Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

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aliens
Posts: 51
Joined: Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:34 pm

Re: Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

Postby aliens » Mon Sep 09, 2013 9:48 am

emciosn wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Ohiobumpkin wrote:How important would it be to write a note (and hopefully publish) on a bankruptcy issue if you have no bankruptcy experience before law school in order to be a competitive candidate for a bankruptcy clerkship? Sorry for the run-on sentence.

Not Op, but a bankruptcy law clerk. I didn't have pre-law school bankruptcy experience and I don't know any law clerks with that either (most just went from undergrad to law school). Take bankruptcy classes (or related classes such as secured transactions, commercial law courses, etc.) and try to work on a few bankruptcy assignments in a summer position (or intern for a bankruptcy judge) so that you vividly describe your interest in bankruptcy law. I didn't write my note on bankruptcy (I am published though), but it would be a plus. I don't think it is essential as long as you can demonstrate an interest in some way or another.


Also a BK law clerk, not OP. I also don't think it is necessary to write your not on a BK issue (I didn't) but it is important to have some sort of BK interest come through on your resume (as discussed above).

On the topic of writing sample though I do have one bit of advice that I think worked for me. There is a publication called the ABI (American Bankruptcy Institute) Journal. It is monthly and basically a collection of short articles on current bankruptcy topics. It is fairly easy to get something in if you select a good topic and submit before someone else writes on it (a recent Circuit Court opinion on a bankruptcy issue or something). The word limit is only 2500 words, so it is not too difficult to research and write and is the perfect length for a writing sample (I think notes can be so long that judges don't bother reading them). You could get an attorney at a firm you are working for to "co-author" the article with you (lends legitimacy) but do the writing research yourself. Even if it doesn't get published it shows the judge you had some initiative to even try (just put a blurb on the top about how you wanted to get it published but someone else wrote on it first, etc.). I did this and every single judge I interviewed with talked about the article with me. It was an interesting topic, short, and easy to digest.

Just a suggestion, and easier and maybe even more useful than doing a whole note on a BK issue.


This is credited. Aside from a writing sample, joining ABI may demonstrate interest in bankruptcy.

peter2009
Posts: 55
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2011 5:06 pm

Re: Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

Postby peter2009 » Mon Sep 09, 2013 4:56 pm

aliens wrote:
emciosn wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Ohiobumpkin wrote:How important would it be to write a note (and hopefully publish) on a bankruptcy issue if you have no bankruptcy experience before law school in order to be a competitive candidate for a bankruptcy clerkship? Sorry for the run-on sentence.

Not Op, but a bankruptcy law clerk. I didn't have pre-law school bankruptcy experience and I don't know any law clerks with that either (most just went from undergrad to law school). Take bankruptcy classes (or related classes such as secured transactions, commercial law courses, etc.) and try to work on a few bankruptcy assignments in a summer position (or intern for a bankruptcy judge) so that you vividly describe your interest in bankruptcy law. I didn't write my note on bankruptcy (I am published though), but it would be a plus. I don't think it is essential as long as you can demonstrate an interest in some way or another.


Also a BK law clerk, not OP. I also don't think it is necessary to write your not on a BK issue (I didn't) but it is important to have some sort of BK interest come through on your resume (as discussed above).

On the topic of writing sample though I do have one bit of advice that I think worked for me. There is a publication called the ABI (American Bankruptcy Institute) Journal. It is monthly and basically a collection of short articles on current bankruptcy topics. It is fairly easy to get something in if you select a good topic and submit before someone else writes on it (a recent Circuit Court opinion on a bankruptcy issue or something). The word limit is only 2500 words, so it is not too difficult to research and write and is the perfect length for a writing sample (I think notes can be so long that judges don't bother reading them). You could get an attorney at a firm you are working for to "co-author" the article with you (lends legitimacy) but do the writing research yourself. Even if it doesn't get published it shows the judge you had some initiative to even try (just put a blurb on the top about how you wanted to get it published but someone else wrote on it first, etc.). I did this and every single judge I interviewed with talked about the article with me. It was an interesting topic, short, and easy to digest.

Just a suggestion, and easier and maybe even more useful than doing a whole note on a BK issue.


This is credited. Aside from a writing sample, joining ABI may demonstrate interest in bankruptcy.


Also participating in Duberstein and/or becoming a research assistant for a bankruptcy professor.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Sep 12, 2013 11:16 am

B+ in bankruptcy, fml, but otherwise decent bankruptcy interest through internship for BK judge and BK centric courses. Do I have a chance at Texas, IL, DE, NY?

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Sep 12, 2013 11:32 am

Anonymous User wrote:B+ in bankruptcy, fml, but otherwise decent bankruptcy interest through internship for BK judge and BK centric courses. Do I have a chance at Texas, IL, DE, NY?


