NYU 2L / Current NYC SA Taking ?? For a Bit Forum

[twistedwrister]

TLS FTW here. Thanks for taking the time to do this.

Shot in the dark: Have you met any of the Root-Tilden-Kern scholars? If so, what were they like? I'm curious to see just how out of my league I am in applying.

Sure. I'm friends with a few RTK scholars. Overall, they are what you would expect - smart, personable, and DEDICATED to doing PI work. If you want to check credentials, just take a look at their bios on NYU's website:

http://www.law.nyu.edu/publicinterestla ... /index.htm

[hopefullaw27]

Do you think incoming 1L's will face more favorable hiring during their OCI?

I think so, as long as firms don't overhire this year and next year. Summer classes are slightly bigger this year, and offer rates, at least so far, seem high. As I mentioned, my firm's NY office had a 100% offer rate this year (I'm not sure about the other offices). It's hard to predict too far out, though.

Thanks for the quick response! Incoming NYU 1L here and apprehensive about all the loans I'll be accruing.

[twistedwrister]

Do you think incoming 1L's will face more favorable hiring during their OCI?

I think so, as long as firms don't overhire this year and next year. Summer classes are slightly bigger this year, and offer rates, at least so far, seem high. As I mentioned, my firm's NY office had a 100% offer rate this year (I'm not sure about the other offices). It's hard to predict too far out, though.

Thanks for the quick response! Incoming NYU 1L here and apprehensive about all the loans I'll be accruing.

No problem! I know it's hard, but try not to worry too much about the legal hiring environment. You can't control that. NYU's places really well, no matter what you want to do (firm, government, PI, and recently clerkships). Focus on learning as much as you can, enjoying your classes and classmates, and doing well. Everything else will fall into place.

[twistedwrister]

I'll be around on-and-off today as well.

[270910]

I'll be around on-and-off today as well.

Can you talk about your decision making process - when and how you came to pick Your Firm as opposed to All Those Other Firms? Did you get particularly good/bad vibes from your screening interviews, or figure it out based on the atmosphere at the callback, or make a giant chart and add up values, or..?

[twistedwrister]

I'll be around on-and-off today as well.

Can you talk about your decision making process - when and how you came to pick Your Firm as opposed to All Those Other Firms? Did you get particularly good/bad vibes from your screening interviews, or figure it out based on the atmosphere at the callback, or make a giant chart and add up values, or..?

Sure. It was a combination of things. I knew I wanted to focus on a specific practice area (let's say appellate litigation), so I scheduled callbacks at firms with top appellate litigation practices. I went on somewhere between 8 and 12 callbacks. I certainly liked the "vibe"/"atmosphere" better at some firms than others, but that wasn't the deciding factor. I did eliminate one highly-ranked firm that was an early favorite of mine because I found the attorneys to be both arrogant and antisocial. After I got my offers, I created a spreadsheet with the firms and their relevant data (various rankings, PPP and RPL, layoffs (if any), offer rates, etc.). All this helped me to make a decision, but the deciding factor was a relationship I formed with a partner at my firm. He's a really influential partner at the firm (huge book of business, on the management committee, head of a practice group, etc.) and he offered to mentor me as a summer and later, as a full-time associate. If I came to the firm, I would be working directly with him. He's a great guy and I knew I would work well with him, so I jumped. I think I mentioned this in an earlier post, but a lot of your experience as a junior associate will depend on the small group of partners/senior associates in your group. If you build relationships with the right people and do good work, you won't find yourself stuck with bad projects (or worse, no projects at all). Still, it was hard because I had to turn down offers at many great firms that I really loved as well.

[UChicagoStudent]

(1) How hard was it for people at NYU with below average grades (top 2/3 through below median) to score a paid summer internship last year at OCI?
(2) What was the difference that separated the candidates that received good job offers from the ones who ended up without job offers; i.e: more personality, work experience, or just being a great interviewer?
(3) In your opinion, how would grades correlate with job offers. Assuming that 70% of students last year received offers, was it more that the top 70% of students received offers, or that kids throughout the grade spectrum ended up without jobs.

Thank a lot. Your answers have already been very substantial and helpful!!! Congratulations on the offer.

[twistedwrister]

(1) How hard was it for people at NYU with below average grades (top 2/3 through below median) to score a paid summer internship last year at OCI?
(2) What was the difference that separated the candidates that received good job offers from the ones who ended up without job offers; i.e: more personality, work experience, or just being a great interviewer?
(3) In your opinion, how would grades correlate with job offers. Assuming that 70% of students last year received offers, was it more that the top 70% of students received offers, or that kids throughout the grade spectrum ended up without jobs.

Thank a lot. Your answers have already been very substantial and helpful!!! Congratulations on the offer.

