Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Seek and share information about clerkship applications, clerkship hiring timelines, and post-clerkship employment opportunities.
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ClerkAdvisor
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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby ClerkAdvisor » Sat Apr 26, 2014 11:20 pm

legalese_retard wrote:
mi-chan17 wrote:I'll be in this boat next year (2-year clerkship), but my predecessor left a spreadsheet of his applications (dates sent in, responses) and even though he didn't even apply until April, he still ended up in biglaw. So they may just not have gotten to hiring clerks yet at some firms.


That's what stinks. I applied to firms in January, but if they are looking now or later this summer, I don't know if my resume will still be considered if I never received a rejection letter. I will probably resend my resume to these firms, but I don't know if now is the best time, or if I should wait another month.


Can't hurt to send the applications again now. Firms probably have a better idea of their needs, and it's better to send earlier than after positions have been filled.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 29, 2014 7:41 pm

This is my first time posting in this thread, but I've been lurking for months. I'm a T30 grad (top 10%, LR management) with a federal COA clerkship in a flyover state where I never planned to stay. My judge doesn't really have connections outside of the state. I had a 2L SA, but I got no-offered. My goal was to get a federal government job, but I expanded my search after I struck out with the honors programs.

I sent applications to over 60 firms in the state where I'm licensed (which includes one major market and a couple smaller ones) in February. I got no interviews with this approach. I started networking with alums of my law school who practice in the practice area I'm interested in. Within a few weeks of doing this, I got an interview at my dream firm with the help of one of these alums, and the firm made me an offer.

I'm telling this story for those of you who are like me. I hate networking with a burning passion and avoided it like the plague all through law school and through most of my clerkship. For those of you who are struggling to get a firm job, stop just mass mailing and start networking. I found this thread incredibly helpful as someone new to networking: http://top-law-schools.com/forums/viewt ... 3&t=226544. Your clerkship may not get some recruiting person to take your resume out of a pile, but it probably will get an alum to answer your email requesting an informational interview. I also felt like my clerkship made people feel safe about offering to pass my resume along to their contacts.

I also finally managed to get a few non-honors federal government interviews toward the end. If you're getting discouraged by silence on USAJOBS, just keep applying. It took me over two months to get any response.

Good luck to all of you!

EDIT: I thought of another networking tip that I wanted to add. I found it was helpful to ask career services at my law school for the names of a couple alums in my practice area of choice who would be good contacts. The people on OCS's radar were particularly receptive to helping me out, which made the conversation much easier. Talking to them was a good way to get my feet wet with networking.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Wed Apr 30, 2014 1:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Apr 30, 2014 10:38 am

Agree completely. Dist. Ct. Clerk here. Over the year and a half of my clerkship, mass mailing accomplished nothing. Networking has yielded about 5 interviews, but it takes WORK.

Here's how I've gone about it:

1) Find a list of alums of your school at Firms. Doesn't matter what practice group theyre in. The goal here is to get someone to pass your resume along and put in a good word. Doesnt really matter who. I usually look for partners, but associates are fine, too.
2) Send an email to those alums saying: A) who you are; B) what you want to do; and C) you're interested in hearing about their experience at X firm. If its in the city im clerking in, I ask to meet. If its in another city, I ask if they have a few moments to discuss their experience over the phone
3) Be prepared for 50-75% of people to not respond to your email. Feel free to send a gentle follow-up a few weeks later. People are busy--don't take it personally.
4) Have a normal conversation/meeting. Tell them about yourself. Listen to what they have to say. Ask about the Firm's needs. Take a genuine interest. Ask what their busy practice groups are. Just be prepared to do a lot of listening and saying "Right. Yes. Uh huh." Treat it like an interview, because its pretty much a screening interview that you've set up for yourself. 90% of the time they'll offer to send your resume. The other 10 percent of the time, you can say "Would you mind passing my resume along?". If they tell you to contact the recruiter. Contact the recruiter and in your email say "Sally Partner recommended that I reach out to you regarding my interest in XYZ firm."
5) Follow up after the meeting. Ask if they recommend you contact anyone else.
6) Be prepared to hear "I don't think we have any needs right now, but I'm sure you'll have no problem find something great with your resume." This can be infuriating to hear, but keep following up.
7) Continue to check in. Hope something happens in your favor.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Apr 30, 2014 11:01 am

Another +1 from me. Current D. Ct. clerk in a major market that's in a bit of a hiring drought. Blind submission yielded almost nothing; networking landed me 3 interviews, got offers from 2.

