UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

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Dr. Strangelove
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby Dr. Strangelove » Thu May 06, 2010 12:43 am

I attended a high school where the lacrosse program was very strong.. many of the lax players in my school had legitimate reasons to feel entitled because they were treated in such a way by those around them (on the other hand.. it could just be due to perceived manliness rather than the sport itself). I guess it's similar at other schools...

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quickquestionthanks
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby quickquestionthanks » Thu May 06, 2010 12:44 am

Can we please change the subject to how we need to execute people who bludgeon other people to death?

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seespotrun
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby seespotrun » Thu May 06, 2010 12:48 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:Can we please change the subject to how we need to execute people who bludgeon other people to death?


Ugh.

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quickquestionthanks
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby quickquestionthanks » Thu May 06, 2010 1:06 am

seespotrun wrote:
quickquestionthanks wrote:Can we please change the subject to how we need to execute people who bludgeon other people to death?


Ugh.


It's called just desserts.

Little known fact: the "eye for an eye" phrase begins, "Have no pity: life for a life, eye for an eye..."

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seespotrun
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby seespotrun » Thu May 06, 2010 1:09 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:
seespotrun wrote:
quickquestionthanks wrote:Can we please change the subject to how we need to execute people who bludgeon other people to death?


Ugh.


It's called just desserts.

Little known fact: the "eye for an eye" phrase begins, "Have no pity: life for a life, eye for an eye..."


Looking to the Old Testament in forming public policy is full of fail.

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quickquestionthanks
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby quickquestionthanks » Thu May 06, 2010 1:11 am

seespotrun wrote:
quickquestionthanks wrote:
seespotrun wrote:
quickquestionthanks wrote:Can we please change the subject to how we need to execute people who bludgeon other people to death?


Ugh.


It's called just desserts.

Little known fact: the "eye for an eye" phrase begins, "Have no pity: life for a life, eye for an eye..."


Looking to the Old Testament in forming public policy is full of fail.


Inability to even attempt a counter argument as to why we shouldn't execute those who viciously murder others is full of fail.

Tautology
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby Tautology » Thu May 06, 2010 1:14 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:Inability to even attempt a counter argument as to why we shouldn't execute those who viciously murder others is full of fail.


It doesn't decrease crime rates and sometimes people are wrongly convicted. Your desire for revenge is not sufficient reason to risk killing an innocent person.

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romothesavior
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby romothesavior » Thu May 06, 2010 1:14 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:Can we please change the subject to how we need to execute people who bludgeon other people to death?


First of all, this is not the thread for a controversial political debate.

Second of all, there are plenty of reasons for why capital punishment is a bad idea (both ethically and practically).

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quickquestionthanks
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby quickquestionthanks » Thu May 06, 2010 1:27 am

Tautology wrote:
quickquestionthanks wrote:Inability to even attempt a counter argument as to why we shouldn't execute those who viciously murder others is full of fail.


It doesn't decrease crime rates and sometimes people are wrongly convicted. Your desire for revenge is not sufficient reason to risk killing an innocent person.


It's not revenge, it's punishment. See: just desserts. Whether it decreases crime rates is irrelevant (although you can spin the data either way, it is very hard to tease out those effects).

People are sometimes wrongly convicted, which is why we have an appeals system and an incredibly high burden of proof. The vast majority of those 'exonerated on death row' mistakes were made before the use of DNA and forensic evidence.

romothesavior wrote:
quickquestionthanks wrote:Can we please change the subject to how we need to execute people who bludgeon other people to death?


this is not the thread for a controversial political debate.


I think it's the perfect thread and the only proper discussion to be having at a time like this. An innocent life was taken in an unspeakable, heinous act. This man, if found guilty, should die by the hands of the law for what he did.

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seespotrun
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby seespotrun » Thu May 06, 2010 1:31 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:
seespotrun wrote:
quickquestionthanks wrote:
It's called just desserts.

Little known fact: the "eye for an eye" phrase begins, "Have no pity: life for a life, eye for an eye..."


Looking to the Old Testament in forming public policy is full of fail.


