But there are IP practitioners on campus for panels, alumni mixers, etc., who tell us IP is absolutely possible without a science background; think litigation, copyright, etc.

[WonkyPanda]

As someone who is interested in IP Law, is it futile to get into that field without some kind of engineering background or PhD in a chemical science? I've heard different things but it seems like you're doomed unless you have some type of background in those fields.

you're not doomed... obviously you can't sit for the patent bar, so no patent prosecution for you. But there are IP practitioners on campus for panels, alumni mixers, etc., who tell us IP is absolutely possible without a science background; think litigation, copyright, etc.

Hmm, i guess I need to do more research then into the viability and career opportunity into those facets of IP law. Sigh, this stuff can get pretty stressful.


edit: Thanks btw for the insightful response! I definitely will have my hands full when it comes time to decide what road I want to take for law. If you don't mind me asking you or anyone else here, when and how did you guys come to the decision of what law you wanted to practice. I feel like I am getting undergrad anxiety again when I had absolutely no idea what I wanted to do.

[suspicious android]

I was pretty surprised to get the faculty review e-mail the other day, and I'll be shocked if I get in with my 3.3 gpa, but there's no place I'd rather live than N. California, so I'm excited to be in the running. Thanks to all the Berkeley students taking the time to answer questions in this thread!

Any of you feel like sharing your 1L or 2L summer plans? I know 1L SA's are practically non-existant, but what else do people typically do?

[Tangerine Gleam]

Any of you feel like sharing your 1L or 2L summer plans? I know 1L SA's are practically non-existant, but what else do people typically do?

They're rare, but not totally non-existant. A handful of people I know have been interviewing with big SF firms and a few have gigs lined up with firms in other cities. Public interest work is very popular for 1L summers...and I think upwards of 20% of the class usually does a judicial externship of some sort.

[gymboree]

A lot of people have their summer jobs lined up already - the early bird really does get the worm. Take that Dec. 1st date seriously. Quite a few of my friends (a lot actually) are doing judicial externships. Others are going to government - DA's offices, DOJ, federal courts, state attorney general's offices. I have some friends going to firms (some are in final stages for biglaw SA - but they're the Ph.D. and science types).

Those that don't have their job lined up yet seem to be targeting firms (and are still interviewing) or are doing public interest work (which hires much slower than judges/government). There's still plenty of time and lots of interviewing to be done.

[bilbobaggins]

A lot of people have their summer jobs lined up already - the early bird really does get the worm. Take that Dec. 1st date seriously. Quite a few of my friends (a lot actually) are doing judicial externships. Others are going to government - DA's offices, DOJ, federal courts, state attorney general's offices. I have some friends going to firms (some are in final stages for biglaw SA - but they're the Ph.D. and science types).

Those that don't have their job lined up yet seem to be targeting firms (and are still interviewing) or are doing public interest work (which hires much slower than judges/government). There's still plenty of time and lots of interviewing to be done.

Only do that if you want to clerk/work for DOJ. Almost everyone else moves slower and gets great summer jobs.

[clone22]

On a slightly related subject, does one have to be a US citizen to work for DOJ or any governmental position? (Including SA/DA offices)

[r6_philly]

...

I have a serious to death question. Does anyone know if bilbo is an actual Boalt student?