I got a number of interviews and eventually a clerkship in a relatively competitive city with a B+ in bankruptcy. A lot of experience (classes, etc) seems to have made up for it.

midwestrocks
Posts: 25
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2011 4:26 pm

Re: Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

Postby midwestrocks » Thu Sep 12, 2013 3:27 pm

Anonymous User wrote:B+ in bankruptcy, fml, but otherwise decent bankruptcy interest through internship for BK judge and BK centric courses. Do I have a chance at Texas, IL, DE, NY?


I think you can demonstrate your interest in other ways and a B+ won't kill your chances.

Is Texas a good state to do a bankruptcy clerkship? I hadn't really heard that before.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Sep 12, 2013 11:28 pm

midwestrocks wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:B+ in bankruptcy, fml, but otherwise decent bankruptcy interest through internship for BK judge and BK centric courses. Do I have a chance at Texas, IL, DE, NY?


I think you can demonstrate your interest in other ways and a B+ won't kill your chances.

Is Texas a good state to do a bankruptcy clerkship? I hadn't really heard that before.



B+ anon here. I was told that DE + SDNY are on a whole other level, the next category after them is Chicago/few places in Texas and Cali...
Maybe outgoing clerk can enlighten us... my school does not seem to know much about it, so I might be getting bad advice.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:57 am

Different clerk, but I interviewed in TX and they have some mega cases. Post-clerkship opportunities looked good. The past law clerks were all working at well respected firms. I think aside from DE & NY--CA, TX, FL, IL...and maybe even MI right now (in the big market areas) would be competitive/helpful (although almost any clerkship is helpful with the right circumstances).

aliens
Posts: 51
Joined: Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:34 pm

Re: Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

Postby aliens » Fri Sep 13, 2013 8:03 am

Anonymous User wrote:
midwestrocks wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:B+ in bankruptcy, fml, but otherwise decent bankruptcy interest through internship for BK judge and BK centric courses. Do I have a chance at Texas, IL, DE, NY?


I think you can demonstrate your interest in other ways and a B+ won't kill your chances.

Is Texas a good state to do a bankruptcy clerkship? I hadn't really heard that before.



B+ anon here. I was told that DE + SDNY are on a whole other level, the next category after them is Chicago/few places in Texas and Cali...
Maybe outgoing clerk can enlighten us... my school does not seem to know much about it, so I might be getting bad advice.


I think whether a B+ is acceptable is highly subjective based on the judge. My judge would not have cared about the bankruptcy grade unless it was a bad grade. I think if you're going to a court that is highly commercial a general bankruptcy grade may not be as important as the grade in a chapter 11 class if you took one. But that's my opinion and I have nothing to back that up.

N.D. Texas is a large market for commercial work. Obviously behind DE and NY though. Texas would definitely be a major market for a bankruptcy clerkship. Having worked in a flyover state and doing mostly consumer work, not commercial, I definitely think if you can get into a commercial market, you should. Assuming of course that you want to do commercial bankruptcy.

I want to do commercial bankruptcy but struggled in the job search for commercial work given my consumer background. My firm does commercial work, but on a smaller, regional scale. So it won't be big law style, but it'll be heading down the road I wanted to go. Having been so consumer-focused, it was hard to get into commercial work. So I definitely think you should consider that if you had a choice between markets.

aliens
Posts: 51
Joined: Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:34 pm

Re: Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

Postby aliens » Fri Sep 13, 2013 8:09 am

Anonymous User wrote:Different clerk, but I interviewed in TX and they have some mega cases. Post-clerkship opportunities looked good. The past law clerks were all working at well respected firms. I think aside from DE & NY--CA, TX, FL, IL...and maybe even MI right now (in the big market areas) would be competitive/helpful (although almost any clerkship is helpful with the right circumstances).


+1. Remember that we can debate which clerkship is better than others. Generally speaking, any clerkship is going to help you further in your career. I would not have gotten my new position without the clerkship.

Also if you considering a smaller market or if that's all you are offered, remember there are perks to not being in the busiest markets. My clerkship was not stressful. Not. one. bit. It was a dream two years with no extra hours. I was never in before 8 am. I stayed past 5 pm just a handful of times and even that wasn't past 6 pm. I never once worked weekends or worked remotely. To be clear, this was what my judge wanted b/c we weren't busy. My judge sent us home early many times. My judge and co-clerk never worked long hours either.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Outgoing Bankruptcy Term Clerk Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Oct 08, 2013 4:41 am

Anonymous User wrote:B+ in bankruptcy, fml, but otherwise decent bankruptcy interest through internship for BK judge and BK centric courses. Do I have a chance at Texas, IL, DE, NY?

OK, so, obviously this is not good, but i don't think it's really that much of a biggie either, as long as you can kinda talk the talk, your other grades are good, and you seem genuinely interested in bk.

Full disclosure: I got a B+ in bk and ended up clerking for a bk judge --> doing bk work at a good law firm.

There is hope, lil bro.




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