2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 21, 2018 8:48 pm

Should an incoming third-year (after 2 federal clerkships) start at 190k or 210k base? If 190, when should you get the raise to 210?

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:33 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Should an incoming third-year (after 2 federal clerkships) start at 190k or 210k base? If 190, when should you get the raise to 210?

I had the same question. It’s my understanding that you come in with your class year (2016 - $190) and get raises with your class year. Raises happen at the beginning of the year.

The first 4-5 months for first years are considered stub years and you’re technically a first year at the beginning of the year.

Full disclosure: I’m in the same spot. It’s just my understanding after talking to my recruiter and friends who went to firms right out of law school.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:37 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Should an incoming third-year (after 2 federal clerkships) start at 190k or 210k base? If 190, when should you get the raise to 210?


Firms do this differently, so I’m not sure you can generalize about what someone in that position “should” make or when. Firms like to save money, so expect offers that start you a step below where you’d like to be or delay a salary bump. For example, my most recent offer said I’d be a third-year upon arrival in the fall, but that all third-years would receive their salary increase to 210k in January. YMMV of course, but ultimately you have to weigh whether it’s worth pushing back on these policies if you otherwise want to be at a firm.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 8:47 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Should an incoming third-year (after 2 federal clerkships) start at 190k or 210k base? If 190, when should you get the raise to 210?


Firms do this differently, so I’m not sure you can generalize about what someone in that position “should” make or when. Firms like to save money, so expect offers that start you a step below where you’d like to be or delay a salary bump. For example, my most recent offer said I’d be a third-year upon arrival in the fall, but that all third-years would receive their salary increase to 210k in January. YMMV of course, but ultimately you have to weigh whether it’s worth pushing back on these policies if you otherwise want to be at a firm.


It doesn't sound like that firm was trying to screw you or save money. By the fall, there will be new first year associates (class of 2018), so you would be a "third year," but every firm I know implements salary increases in January, not in the fall when new associates start.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:38 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Should an incoming third-year (after 2 federal clerkships) start at 190k or 210k base? If 190, when should you get the raise to 210?


Firms do this differently, so I’m not sure you can generalize about what someone in that position “should” make or when. Firms like to save money, so expect offers that start you a step below where you’d like to be or delay a salary bump. For example, my most recent offer said I’d be a third-year upon arrival in the fall, but that all third-years would receive their salary increase to 210k in January. YMMV of course, but ultimately you have to weigh whether it’s worth pushing back on these policies if you otherwise want to be at a firm.


It doesn't sound like that firm was trying to screw you or save money. By the fall, there will be new first year associates (class of 2018), so you would be a "third year," but every firm I know implements salary increases in January, not in the fall when new associates start.


Above responder here. I meant that they save money when setting up their policies, such as implementing salary raises in January (which is not a universal practice but I agree it’s common). I wouldn’t feel like a firm was trying to screw me by sticking to these rules, it’s just the way it is. The firm I’m going to is starting me as a third year at 190k and bumping me to 210k in January. However, I have also seen offers to start at 210 as a third-year and presumably stay there for 16ish months. The difference isn’t worth sweating imo.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:18 am

The firm I am joining offered to bring me in as a second year (this is after 3 years of clerking) with a 50k bonus. Was disappointed but, given that the market has been tough for clerks in my area and that I like the firm, didn't want to push back.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:35 pm

God I'm envious of y'all. I've had a half dozen callbacks and 1 rejection and no offers yet.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:43 pm

Anonymous User wrote:God I'm envious of y'all. I've had a half dozen callbacks and 1 rejection and no offers yet.


Quite a few CBs -- I'm sure that one of them will hit.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:43 pm

What kind of questions have you guys been getting st your callbacks? Also how long were the interviews?

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:48 pm

Anonymous User wrote:God I'm envious of y'all. I've had a half dozen callbacks and 1 rejection and no offers yet.



Keep faith and continue sending out as many applications as you possibly can. I was on a one-year clerkship and struck out last year, so extended my clerkship. The market is much better this year and I was able to land a good firm position. The fact that you are getting callbacks is extremely promising, especially six of them. I would feel confident that at least one of them will work out, and it is still early, so don't stop plugging away.

Best of luck to you and everyone else still searching!

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:49 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:God I'm envious of y'all. I've had a half dozen callbacks and 1 rejection and no offers yet.


Quite a few CBs -- I'm sure that one of them will hit.


I'd like to think so, but we're approaching 4 weeks now with nary a response. Time to pack it in and go back to my true passion....DANCE.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:15 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:God I'm envious of y'all. I've had a half dozen callbacks and 1 rejection and no offers yet.


Quite a few CBs -- I'm sure that one of them will hit.


I'd like to think so, but we're approaching 4 weeks now with nary a response. Time to pack it in and go back to my true passion....DANCE.


No news is good news -- firms are quick to reject if that's in the cards. That being said, you might consider reaching out to them to get a sense of it. Ask if they want any more materials or something.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:46 pm

Anonymous User wrote:What kind of questions have you guys been getting st your callbacks? Also how long were the interviews?


They were mostly very informal. They wanted to have a conversation - make sure I was easy to get along with. They'd ask me about my experience clerking, what I was interested in, and a few tidbits on my resume. Without fail they would always ask me what they could tell me about the firm, etc. In one of them one of the lawyers was pretty formal, but he still mostly just wanted to talk about my experiences and asked me what he could tell me. Seemed like a "show me you understand what we do and why you want to do it" type of thing.

