University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

A forum for applicants and admitted students to ask law students and graduates about law school and the practice of law.
travvo
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Joined: Thu May 08, 2008 2:54 pm

Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby travvo » Fri Jun 06, 2008 10:35 pm

Not like hate you because your right, hate you because not only are you wrong, but you are a class "A" delusional douche bag. Whatever object you have rammed firmly up your ass is starting to infiltrate your few brain cells and make you loopy.

tequilasunriseplz
Posts: 33
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 2:45 pm

Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby tequilasunriseplz » Sat Jun 07, 2008 2:59 pm

Random question, completely off the topic of umm...hate, but does anyone have an idea of how large a day section is? I know that we are broken up into sections, but that is about it. Do the sections intermingle w. other sections or do they usually all stick together? I'm curious if ppl from other sections are able to study together (same or different profs, tests, reading assignments)?

antsinmypants
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby antsinmypants » Sat Jun 07, 2008 3:22 pm

Trav- Don't let this twink get under your skin. Stirring up s*** is his thing. Read any of his gazillion posts. He obviously has nothing better to do than to spend his free time on TLS making drama.

Tequila- I think the section numbers are around 70, and I think the sections stay the same, so getting to know others outside of your section is a bit more difficult to do, but it can be done!

sands24
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Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2008 6:11 pm

Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby sands24 » Sat Jun 07, 2008 6:36 pm

Hey everyone - just found this website, and i'm looking forward to attending McGeorge in the fall! Little nervous about being over 2700 miles from my friends and family (originally from Long Island, and attended Univ. of Maryland for undergrad), but i'm excited to meet new people (especially on the rafting trip!).

Is anyone out there still looking for roommates or what not? Coming from the East Coast and not knowing ANYONE, I'm having a little bit of a difficult time.

For those that are living already in the Sacramento area, do you know of any good hiking trails in the nearby area? I'm quite addicted to the outdoors (esp. as a stress reliever), but I don't know places out on the West Coast!

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Ipsa Dixit
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby Ipsa Dixit » Sat Jun 07, 2008 9:23 pm

tequilasunriseplz wrote:Random question, completely off the topic of umm...hate, but does anyone have an idea of how large a day section is? I know that we are broken up into sections, but that is about it. Do the sections intermingle w. other sections or do they usually all stick together? I'm curious if ppl from other sections are able to study together (same or different profs, tests, reading assignments)?


It's probably around 80 students per section. Any one class may be larger though because there may be transfer students in a class, students making up a class, or evening students that may be enrolled in a day division class. The sections are split up into smaller pieces for Legal Process class and perhaps one substantive class (my section was split in half for Contracts, and I think the other sections were split for Torts.)

I knew some people in other sections and there's intermingling of sections at events like the raft race in the fall (this is different than the trip in the summer) and meeting up at bars. However, I socialized most with people from my own section. I haven't studied with people from other sections, but I have gotten notes from them and asked them some questions when I could use an alternative perspective (like when I don't know what my professor was talking about and neither does anyone else!) If you had the same professor and syllabus as someone from another section, then it might make some sense to study assignments and exams together.

tequilasunriseplz
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby tequilasunriseplz » Sun Jun 08, 2008 1:11 pm

Welcome sands!

I am so there if you want to do some hiking. :D There are so many hiking trails that even if you never touched your law books and went hiking instead, you still wouldn't see them all. Many of them are around where we are going to go rafting. If you want to be really crazy there is also the Pacific Crest Trail. The West Coast version of the Appalachian Trail.

Sadly, I doubt I'll have the luxury of getting out too often. I'm ready to accept becoming a gym rat. (Ispa and Ants--thanks for answering my other question. Maybe you could help with me next one.) Have you seen the McGeorge workout room? What do you think--should I just get a gym membership?

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james4zero8
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby james4zero8 » Sun Jun 08, 2008 1:50 pm

tequilasunriseplz wrote:Sadly, I doubt I'll have the luxury of getting out too often. I'm ready to accept becoming a gym rat. (Ispa and Ants--thanks for answering my other question. Maybe you could help with me next one.) Have you seen the McGeorge workout room? What do you think--should I just get a gym membership?


Well, I am not Ispa nor Ants, however I did recently checked out the workout room at McGeorge. My initial thought was that, it is pretty small. However, after walking around the gym and checking out the weights, it has all the essential for you to get your daily workout, and then more. I, too, am looking to be a "gym rat", firstly to take the stress out of the daily life at law school, and secondly to not turn into a fat ass :lol:

I wouldn't waste my money buying a gym membership, as you have everything you'll need at McGeorge's gym. If anyone is down to have a lifting partner, hit me up! I am looking to pack on some serious muscles while in law school :D

sands24
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby sands24 » Sun Jun 08, 2008 6:27 pm

tequilasunriseplz wrote:Welcome sands!

