2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jul 17, 2015 6:37 pm

So what kind of grades does it take to snag one of these feeders from HLS? All Hs? Multiple DSs?

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:09 pm

Consensus is DS minus P = 3 or more after 1L for the top feeder (Kavanaugh, Garland, Sutton, Wilkinson level).

It should also be noted that whether you are clerking with a feeder or not does not matter at all unless you have SCOTUS level grades, like those mentioned above. Both the grades and the feeder clerkship are necessary.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jul 17, 2015 9:42 pm

I think any more than one P during 1L puts you out of the running for Fletcher.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby jbagelboy » Sat Jul 18, 2015 2:15 am

Anonymous User wrote:I think any more than one P during 1L puts you out of the running for Fletcher.


This can't be true. That's insanity.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jul 18, 2015 12:15 pm

2 Ps generally puts you out of reach for any of the top feeders, which I would consider Fletcher at the edge of. Barring any special relationships, etc.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jul 18, 2015 12:56 pm

It's also not so extreme. It's probably a conservative estimate that more than 5% of the 1L class, so around 30 people or more, have better than a 4.0 after 1L. Granted some of those have multiple Ps with multiple DSs, but I'm sure there are more than enough people with 1 or 0 Ps to fill the usual number of HLS feeder clerkships.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Jul 18, 2015 1:41 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Consensus is DS minus P = 3 or more after 1L for the top feeder (Kavanaugh, Garland, Sutton, Wilkinson level).

It should also be noted that whether you are clerking with a feeder or not does not matter at all unless you have SCOTUS level grades, like those mentioned above. Both the grades and the feeder clerkship are necessary.


Yeah, it's probably about the same for SLS too. The top folks this year had all Hs and multiple book prizes (3+). Although one person who got a feeder had a P, so I don't think it's a deal breaker.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jul 19, 2015 4:09 pm

Anonymous User wrote:2 Ps generally puts you out of reach for any of the top feeders, which I would consider Fletcher at the edge of. Barring any special relationships, etc.

I'm a current clerk for one of the judges previously mentioned in this thread. I think there's some truth to this, as a ballpark estimate, but I wouldn't hesitate to throw your hat in the ring even if your grades are worse than this. In my experience, especially post-Plan, your application will still get a serious look if your grades are ballpark competitive but not ultra-competitive (think 2-3 Ps from SLS/HLS, 1 from YLS). Your odds of getting the job may still be worse than your peers' with perfect or near-perfect grades, but once you get a serious look, things like recommendations and strong softs might make up for weaker performance. I can point to several candidates hired by feeders in this year's hiring cycle that fall into this category.

(That said, all this is more or less moot, as most of these judges have hired or all but hired for 2017 by now.)

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jul 19, 2015 8:23 pm

Your odds of getting the job may still be worse than your peers' with perfect or near-perfect grades, but once you get a serious look, things like recommendations and strong softs might make up for weaker performance.


What do strong softs for a feeder clerkship look like?

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jul 19, 2015 8:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Your odds of getting the job may still be worse than your peers' with perfect or near-perfect grades, but once you get a serious look, things like recommendations and strong softs might make up for weaker performance.


What do strong softs for a feeder clerkship look like?


Interesting work experience, prestigious undergrad w/ nice awards, fed soc/acs, interesting hobbies, and RA positions, to name a few examples.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jul 19, 2015 8:58 pm

I can not stress enough how little softs matter in the grand scheme of feeder clerkships. We are talking about the finest of hairs at this point. For future students reading this, it is ALL about grades. Study your butt off.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jul 19, 2015 10:30 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I can not stress enough how little softs matter in the grand scheme of feeder clerkships. We are talking about the finest of hairs at this point. For future students reading this, it is ALL about grades. Study your butt off.