The interviews were typically 30-40 minutes per lawyer, and the number of attorneys I met with ranged from 3-5.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:20 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:So...Keker — has anyone be offered an interview or gotten a rejection?


Literal. Silence. I don't know what they are doing, but I am assuming silence at the beginning of their interview season is a bad sign.


Update: Heard about some screeners there, but not me :cry:

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:30 pm

Heard GDC LA is doing some limited movement and has given out at least one offer.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 4:04 pm

I'm going to start applying this weekend. What are my chances? Top 10% of class at a Top 10 law school with two years of a district court clerkship. I found a website that lists the 400 biggest firms, so was planning on just applying to all. People with my level of credentials - how have you done so far with interviews/offers?

Thanks in advance.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:18 pm

6 CBs sounds real promising. Relatedly, what are y'all doing to get all these callbacks? Just cold emailing, knowing someone at the firm, other?

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 23, 2018 10:43 am

Anonymous User wrote:6 CBs sounds real promising. Relatedly, what are y'all doing to get all these callbacks? Just cold emailing, knowing someone at the firm, other?



I'm not sure I understand your question. To get callbacks, clearly do well during the preliminary interview...

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 23, 2018 11:20 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:So...Keker — has anyone be offered an interview or gotten a rejection?


Literal. Silence. I don't know what they are doing, but I am assuming silence at the beginning of their interview season is a bad sign.


Update: Heard about some screeners there, but not me :cry:


Does anyone know about Keker's pay scale vs. hours requirement?

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 23, 2018 11:53 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:6 CBs sounds real promising. Relatedly, what are y'all doing to get all these callbacks? Just cold emailing, knowing someone at the firm, other?



I'm not sure I understand your question. To get callbacks, clearly do well during the preliminary interview...

I've had 5 CBs, none of which started with a screener. At the clerkship stage, I assumed straight to CB was the norm...

Every interview I have received has come from cold email or applying for an open clerkship/lateral position. I have not leveraged any connections to this point.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:10 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:6 CBs sounds real promising. Relatedly, what are y'all doing to get all these callbacks? Just cold emailing, knowing someone at the firm, other?



I'm not sure I understand your question. To get callbacks, clearly do well during the preliminary interview...


I'm guessing this person meant to ask what people are doing to get interviews. The terminology is a bit confusing because some firms skip the screening interview altogether. So far, of the seven initial interviews I've done, two led to callbacks and two were, by design, only one round. More to the point, four of the interviews came from cold emails or form submissions to the firm's website and three came from networking contacts at the firm.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:12 pm

Anonymous User wrote:6 CBs sounds real promising. Relatedly, what are y'all doing to get all these callbacks? Just cold emailing, knowing someone at the firm, other?


It's actually not just about doing well in a formal "screener" - unless networking counts as the "screener." I only got one of the callbacks by cold applying. The rest I got by schmoozing with partners. I did not know any of them beforehand - I just used whatever connection I could come up with to cold email them, then arranged phone calls, then talked to them about what my goals were and where I hoped to be. This often included a spiel about why X firm was a place I was very, very interested in. I came up with solid reasons too, not just standard fluff.

Based on my experience, networking is everything. Of course I'm just one person with one set of experiences, so I can't say it's the only way to go for everybody. Forgive all of the Yiddish.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:12 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:6 CBs sounds real promising. Relatedly, what are y'all doing to get all these callbacks? Just cold emailing, knowing someone at the firm, other?



I'm not sure I understand your question. To get callbacks, clearly do well during the preliminary interview...

I've had 5 CBs, none of which started with a screener. At the clerkship stage, I assumed straight to CB was the norm...

Every interview I have received has come from cold email or applying for an open clerkship/lateral position. I have not leveraged any connections to this point.


Yeah I'm the original poster. I second the part about going straight to callback.

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:08 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:6 CBs sounds real promising. Relatedly, what are y'all doing to get all these callbacks? Just cold emailing, knowing someone at the firm, other?



I'm not sure I understand your question. To get callbacks, clearly do well during the preliminary interview...

I've had 5 CBs, none of which started with a screener. At the clerkship stage, I assumed straight to CB was the norm...

Every interview I have received has come from cold email or applying for an open clerkship/lateral position. I have not leveraged any connections to this point.


Yeah I'm the original poster. I second the part about going straight to callback.



What do you mean "I second the part about going straight to callback[?]" Your writing is really confusing...

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Re: 2017-2018 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Feb 23, 2018 4:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:6 CBs sounds real promising. Relatedly, what are y'all doing to get all these callbacks? Just cold emailing, knowing someone at the firm, other?



I'm not sure I understand your question. To get callbacks, clearly do well during the preliminary interview...

I've had 5 CBs, none of which started with a screener. At the clerkship stage, I assumed straight to CB was the norm...

Every interview I have received has come from cold email or applying for an open clerkship/lateral position. I have not leveraged any connections to this point.


Yeah I'm the original poster. I second the part about going straight to callback.



What do you mean "I second the part about going straight to callback[?]" Your writing is really confusing...

S/he means that s/he agrees that there are (generally) no screeners for post-clerkship gigs. The writing is not confusing. To "second" something means to agree. This is common parlance.



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