I am so there if you want to do some hiking. :D There are so many hiking trails that even if you never touched your law books and went hiking instead, you still wouldn't see them all. Many of them are around where we are going to go rafting. If you want to be really crazy there is also the Pacific Crest Trail. The West Coast version of the Appalachian Trail.

Sadly, I doubt I'll have the luxury of getting out too often. I'm ready to accept becoming a gym rat. (Ispa and Ants--thanks for answering my other question. Maybe you could help with me next one.) Have you seen the McGeorge workout room? What do you think--should I just get a gym membership?


I agree that I don't think it'll be possible to go hiking a lot with law school and what not, but it's SO good to know there are options out there! I've hiked so much in Shenandoah (VA), plenty of places on the Appalachian Trail, and climbed Mount Washington in NH this past winter. I was actually supposed to go hiking today, except its hot, hazy, and humid here in the DC area (yuck).

I guess i'll have to settle for the gym until then!! I'm quite excited for the rafting trip, along with coming out there! I'm possibly thinking of coming to visit again sometime in the beginning of July, but I'm a bit nervous about $$ - can anyone recommend a cheap, yet acceptable hotel in the Sac area?

francobobfranco
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby francobobfranco » Sun Jun 08, 2008 6:57 pm

What are some fitness centers in the area? In addition, i'm wondering where you guys are planning on living in the surrounding areas.

PatentX
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby PatentX » Sun Jun 08, 2008 8:00 pm

I almost forgot how exciting the start of law school can be. Very refreshing to see all the comments. Save some of these comments and look back at it after the 1st year to see how much the study of law changes you
:)

*DISCLOSURE*
Before I give some advice let me advertise my rental

I just graduated in May and have a 2 bed 2 bath apartment in a gated community in the Arden area available if people are still looking for housing. I have posted it with McGeorge housing, you can also contact me via my profile.

*Now for some useful information*

As for what to expect I will give you the scare lecture:

1st year is more demanding than anything you have probably experienced in your academic career. There is an adjustment period and it is steep. Here are some of the things you will have to adjust to:

-Socratic method
AKA being on the "hot" seat. You will be singled out for discussion and no matter what you say it will be wrong. You will continue to be grilled to force you to think and your previous answers will be turned against you to show you why you are wrong. Everyone dreads it but with experience you will be fine. The key is to PREPARE and keep your cool. The second best advice is be honest if you aren't prepared. BS will not help, it will just annoy your professor and waste everyone's time. If you want a sneak preview of this concept rent The Paper Chase. It won't be as severe but there will be similarities.

-Prepare for non-stop study 6 days a week
You will understand after you get your syllabus and start studying. It always takes longer than you expect. Use Saturday or Sunday to rest and regain your sanity. Some people are brilliant and will get things the first time around but most will require 2 or 3 readings to actually "get" it. As a 1st year you have to learn how law school works. My background was computer engineering. I went in believing everything had a correct answer and a wrong answer. Law school is more about analysis and HOW you reached your answer rather than the final answer. If you are like me expect to see "too conclusory" on your first exams.

-Reading cases
Most people have never read a legal case as a HW assignment. You will have no idea what you are looking for and no idea what legal concepts and rules you should be identifying. This is part of the learning curve.

-Keep your confidence up
Some people find the adjustment easy while others will struggle. Some people will act cocky and "think" they get it only to face reality after exams. You get ZERO indication of your progress during the semester. Your final grade is based on a final exam. There are no mid-terms, quizzes, or HW to keep your grade up. Some professors mention "participation" but don't count on getting it even if you speak up everyday. There were people in my section that would speak everyday in lecture and appeared to be destined for top of the class but they failed out after exams in December.

My best advice? Work hard first year. Put hobbies on hold and get your priorities straight. Second year you can resume a somewhat normal life and 3rd year you will probably be working part-time in addition to class.

*1st year is designed to weed out the weak. It gets MUCH easier if you survive the process.

Good luck!

lmcelhat
Posts: 9
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby lmcelhat » Sun Jun 08, 2008 9:48 pm

so i finally got accepted to mcgeorge and been having fun reading all these posts and decided to join.

thoroughly freaked out after the last post. but i think i was already expecting to have absolutely no life, and to cry, and pretty much...die...so i guess i can't be too shocked.

Question: is the rafting trip worth the money?....i dont know about you guys, but i might be 120,000$ in debt in three years (havent gotten my financial aid package yet)...

lmcelhat
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby lmcelhat » Sun Jun 08, 2008 10:04 pm

oh also- don't judge me for all my writing errors ie: run-on sentences hehe.

and im a member of Calfit---since it's free through my fam...but i think all the "cool" pple my age (21) tend to go to 24hr fitness. so if you wanna be hip, go there

PatentX
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby PatentX » Sun Jun 08, 2008 10:16 pm

lmcelhat wrote:so i finally got accepted to mcgeorge and been having fun reading all these posts and decided to join.

thoroughly freaked out after the last post. but i think i was already expecting to have absolutely no life, and to cry, and pretty much...die...so i guess i can't be too shocked.

