Chicago 2L Takings ?s

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d34d9823
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby d34d9823 » Thu Aug 05, 2010 11:35 am

Now that I have you all here, what school did you choose Chicago over?

UChicagoStudent
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby UChicagoStudent » Thu Aug 05, 2010 11:50 am

d34dluk3 wrote:Now that I have you all here, what school did you choose Chicago over?


T10 minus HYS (didn't get accepted). Notably Michigan, Northwestern, NYU. Turned down larger scholarships at those schools for Chicago.

Also, the curve kind of sucks, and increases the pressure your 1L year dramatically. We have to fight for top grades, and can lead to a very stressful atmosphere. On the other hand, that's probably one of the reasons that UofC grads are in such demand. The type of "brand name" affiliated with U of C grads is that we are better trained and harder working than most of the grads from other law schools, and a lot of that has to do with the competition which is fostered by the curve (although we are still thought of as a bit 'nerdy' by our peers, rightfully so I guess). The fact is that 3 years at UofC will make you a better lawyer than at arguably any other school, but it's not an easy 3 years.

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remotelyfeasible
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby remotelyfeasible » Thu Aug 05, 2010 1:44 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:Also, why do people insist that the 2L/3L classes are easier? They're not. The large classes are on exactly the same curve as the 1L classes, and the seminar professors don't just hand out straight 180+s (in fact, with the exception of evidence, my lowest grades are from classes off the curve). Further, the 2L/3L classes are significantly more difficult as far as subject matter goes. Fed. Reg of Securities/Bankruptcy/Secured Transactions/Fed Jur vs. Civ Pro or Torts? Seriously?


I don't think anyone claims the subject matter is easier. However, classes below a certain number of students (50?) are not graded on a forced curve, and this will tend to inflate grades a bit. Further, many seminars are graded pretty easy. For the most part, any seminar you write a substantial paper in is a guaranteed A, if you put in a decent amount of work. This is more true of some professors than others, but it still inflates GPA's.

My graduating GPA was higher than my 1L GPA. This is also true for about 80% of my friends. (Certainly a non-scientific sample.)

Also, Civ Pro was more difficult than Fed Jur, in my opinion. Civ Pro was completely alien at first. Fed Jur was just reading some section 1983 cases about bad Chicago cops and Younger v. Harris.

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remotelyfeasible
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby remotelyfeasible » Thu Aug 05, 2010 1:48 pm

UChicagoStudent wrote:That seems more reasonable, but I remember hearing about that memo that remotelyfeaslible alluded to, that says that 19% get an A. I think that requirement may be only for visiting professors. I also believe that memo is ~5 years old.

I think that the current curve is that the number of 180+'s has to equal the number of 173-'s. (I would like to see some official school memo on this as well) I heard Dixon only gives out 2 A's and 2 C's in 1L Elements (can someone verify this). Most professors probably do not want to give too many C's. Each professor has his or her own grading scale, but I assume that the mean is actually closer to 177 for 1L year than we would think. I think what primarily changes is how tight the bell curve is around the 177 average.

Does anyone have any evidence as to why professors would give more 178's+179's instead of more 174's - 176's (besides the visiting faculty memo)?


The memo is from 2006, written to professors visiting in Fall 2006, yes. However, there is no reason to think the grading scale has changed. The "number of A's approximately equals the number of C's" bit on your transcript was there in 2006 identical to today, so it isn't as if the memo was written prior to the current scale.

There are definitely some variations in grading, though. Most professors will tend to give out a couple more A's than C's in any given class. (There are a couple notable exceptions to this, who give out more C's than A's.)

Not sure what sort of evidence you could possibly hope to see that suggests there are more 174-176's than 178-179's, or vice versa.

UChicagoStudent
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby UChicagoStudent » Thu Aug 05, 2010 1:55 pm

I guess the moral of the story is that just because professors will have the option of giving students better grades, does not necessarily mean that they will give out the higher grades. i.e: professors won't necessarily give out more 178-79's than 74-76's, and classes that do not require a curve will not necessarily be graded any easier than classes with mandatory curves.

That being said, I'd assume that many seminar professors will likely be more lenient on their students than they would be if there was a required curve.

After all that, I'm still just as confused about where I stand in regard to the rest of the class.

marburger06
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby marburger06 » Thu Aug 05, 2010 6:11 pm

UChicagoStudent wrote:I guess the moral of the story is that just because professors will have the option of giving students better grades, does not necessarily mean that they will give out the higher grades. i.e: professors won't necessarily give out more 178-79's than 74-76's, and classes that do not require a curve will not necessarily be graded any easier than classes with mandatory curves.