Inability to even attempt a counter argument as to why we shouldn't execute those who viciously murder others is full of fail.


It's more costly to the state, on average, to execute someone than it is to imprison him for life. Those who viciously kill others are not likely to be further deterred from viciously killing someone than they would be if threatened with a life sentence. Incapacitation is wash vs. life sentences. The only benefit resulting from killing killers is the sick satisfaction of equity in punishment. It's a shame that this type of satisfaction is something that US citizens need.

But what romo said: this is not the place. Start a new thread if you'd like.

Tautology
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby Tautology » Thu May 06, 2010 1:36 am

seespotrun wrote:It's more costly to the state, on average, to execute someone than it is to imprison him for life. Those who viciously kill others are not likely to be further deterred from viciously killing someone than they would be if threatened with a life sentence. Incapacitation is wash vs. life sentences. The only benefit resulting from killing killers is the sick satisfaction of equity in punishment. It's a shame that this type of satisfaction is something that US citizens need.

But what romo said: this is not the place. Start a new thread if you'd like.


Could you please try to be a little more hypocritical?

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kenson
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby kenson » Thu May 06, 2010 1:43 am

What the fuck is with people ITT making jokes about this girl? Seriously, I hope to god you don't act like that off the internet.

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quickquestionthanks
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby quickquestionthanks » Thu May 06, 2010 1:46 am

seespotrun wrote:It's more costly to the state, on average, to execute someone than it is to imprison him for life. Those who viciously kill others are not likely to be further deterred from viciously killing someone than they would be if threatened with a life sentence. Incapacitation is wash vs. life sentences. The only benefit resulting from killing killers is the sick satisfaction of equity in punishment. It's a shame that this type of satisfaction is something that US citizens need.

But what romo said: this is not the place. Start a new thread if you'd like.


You made the following arguments:

Cost
-Of all things for the government to splurge on, justice is one of them. What a ridiculous statement.

Deterrence
-Again, punishment for the sake of deterrence is only one purpose, they also need to pay from their crimes

Sick Satisfaction?
-There's nothing sick about wanting to see justice served. why should this man be allowed to live while the woman he brutally murdered does not? why should he ever get to see his family again? He will spend his life watching TV, playing cards and shooting hoops. Being okay with that, now that is sick.

Feel free to ignore me. I'm sorry you find the topic of death uncomfortable, but I still can't find any reason why talking about what society ought to be doing to perpetrators like this is inappropriate. I believe it is highly appropriate, and I'll let the moderators decide that.

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quickquestionthanks
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby quickquestionthanks » Thu May 06, 2010 1:47 am

kenson wrote:What the fuck is with people ITT making jokes about this girl? Seriously, I hope to god you don't act like that off the internet.


anonymity brings out the worst in people, it is reprehensible and pathetic

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Kchuck
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby Kchuck » Thu May 06, 2010 1:53 am

romothesavior wrote:First of all, this is not the thread for a controversial political debate.


Where is?

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby vanwinkle » Thu May 06, 2010 1:55 am

Kchuck wrote:
romothesavior wrote:First of all, this is not the thread for a controversial political debate.

Where is?

Anywhere you want to start one, that isn't about someone dying.

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quickquestionthanks
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby quickquestionthanks » Thu May 06, 2010 1:58 am

vanwinkle wrote:
Kchuck wrote:
romothesavior wrote:First of all, this is not the thread for a controversial political debate.

Where is?

Anywhere you want to start one, that isn't about someone dying.



Race debate? Inappropriate.

Capital punishment debate in thread about a capital crime? On a law school message board? I'm still scratching my head here...

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seespotrun
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby seespotrun » Thu May 06, 2010 2:06 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:
seespotrun wrote:It's more costly to the state, on average, to execute someone than it is to imprison him for life. Those who viciously kill others are not likely to be further deterred from viciously killing someone than they would be if threatened with a life sentence. Incapacitation is wash vs. life sentences. The only benefit resulting from killing killers is the sick satisfaction of equity in punishment. It's a shame that this type of satisfaction is something that US citizens need.

But what romo said: this is not the place. Start a new thread if you'd like.