The biggest advice I have for anyone looking to go to a firm post-clerkship is to start networking at the beginning of your term. Make it a goal to meet someone for lunch at least once or twice a month. Talk to someone at almost any firm you're seriously interested in. (Check for law school alums. If none of those, look for undergrad alums. If none of those, look for cross-alums (people who went to your undergrad's law school or your law school's undergrad). If none of those, look for people who clerked in the same district as you. Find something -- anything! -- to highlight in an initial email.) It takes a LOT of work, especially compared to doing a mail merge. And there's no guarantee any particular lead will pan out. But it has been exponentially more productive for me.

On top of that, I feel like I've made a pretty good network of attorney's in the area. I think lateraling will be a little easier (if necessary) and I met a lot of people I just genuinely enjoyed being around.

EDIT: And, of course, make sure you aren't under a conflict with anyone you meet with and determine your judge's "rules" with respect to meeting with active attorneys.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 14, 2014 1:08 pm

Bump!

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 14, 2014 1:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Another +1 from me. Current D. Ct. clerk in a major market that's in a bit of a hiring drought. Blind submission yielded almost nothing; networking landed me 3 interviews, got offers from 2.

The biggest advice I have for anyone looking to go to a firm post-clerkship is to start networking at the beginning of your term. Make it a goal to meet someone for lunch at least once or twice a month. Talk to someone at almost any firm you're seriously interested in. (Check for law school alums. If none of those, look for undergrad alums. If none of those, look for cross-alums (people who went to your undergrad's law school or your law school's undergrad). If none of those, look for people who clerked in the same district as you. Find something -- anything! -- to highlight in an initial email.) It takes a LOT of work, especially compared to doing a mail merge. And there's no guarantee any particular lead will pan out. But it has been exponentially more productive for me.

On top of that, I feel like I've made a pretty good network of attorney's in the area. I think lateraling will be a little easier (if necessary) and I met a lot of people I just genuinely enjoyed being around.

EDIT: And, of course, make sure you aren't under a conflict with anyone you meet with and determine your judge's "rules" with respect to meeting with active attorneys.


Are judges generally ok with you networking at the beginning of the term?

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 14, 2014 1:15 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Another +1 from me. Current D. Ct. clerk in a major market that's in a bit of a hiring drought. Blind submission yielded almost nothing; networking landed me 3 interviews, got offers from 2.

The biggest advice I have for anyone looking to go to a firm post-clerkship is to start networking at the beginning of your term. Make it a goal to meet someone for lunch at least once or twice a month. Talk to someone at almost any firm you're seriously interested in. (Check for law school alums. If none of those, look for undergrad alums. If none of those, look for cross-alums (people who went to your undergrad's law school or your law school's undergrad). If none of those, look for people who clerked in the same district as you. Find something -- anything! -- to highlight in an initial email.) It takes a LOT of work, especially compared to doing a mail merge. And there's no guarantee any particular lead will pan out. But it has been exponentially more productive for me.

On top of that, I feel like I've made a pretty good network of attorney's in the area. I think lateraling will be a little easier (if necessary) and I met a lot of people I just genuinely enjoyed being around.

EDIT: And, of course, make sure you aren't under a conflict with anyone you meet with and determine your judge's "rules" with respect to meeting with active attorneys.


Are judges generally ok with you networking at the beginning of the term?


As long as the particular attorney was not working on a case presently before my judge that was on my side of the docket, he was fine with it.

I know some judges will block off any firm that has a matter before the judge -- that can make it much more difficult. That's the most restrictive I've heard.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 14, 2014 4:09 pm

Is it taking anyone else forever to hear back after callbacks? I've had 3 and its been 3 weeks, 10 days, and a week and no word from any of them. Can't be good the longer it goes, I'd think.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 14, 2014 4:35 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Is it taking anyone else forever to hear back after callbacks? I've had 3 and its been 3 weeks, 10 days, and a week and no word from any of them. Can't be good the longer it goes, I'd think.