Question: is the rafting trip worth the money?....i dont know about you guys, but i might be 120,000$ in debt in three years (havent gotten my financial aid package yet)...


Think about it this way...would you rather be over prepared or under prepared?

That is why I called it the "scare lecture"
:D

If you are an intelligent person that works hard and can handle a challenge you will survive. I know some people who went out to "bar review" (bar hopping every Thurs) and did just fine. They picked things up naturally and kept an active social life.

Before you discover you have that natural gift it is better to prepare for the worst. The legal profession is labor intensive. Just when you think you are keeping up with reading you will have a legal process paper due.

And another tip...be ready on Day 1. There is no introduction day. You show up and someone will be called on to carry the load.

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Ipsa Dixit
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby Ipsa Dixit » Sun Jun 08, 2008 10:45 pm

Don't be scared, guys. First year is hard work and first semester is especially tough, but you can get through it.

You get used to Socratic and it happens to everyone. You've got to let go of your ego a little bit here and accept whatever happens and move on. If you are scared of a professor, I recommend stopping in office hours and chatting to get to know him or her a bit. That can ease some of the intimidation when the inevitable getting called on happens.

It is a big adjustment to get used to the workload and to understand what you are meant to extract from cases. I had to read most cases 3 times during the first part of first semester. Once you get better at reading cases, your study time will speed up quite a bit.

It is true that law school is like a black hole from which no feedback can escape. I recommend office hours for going over things you aren't quite getting. For example, do some problems from the book and take them to the prof to discuss. Working through some E&E problems with a classmate can help too (I mean really work through them, not look and the question, shrug, and look up the answer.)

Practice exams are the best, imo. When the academic success program a practice exam, TAKE IT. The exam will be returned to you with some feedback and a review session. Some people don't do it because they don't feel like they've studied enough for it. It doesn't matter whether you have studied for it at all, it really helps to understand how the exam works and the types of things you are doing right or wrong. If your prof gives a practice exam, take it as well and go to your prof if she or he doesn't do a review or release a model answer. There are also old exams in the library and on an internal website.

There ARE midterms for four classes. PatentX, maybe this was not the case when you were a 1L, but it was this past year. Civ Pro, Property, Torts, and Contracts have midterm exams worth around 30-40% of the year grade (so if you really screw it up, you CAN recover second semester!). Legal Process has graded assignments first and second semester, but I don't know how they break down into the final grade. Criminal law is the only course with a final worth 100% of the grade (this is actually the grade I worry most about, heh.)

Anyway, I think it is very important to have outlets (so imo, don't give up all your hobbies), keep relaxed, and maintain perspective. There are a lot worse things in life than getting called on in class or having to take an exam for a few hours.

PatentX
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby PatentX » Sun Jun 08, 2008 11:01 pm

I guess it depends on how you define "midterm"

There are final exams given at the end of every semester
-Year long classes have a final exam in Dec. and in May
-Semester classes have a single exam in Dec. or May (first years will take Criminal Law or Agency in 2nd semester)

Legal Process DOES in fact have some assignments which are graded throughout the course.

Prospective law students pay attention to our conversation. Notice how you attack the general rule by finding the exception? :D

lmcelhat
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby lmcelhat » Sun Jun 08, 2008 11:22 pm

wait? do we have readings for the first day of class? and if so....how...do we....get em....?

so. um. im an incredibly hard worker (just graduated from oberlin in 3years..eek..so "somewhat" used to having no life and a full load.--im using the argument marker:"guarding" here). im trying to not be stressed about getting called on randomly....except...i am.....only because i developed a reputation as class clown at oberlin since every time my professor would call on me i'd go brain dead and make a complete fool of myself (even when i knew all the info!!!---im waaay better at raising my hand when im ready haha)...which is WHY i don't want to be a litigator (obviously)...but that nerd burried in documents picking apart/analyzing the hell outta them....ANYWAYS, how do i go about this? just meeting with the professors? i love doing that, so that isnt an issue...but i don't know if that'll stop me from going brain dead and making a fool of myself...hopefully pple are nice. im nice

PatentX
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby PatentX » Sun Jun 08, 2008 11:36 pm

lmcelhat wrote:wait? do we have readings for the first day of class? and if so....how...do we....get em....?