[strike]You made the following arguments:

Cost
-Of all things for the government to splurge on, justice is one of them. What a ridiculous statement.

Deterrence
-Again, punishment for the sake of deterrence is only one purpose, they also need to pay from their crimes

Sick Satisfaction?
-There's nothing sick about wanting to see justice served. why should this man be allowed to live while the woman he brutally murdered does not? why should he ever get to see his family again? He will spend his life watching TV, playing cards and shooting hoops. Being okay with that, now that is sick.[/strike]

Feel free to ignore me. [strike]I'm sorry you find the topic of death uncomfortable, but I still can't find any reason why talking about what society ought to be doing to perpetrators like this is inappropriate. I believe it is highly appropriate, and I'll let the moderators decide that.[/strike]

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby vanwinkle » Thu May 06, 2010 2:07 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:Capital punishment debate in thread about a capital crime? On a law school message board? I'm still scratching my head here...

And that is sad.

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jayn3
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby jayn3 » Thu May 06, 2010 2:13 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:I'm sorry you find the topic of death uncomfortable, but I still can't find any reason why talking about what society ought to be doing to perpetrators like this is inappropriate. I believe it is highly appropriate, and I'll let the moderators decide that.


this in and of itself is a reason to choose another forum to discuss your political views. there are a few basic concepts of social interaction most people know, and they are called tact, respect, and graciousness. whether or not you are comfortable discussing a given topic in a given place does not mean everyone else will be. the other party in your conversation has the right to request a more appropriate forum of discussion.

now, please understand: what is at issue is not the topic of death, nor is it capital punishment. if you wish to discuss these subjects, go somewhere else. people will follow.

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quickquestionthanks
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby quickquestionthanks » Thu May 06, 2010 2:24 am

You guys are a bunch of cowards, hanging out on the Internet reading about a person's murder and then when someone wants to talk about the appropriate legal ramifications, you claim I'm offending your sensibilities.

God forbid, if someone willingly takes the life of one of my family members, the first thing on my mind will be killing that person. I'll have the rest of my life to grieve. May this circumstance never befall you and yours.

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby vanwinkle » Thu May 06, 2010 2:28 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:You guys are a bunch of cowards, hanging out on the Internet reading about a person's murder and then when someone wants to talk about the appropriate legal ramifications, you claim I'm offending your sensibilities.

You weren't talking about the legal ramifications, you were talking about a moral desire for justice and/or revenge. Also, you framed it in a very broad and general sense, not about this case, but about a need for capital punishment in general.

Don't be such an idiot. You knew what you were doing was a lot more than just "discussing the legal ramifications".

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superserial
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby superserial » Thu May 06, 2010 2:30 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:
It's called just desserts.


Image?

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romothesavior
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby romothesavior » Thu May 06, 2010 2:33 am

quickquestionthanks wrote:You guys are a bunch of cowards, hanging out on the Internet reading about a person's murder and then when someone wants to talk about the appropriate legal ramifications, you claim I'm offending your sensibilities.

God forbid, if someone willingly takes the life of one of my family members, the first thing on my mind will be killing that person. I'll have the rest of my life to grieve. May this circumstance never befall you and yours.


Dood... I can't stand you.

And yeah, the impulse for revenge would likely be present if someone murdered a family member. But that impulse is not a sound policy argument in favor of capital punishment.

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jayn3
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Re: UVa students, what's the scene after this murder report?

Postby jayn3 » Thu May 06, 2010 2:36 am

romothesavior wrote:
quickquestionthanks wrote:You guys are a bunch of cowards, hanging out on the Internet reading about a person's murder and then when someone wants to talk about the appropriate legal ramifications, you claim I'm offending your sensibilities.

God forbid, if someone willingly takes the life of one of my family members, the first thing on my mind will be killing that person. I'll have the rest of my life to grieve. May this circumstance never befall you and yours.


Dood... I can't stand you.

And yeah, the impulse for revenge would likely be present if someone murdered a family member. But that impulse is not a sound policy argument in favor of capital punishment.


nor does it make your calling people in this forum cowards any more reasonable than juvenile name-calling.




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