Agreed. For my judge, those with more than one P need not apply, no matter what their softs.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jul 19, 2015 10:58 pm

The answer to my question this spring about if class prizes negate P's seems to be no.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jul 19, 2015 11:27 pm

The one soft that can very materially help is gender, depending on the judge you are applying to.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 20, 2015 1:12 am

Anyone received an offer from the EDNY judges interviewing the past month, e.g. bianco and vitaliano?

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 20, 2015 2:30 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I can not stress enough how little softs matter in the grand scheme of feeder clerkships. We are talking about the finest of hairs at this point. For future students reading this, it is ALL about grades. Study your butt off.


Agreed. For my judge, those with more than one P need not apply, no matter what their softs.

This hasn't been my experience, but I think that only goes to prove that judges (and their preferences for clerkship applicants) differ.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 20, 2015 8:59 am

Anonymous User wrote:The one soft that can very materially help is gender, depending on the judge you are applying to.


Care to elaborate?

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:29 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
The one soft that can very materially help is gender, depending on the judge you are applying to.


Looking at the gender make up of most judicial clerks, you must mean that its a plus to be a male, right?

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:39 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
The one soft that can very materially help is gender, depending on the judge you are applying to.


Looking at the gender make up of most judicial clerks, you must mean that its a plus to be a male, right?


Not the same anon, but I don't think this is what was implied.

To put it bluntly, men like Brett Kavanaugh, Merrick Garland, and Alex Kozinski enjoy surrounding themselves with attractive young women and make hiring decisions that actively reflect that preference.

So in a sense it's less "gender" and more a specific subset of one gender.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 20, 2015 6:48 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
The one soft that can very materially help is gender, depending on the judge you are applying to.


Looking at the gender make up of most judicial clerks, you must mean that its a plus to be a male, right?


Not the same anon, but I don't think this is what was implied.

To put it bluntly, men like Brett Kavanaugh, Merrick Garland, and Alex Kozinski enjoy surrounding themselves with attractive young women and make hiring decisions that actively reflect that preference.

So in a sense it's less "gender" and more a specific subset of one gender.


Wow, this got out of hand quickly. That's a bold assertion to make against three well respected judges.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby ndirish2010 » Mon Jul 20, 2015 7:34 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
The one soft that can very materially help is gender, depending on the judge you are applying to.


Looking at the gender make up of most judicial clerks, you must mean that its a plus to be a male, right?


Not the same anon, but I don't think this is what was implied.

To put it bluntly, men like Brett Kavanaugh, Merrick Garland, and Alex Kozinski enjoy surrounding themselves with attractive young women and make hiring decisions that actively reflect that preference.

So in a sense it's less "gender" and more a specific subset of one gender.


Wow, this got out of hand quickly. That's a bold assertion to make against three well respected judges.


I was gonna say, yeah way to basically accuse some of the most respected federal judges of sexual harassment as an anon poster on TLS. Brutal.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby beepboopbeep » Mon Jul 20, 2015 7:43 pm

Inb4 "well I was just interpreting what the other anon, who is totally a different person, was saying- it's not really what i think, obviously, duh"

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 20, 2015 9:05 pm

I can not stress enough how little softs matter in the grand scheme of feeder clerkships. We are talking about the finest of hairs at this point. For future students reading this, it is ALL about grades. Study your butt off.


I have to disagree. Don't discount the importance of having a strong recommender who is close with the Judge. I got a 'feeder' clerkship. I have great grades (Top 10% but not Top 10 people) but I'm not at the top of the class. I also don't have a lot of the other traditional softs: I'm not on main journal, I'm not on moot court, and I go to a T-14 but not HYS. I have other good softs including strong internships, publication, work history, and really great recommendations. At the end of the day, a professor went to bat for me. That's what counted.

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:54 pm

well, um, in fairness, one of those three judges named has...not sure i'd characterize it as a wild accusation

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Re: 2017-2018 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jul 20, 2015 11:05 pm

Being a female generally helps a ton. Especially with female judges.




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