You're right that longer usually is not a good thing. That being said, I received an offer at the 4 week mark and another at the three week mark (after following up because of the first). So I wouldn't count any of them out yet.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 14, 2014 4:44 pm

dist court clerk in flyover district here. I still have significant amount of apps out with big law firms that I have not heard back from. Being that it is May, is it reasonable to anticipate hearing back from those firms and that some of them might sill be reviewing apps or is it pretty much too late for this cycle absent some abnormal situation?

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu May 15, 2014 2:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Is it taking anyone else forever to hear back after callbacks? I've had 3 and its been 3 weeks, 10 days, and a week and no word from any of them. Can't be good the longer it goes, I'd think.



Anon here. Dinged on the first one (via phone call). Still have two in play.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu May 15, 2014 2:35 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Is it taking anyone else forever to hear back after callbacks? I've had 3 and its been 3 weeks, 10 days, and a week and no word from any of them. Can't be good the longer it goes, I'd think.



Anon here. Dinged on the first one (via phone call). Still have two in play.


They are probably bringing in people in drips and drabs over the course of a few weeks - it's not like OCI season where they are trying to make offers to a certain # of people at your school. That's generally a good sign, though, I bombed at one firm and it took them all of two days to ding me. Another firm left me in limbo for 3-4 weeks before dinging me, probably because they were lukewarm and waiting to see more people. I had a screener three months ago and never got any word.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu May 15, 2014 5:49 pm

Do people mind posting firms/locations where they've gotten interviews or know of recruiting efforts?

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat May 17, 2014 12:49 am

Anonymous User wrote:Do people mind posting firms/locations where they've gotten interviews or know of recruiting efforts?


Mostly in New York here.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Sat May 17, 2014 12:54 am

Are any of you guys planning or trying to trade up? I have an offer with a firm that I can go back to after my clerkship. However, I am thinking about "trading up." Do I have to worry about offending people by trying to "trade up"? Should I worry about making people think I'm being "disloyal"?

Or is it just an accepted part of the game?

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Thu May 22, 2014 9:31 am

Anonymous User wrote:Are any of you guys planning or trying to trade up? I have an offer with a firm that I can go back to after my clerkship. However, I am thinking about "trading up." Do I have to worry about offending people by trying to "trade up"? Should I worry about making people think I'm being "disloyal"?

Or is it just an accepted part of the game?


I used my clerkship to "trade up" firms. Though I don't think my old firm was thrilled with the news, they were professional and cordial when I told them. In fact, the hiring partner said he couldn't really blame me for taking this other opportunity. As you say, I think it's an accepted part of the game.

And to go back to the topic of the thread, I applied to ~15 firms and a couple government positions, got 4 CBs, and 1 offer. To compare, I had 7 CBs and 5 offers during OCI. I agree with others who have said that firms are more discerning when considering post-clerkship applicants.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri May 23, 2014 12:06 pm

Anonymous User wrote:dist court clerk in flyover district here. I still have significant amount of apps out with big law firms that I have not heard back from. Being that it is May, is it reasonable to anticipate hearing back from those firms and that some of them might sill be reviewing apps or is it pretty much too late for this cycle absent some abnormal situation?


I just got an interview with a firm I applied to back in February or March (which I have not contacted since then). I have no idea whether this is normal, but I would take it as a sign not to give up hope.

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legalese_retard
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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby legalese_retard » Fri May 23, 2014 3:53 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:dist court clerk in flyover district here. I still have significant amount of apps out with big law firms that I have not heard back from. Being that it is May, is it reasonable to anticipate hearing back from those firms and that some of them might sill be reviewing apps or is it pretty much too late for this cycle absent some abnormal situation?


I just got an interview with a firm I applied to back in February or March (which I have not contacted since then). I have no idea whether this is normal, but I would take it as a sign not to give up hope.


Good luck!

Unfortunately I have given up hope. The only firm I thought I had a shot at told me last week that they won't have enough work to sustain another associate. I also went to a CLE event in a city I have been applying to as an opportunity to network, but it was a complete bust.