so. um. im an incredibly hard worker (just graduated from oberlin in 3years..eek..so "somewhat" used to having no life and a full load.--im using the argument marker:"guarding" here). im trying to not be stressed about getting called on randomly....except...i am.....only because i developed a reputation as class clown at oberlin since every time my professor would call on me i'd go brain dead and make a complete fool of myself (even when i knew all the info!!!---im waaay better at raising my hand when im ready haha)...which is WHY i don't want to be a litigator (obviously)...but that nerd burried in documents picking apart/analyzing the hell outta them....ANYWAYS, how do i go about this? just meeting with the professors? i love doing that, so that isnt an issue...but i don't know if that'll stop me from going brain dead and making a fool of myself...hopefully pple are nice. im nice


It has been a while but I believe you can pick up a syllabus at the Faculty Secretaries Office ("FSO") during your orientation (1 week or so before class) or view the first year assignment online.
For example: http://faculty.mcgeorge.edu/academic_hotline/index.htm

If you look at the summer schedule you can get a rough idea of what is expected of you before you ever step foot in a class room (EX-Criminal Law is a 2nd semester course. You would have to read 1-12 and 126-146)

As for your other point there is no escape! Getting called on in class is a common fear and right of passage for all law students. You will learn how each Professor calls on students (random? seat by seat? alphabetical using the roll sheet? random jumps on the roll sheet? "Splash zone" if the 1st student doesn't know etc.).

You usually get a few unprepared slips ("UP") for each class and can also miss a few lectures before getting a warning about attendance. If you are burning out take advantage of those items. There is no reward for perfect attendance. There is a price to pay if you burn out before exams are over.

travvo
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby travvo » Mon Jun 09, 2008 2:31 pm

Sands, I too am an east coaster and an outdoor junky. There are tons of trails up in the sierras near tahoe that are pretty incredible... Yosemite is also 3.5 hours away. I plan on using any days that i have off to unwind and relax by hiking/flyfishing/skiing/biking etc. so we'll definitely have too get a group together that are into those things to save on gas.

antsinmypants
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby antsinmypants » Mon Jun 09, 2008 3:31 pm

I'm going to need some help getting motivated to exercise. My sedentary lifestyle isn't going to fly in school. I'm such a stress case that if I don't exercise and tire myself out I'll never sleep (REAL bad insomnia). It also wouldn't be bad to get rid of this ever growing spare tire. Coors LIGHT my ass!

travvo
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby travvo » Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:09 pm

Yeah, i feel like stress coping techniques are going to be vital particularly in the first year. Beer and mountains have always worked for me. We'll have to get some sort of weekly or bi-weekly day away from it all (if this can be spared) put together.

Watch out for this person named CalSwimToMe he puts fronts up under various different aliases and plays them off each other in trying to get information from you (he kept pming me for a while today fronting as 2 friends from high school, 1 who wasn't going to go to mcgeorge and one who was). Very odd.

skylar
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby skylar » Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:17 pm

Travis, apparently you're the crazy catcher. Keep doing that and maybe they'll stay away from the rest of us. That'll be the best stress release I can think of!

So back to the sections, are they divided by last names or randomly?

antsinmypants
Posts: 72
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2008 6:36 pm

Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby antsinmypants » Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:28 pm

Crap. I gave him my numbers along with my soft factors. It's no matter... I'm pretty candid about that stuff anyway. What's this prick's deal?

tequilasunriseplz
Posts: 33
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 2:45 pm

Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby tequilasunriseplz » Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:44 pm

Seriously, he sent me some messages as CalSwim and gave him a bunch of information on the area. What a waste.

A bi-weekly outdoors exercise group....I like it! Could it be pulled off early Sunday morn? That might actually encourage me not to waste the entire day being a bum (recovering from Sat night).

PatentX
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:39 pm

Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby PatentX » Mon Jun 09, 2008 9:07 pm

skylar wrote:Travis, apparently you're the crazy catcher. Keep doing that and maybe they'll stay away from the rest of us. That'll be the best stress release I can think of!

So back to the sections, are they divided by last names or randomly?


As far as I could tell we were all randomly assigned. After 1st year the "survivors" will select their own courses and commingle but the first year bonds remain strong. Our commencement speaker and her entire section did some kind of clapping ritual during our graduation ceremony.

francobobfranco
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Re: University of the Pacific, McGeorge School of Law

Postby francobobfranco » Mon Jun 09, 2008 10:43 pm

Hey Everyone,

I'm also known as CalSwimtome and other sns on this discussion board. I wanted to explain my side of the story. Yes, I've posted from multiple screenames. My intention was not to defraud people or to be manipulative; I was only trying to get different objective perspective on my concerns. I'm sure you all know how difficult the choice of law school is. I wanted to make sure I had the best available information as unbiased as possible. Looking back, I did not take these discussion boards seriously and I can understand how my actions were not appropriate and for that I apologize. I'm really excited about starting at McGeorge and I look forward to meeting you guys in the fall.




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