That being said, I'd assume that many seminar professors will likely be more lenient on their students than they would be if there was a required curve.

After all that, I'm still just as confused about where I stand in regard to the rest of the class.


and the employers will be too. so in the end, it really doesn't matter what your exact rank is. employers look at whether you are above or below or at 177, and judge you from there; do you really think they have time to sit around and speculate about what the 50% mark "actually" is?

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remotelyfeasible
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby remotelyfeasible » Thu Aug 05, 2010 8:03 pm

marburger06 wrote:and the employers will be too. so in the end, it really doesn't matter what your exact rank is. employers look at whether you are above or below or at 177, and judge you from there; do you really think they have time to sit around and speculate about what the 50% mark "actually" is?

Well, what GPA employers look for will vary from year-to-year and firm-to-firm. But, certainly, employers are not sitting around trying to figure out if someone with a 177 is median or merely top 55%.

Actually, if you don't list your GPA on your resume (I have no idea if you're supposed to list this or not), employers won't know your exact GPA anyway. I really doubt they're putting all your grades into Excel to try to figure out if you have a 177.2 or a 177.4. They'll just eyeball it.

Well, that last bit is true until you graduate at least. My GPA appears on my final transcript.

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quetzalcoatl
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby quetzalcoatl » Thu Aug 05, 2010 8:40 pm

So will Epstein be gone for good in the Fall?

iwantawhiteiphone4
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby iwantawhiteiphone4 » Thu Aug 05, 2010 9:04 pm

quetzalcoatl wrote:So will Epstein be gone for good in the Fall?


Nope. He'll do the same thing he's done the last five or so years: teach at NYU in the fall and Chicago in the spring. The only things changing are his job titles. He was a full prof at Chicago and a visiting prof at NYU, and now he'll be a full prof at NYU and a visiting prof at Chicago. As I understand it, he's making the change because full prof at NYU = apartment in NYC (where at least one of his kids is). Rumor is he'll teach a section of civpro in the spring.

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Hamilton
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby Hamilton » Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:07 pm

So I'll be living up in the south loop, and have been trying to research the best way to get to campus and back. Some things I read say not to use public transportation from hyde park to the city after dark because it's either not all that safe going to the city from hyde park on public transit, or just hard to find because bus/train schedules are being cut back. One other source said it's best to drive, and street parking is available until about 8am, when it all fills up. Can I really get street parking near the law school?

Can anyone offer any advice?

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lilybbloom
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby lilybbloom » Thu Aug 19, 2010 4:18 pm

you can park near the law school if you get there by 8 am- after then, it's trickier but not impossible.

i have no qualms about taking the CTA buses in/out of Hyde Park at night (the 6, the 28, the 2, etc). I would not recommend taking the el (train), though. The metra is okay, and depending on where you live in the south loop, could be convenient.

rsg87
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby rsg87 » Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:32 pm

Hamilton wrote:So I'll be living up in the south loop, and have been trying to research the best way to get to campus and back. Some things I read say not to use public transportation from hyde park to the city after dark because it's either not all that safe going to the city from hyde park on public transit, or just hard to find because bus/train schedules are being cut back. One other source said it's best to drive, and street parking is available until about 8am, when it all fills up. Can I really get street parking near the law school?

Can anyone offer any advice?



I took the Metra home from Millennium Park Station to Hyde Park at 1130 the other night. It didn't seem sketchy or anything.

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hiromoto45
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby hiromoto45 » Mon Aug 23, 2010 2:40 pm

Where do you guys buy most of your books? Do we need new books or is it fine to buy used from Greenbooks?

scat_cat
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby scat_cat » Mon Aug 23, 2010 3:21 pm

Hamilton wrote:So I'll be living up in the south loop, and have been trying to research the best way to get to campus and back. Some things I read say not to use public transportation from hyde park to the city after dark because it's either not all that safe going to the city from hyde park on public transit, or just hard to find because bus/train schedules are being cut back. One other source said it's best to drive, and street parking is available until about 8am, when it all fills up. Can I really get street parking near the law school?

Can anyone offer any advice?