At this point, I am going to have to work hard saving even more money to survive once my clerkship ends.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri May 23, 2014 5:46 pm

legalese_retard wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:dist court clerk in flyover district here. I still have significant amount of apps out with big law firms that I have not heard back from. Being that it is May, is it reasonable to anticipate hearing back from those firms and that some of them might sill be reviewing apps or is it pretty much too late for this cycle absent some abnormal situation?


I just got an interview with a firm I applied to back in February or March (which I have not contacted since then). I have no idea whether this is normal, but I would take it as a sign not to give up hope.


Good luck!

Unfortunately I have given up hope. The only firm I thought I had a shot at told me last week that they won't have enough work to sustain another associate. I also went to a CLE event in a city I have been applying to as an opportunity to network, but it was a complete bust.

At this point, I am going to have to work hard saving even more money to survive once my clerkship ends.


Is Texas that barren right now? I'm hoping to land a job there once my CoA clerkship is over. I was really hoping it would be a little easier to break into the market than NYC or DC.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri May 23, 2014 5:55 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
legalese_retard wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:dist court clerk in flyover district here. I still have significant amount of apps out with big law firms that I have not heard back from. Being that it is May, is it reasonable to anticipate hearing back from those firms and that some of them might sill be reviewing apps or is it pretty much too late for this cycle absent some abnormal situation?


I just got an interview with a firm I applied to back in February or March (which I have not contacted since then). I have no idea whether this is normal, but I would take it as a sign not to give up hope.



Good luck!

Unfortunately I have given up hope. The only firm I thought I had a shot at told me last week that they won't have enough work to sustain another associate. I also went to a CLE event in a city I have been applying to as an opportunity to network, but it was a complete bust.

At this point, I am going to have to work hard saving even more money to survive once my clerkship ends.


Is Texas that barren right now? I'm hoping to land a job there once my CoA clerkship is over. I was really hoping it would be a little easier to break into the market than NYC or DC.


Entry level in Dallas and Houston are rough. I have heard of a little more success for mid level litigators, but nothing more than 3 spots for people who went straight from school to clerkship.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Fri May 23, 2014 7:14 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Entry level in Dallas and Houston are rough. I have heard of a little more success for mid level litigators, but nothing more than 3 spots for people who went straight from school to clerkship.


That's depressing to hear. I have a biglaw offer in another large market but I was really hoping to use the clerkship to jump to Texas.

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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:08 pm

bump.

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OutCold
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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby OutCold » Wed Jul 09, 2014 5:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Are any of you guys planning or trying to trade up? I have an offer with a firm that I can go back to after my clerkship. However, I am thinking about "trading up." Do I have to worry about offending people by trying to "trade up"? Should I worry about making people think I'm being "disloyal"?

Or is it just an accepted part of the game?

I did this as a 3L, prior to landing a clerkship. More because of fit, but it was a step up. Nobody at your old firm will care aside from the recruiting office, and only then because it throws off their expected yield. Even if they were offended, it won't affect you unless you are trying to go back one day. If it was heavily frowned upon, I think your new firm would be more hesitant about knowingly poaching you in the first place.

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AreJay711
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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby AreJay711 » Thu Jul 10, 2014 11:19 am

Anonymous User wrote:Agree completely. Dist. Ct. Clerk here. Over the year and a half of my clerkship, mass mailing accomplished nothing. Networking has yielded about 5 interviews, but it takes WORK.



Hey small question for any of the people who talked about networking: Do you use your court email for this?

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legalese_retard
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Re: Post-Clerkship Job hunt (Fall 2014 cycle)

Postby legalese_retard » Thu Jul 10, 2014 11:57 am

AreJay711 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Agree completely. Dist. Ct. Clerk here. Over the year and a half of my clerkship, mass mailing accomplished nothing. Networking has yielded about 5 interviews, but it takes WORK.



Hey small question for any of the people who talked about networking: Do you use your court email for this?


I thought about it, especially since people are more likely to review an email with a court address. However, I think there are ethical issues since you would not be using for email address for "court business." Plus, I am working on several cases involving the same firms I am applying to.




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