No prob, and thank you. I'm certainly happy about the offer. Overall, I think offer rates will be really high this year because the classes were so small. Since all your questions are related, I'll answer them together. For law firm hiring, grades are important, but not on the margins. In other words, some % of the class (at NYU, I'm guessing top 1/4 to top 1/3) will end up with biglaw job offers because of their grades alone. Even if they have no work experience, a bad personality, etc., some firm will give them an offer because they go to NYU and have good grades. At the other extreme, some % of the class (I'm guessing the bottom 10% or so) will have a really tough time getting a biglaw gig even if they have great work experience and interview really well. ITE, their grades just won't make the cut unless they won a Nobel Prize or something. HOWEVER, in the middle, grades don't matter much. In other words, firms don't generally care if you are top 40% or top 60% -- your grades are OK but not great. In this middling range, you have to have something that makes you stand out (be a great interviewer, have good work experience, have a demonstrated interest in a particular practice group, won an award of some sort, etc.)

[cosmopolitan]

Thanks for doing this!
Are most 1Ls on some sort of meal plan? How does that work?

[twistedwrister]

Thanks for doing this!
Are most 1Ls on some sort of meal plan? How does that work?

No problem! To be honest, I'm not sure NYU Law even has a "meal plan." Maybe it does, but I don't know about it. There is a lounge on the second floor of Vanderbilt hall that serves food. The typical meal plan at NYU involves eating at all the great restaurants/bars in the Village.

[twistedwrister]

I'm around for a bit today as well.

[romothesavior]

You keep mentioning work experience. How important do you think it is to have prior work experience?

[twistedwrister]

You keep mentioning work experience. How important do you think it is to have prior work experience?

Depends on your situation. If you have great grades, I don't think WE matters much. There are some exceptions. WLRK comes to mind, since I've heard they prefer people with finance WE/background. Also, WE probably matters more in some practice areas than in others. For example, a lot of IP firms/groups prefer to hire people who have industry experience. If you have average grades, I think WE can be a significant bump, particularly if you can tie your WE to why you would be a good lawyer, or why you are interested in a particular practice group. Of course, the kind of WE matters as well. No one cares about your summer job mowing lawns or bussing tables (not that there is anything wrong with that -- I've waited tables in my day, but you get my point).

[romothesavior]

You keep mentioning work experience. How important do you think it is to have prior work experience?

Depends on your situation. If you have great grades, I don't think WE matters much. There are some exceptions. WLRK comes to mind, since I've heard they prefer people with finance WE/background. Also, WE probably matters more in some practice areas than in others. For example, a lot of IP firms/groups prefer to hire people who have industry experience. If you have average grades, I think WE can be a significant bump, particularly if you can tie your WE to why you would be a good lawyer, or why you are interested in a particular practice group. Of course, the kind of WE matters as well. No one cares about your summer job mowing lawns or bussing tables (not that there is anything wrong with that -- I've waited tables in my day, but you get my point).

Okay, good to hear... That's about what I had figured (great to have for certain fields and a good bump for people with average grades), but you have mentioned it multiple times so I didn't know if I was underestimating the importance of if.

Thanks for this thread, it is very informative for the people with biglaw chances (aka not romothesavior ). Congrats and good luck to you in your career.

[twistedwrister]

No problem. Why don't you think you have a chance at biglaw (assuming you want it)?

[romothesavior]

No problem. Why don't you think you have a chance at biglaw (assuming you want it)?

It may just be the fear of starting LS talking, but I have no WE, I'm going to a non-T14, and I have no reason to feel like my grades will be any better (or worse) than my peers.

Perhaps this is just false modesty too, I dunno. I have a tendency to underestimate my own abilities.

Anyways, good luck! Sounds like your career is off to a great start.

[twistedwrister]

Yep, I know the feeling. Thanks for your well wishes, and good luck to you as well.

[thisamericanlife]

since you say your relationship with the partner tipped your decision, could you elaborate how you made this relationship. was it over the summer? did the partner interview you? did the partner recruit you? Is it possible to join a partner with whom you didn't work over the summer, like find a better partner and join him/her?

[twistedwrister]

since you say your relationship with the partner tipped your decision, could you elaborate how you made this relationship. was it over the summer? did the partner interview you? did the partner recruit you? Is it possible to join a partner with whom you didn't work over the summer, like find a better partner and join him/her?

Sure. After my screening interview, the interviewer calls this partner (his boss) and says something like "you should meet this person we just interviewed, she'd be really good for our group, etc." The partner gives me a call and we set-up a time to meet for lunch. We go to lunch, shoot the breeze, have a great time, etc. Even though I didn't even have an offer from the firm at the time, we stayed in touch (mostly via e-mail) throughout the recruiting season. During the summer, I worked directly with him quite a bit. I also worked with a bunch of other partners in the practice group.

As far as finding a "better partner" who you didn't work with over the summer, I'm sure it can be done. Most people work with a bunch of different partners, depending on the workflow. The best way to get work from partners is to do good work. Partners want to work with the "best" associates, so you have to prove yourself, even over the summer.