Most people who live in the South Loop seem to use public transportation--being close to the law school is the only reason to live in such a weird neighborhood, in my opinion. But the # 2 bus stops running early--I think the last bus is just before 6 pm. So after 6 pm, you'd have to either take the Metra (60th St can be kind of sketchy, but 57th is OK if you're willing to walk that far), walk to the # 6 bus stop at 60th (also mildly sketchy, but I do it from time to time and I'm a tiny girl), or take one of the school shuttles to a safer 6 stop. (These also stop running stupidly early.) In any case, you don't really need to be at school after 6 pm if you're a 1L, and I assume you don't want to compete for car slots at 8 am, so I'd at least try doing the # 2 at first (http://www.transitchicago.com/riding_ct ... outeId=159).

scat_cat
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby scat_cat » Mon Aug 23, 2010 3:34 pm

hiromoto45 wrote:Where do you guys buy most of your books? Do we need new books or is it fine to buy used from Greenbooks?


Greenbooks is kind of inconvenient so I usually just go there for supplements. Whether you can tolerate other people's stupid notes/highlighting is something you can't really tell at this point. Amazon is great if the books are announced far enough in advance; that's where I get most of my books. Sign up for Amazon Student and then Amazon Prime and you may never have to pay for 2-day shipping.

1Ls: You want to buy my Chirelstein contracts supplement? Brand new, pristine condition, sells for $43 on Amazon (but is currently backordered); I'll sell it to you for $30. Essential for Omri and probably good for baby Posner too. PM if you're interested.

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ellewoods110
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby ellewoods110 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 10:49 am

Do you happen to know/remember when we get our schedules and book lists? I would like to be able to order my books on amazon or buy them from other students (like scat_cat's Chirelstein contracts supplement).

marburger06
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby marburger06 » Tue Aug 24, 2010 8:47 pm

ellewoods110 wrote:Do you happen to know/remember when we get our schedules and book lists? I would like to be able to order my books on amazon or buy them from other students (like scat_cat's Chirelstein contracts supplement).


Wouldn't we all. Unfortunately you don't get it till right before Orientation. However, you can sign up for Amazon Prime student and get free 2-day shipping, and for your first assignment just use the books on reserve the library (yes, this does mean that you would have to do your first assignment at the law school and not be able to highlight).

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funkyturds
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby funkyturds » Mon Sep 06, 2010 12:53 am

Can someone tell me about how many outlets there are in a classroom? My macbook battery runs out in an hour and I'd like to know if I need to order a new one before school starts. Thanks.

pehaigllleises
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby pehaigllleises » Mon Sep 06, 2010 8:49 am

One per person. You're fine.

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funkyturds
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby funkyturds » Mon Sep 06, 2010 2:08 pm

pehaigllleises wrote:One per person. You're fine.



groovy. just what i wanted to hear. thanks.

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Hannibal
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby Hannibal » Sun Sep 19, 2010 2:25 pm

Posting this everywhere, sorry:

Has anyone in here who is living in Chicago visited/lived in San Francisco? If someone could live in San Francisco could they handle the big city-ness of Chicago?

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TaipeiMort
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby TaipeiMort » Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:04 pm

Hannibal wrote:Posting this everywhere, sorry:

Has anyone in here who is living in Chicago visited/lived in San Francisco? If someone could live in San Francisco could they handle the big city-ness of Chicago?


I lived in San Fran for ten years. Id have to say Chicago gives me more of a San Francisco feel than anywhere else I've lived/been to. Its probably the lake and general mix of architecture. The major differences I've seen so far is that Chicago has a black middle class (which Oakland lacks) and less gay and Asian people and gross pizza. I also haven't lived here during the winter yet.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:24 pm

TaipeiMort wrote:The major differences I've seen so far is that Chicago has . . . gross pizza.


... DIAF. Chicago pizza > whatever the hell you coasties eat. Tofu california roll pizza with fat-free cheese and sugar-free sauce probably.

TaipeiMort wrote: I also haven't lived here during the winter yet.


Lawl. Yes, that would be the primary difference.

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clintonius
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby clintonius » Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:33 pm

Anybody had Epstein for contracts? Looking for a life preserver here...
Last edited by clintonius on Sun Sep 19, 2010 7:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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johnstuartmill
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Re: Chicago 2L Takings ?s

Postby johnstuartmill » Sun Sep 19, 2010 6:50 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:Chicago pizza > whatever the hell you coasties eat. Tofu california roll pizza with fat-free cheese and sugar-free sauce probably.

Stop it, man -- I'm getting all nostalgic!




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