2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Seek and share information about clerkship applications, clerkship hiring timelines, and post-clerkship employment opportunities.
Forum rules
Anonymous Posting

Anonymous posting is only appropriate when you are sharing sensitive information about clerkship applications and clerkship hiring. You may anonymously respond on topic to these threads. Unacceptable uses include: harassing another user, joking around, testing the feature, or other things that are more appropriate in the lounge.

Failure to follow these rules will get you outed, warned, or banned."
Anonymous User
Posts: 273316
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Oct 25, 2013 1:25 pm

Does anyone know anything about Judge Howell (D.D.C.)?

Haven't been able to rustle up much info about her as a boss, etc.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273316
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 26, 2013 11:33 am

I work for a COA chambers that is sticking to the Plan. 2Ls -- please don't submit applications to our chambers in the hopes that we'll make an exception for you. We want to see at least one or two more semesters' worth of grades before considering you, and sending in an application with only 1Ls grades despite a clear notice on OSCAR saying we're on the Plan is a good way to get an express trip to the autoding pile.

Sorry. Vent over.

User avatar
ph14
Posts: 3225
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2011 11:15 pm

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby ph14 » Sat Oct 26, 2013 11:58 am

Anonymous User wrote:I work for a COA chambers that is sticking to the Plan. 2Ls -- please don't submit applications to our chambers in the hopes that we'll make an exception for you. We want to see at least one or two more semesters' worth of grades before considering you, and sending in an application with only 1Ls grades despite a clear notice on OSCAR saying we're on the Plan is a good way to get an express trip to the autoding pile.

Sorry. Vent over.


You really shouldn't fault applicants. Not every judge updates their Oscar page, and maybe the applicant is unsure whether it is last year, before the plan really collapsed.

User avatar
A. Nony Mouse
Posts: 22842
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:51 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Sat Oct 26, 2013 12:59 pm

Admittedly, the little express statement that YES this judge follows the plan or NO the judge does not follow the plan is new to OSCAR as of the last application cycle, so I can see why judges would expect someone to pay attention to it. But I also sympathize with the applicants - there's always been a significant disconnect between information on OSCAR and how judges actually hire, and now the plan is on life support, so it's even harder for applicants to know what to do. I've just sent out stuff early in the past, hoping not to miss someone's hiring window. (So if I were that judge, I'd just file the early applicants away, and wait to consider them if they updated later with additional grades, rather than auto-dinging them. But of course, the judge gets to hire however they like.)

Anonymous User
Posts: 273316
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 26, 2013 1:45 pm

Yeah, taking it out on the applicant doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Unless your judge explicitly requests you burn those apps, I'd file them (just like the vast majority of your fellow COA chambers do) - the only downside being that if the applicant doesn't send an updated transcript, you won't be able to compare them to those applicants who read the tea leaves correctly and (either through laziness or luck) applied later in the cycle.

If you really want to cut down on early apps, write an explicit note on OSCAR indicating that you will not consider an applicant unless they have x number of semesters of grades on their transcript. The on plan/off plan checkbox is essentially worthless. Were you an alum applicant or something, such that you wouldn't realize how obvious that is? I'd hope anyone who's been on the other end of this ridiculous application process would be slightly more understanding.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273316
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Oct 26, 2013 2:20 pm

Does anyone know if Judge Garth (3rd Cir) really only takes 1 term clerk?

ClerkAdvisor
Posts: 177
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:38 pm

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby ClerkAdvisor » Sun Oct 27, 2013 1:30 am

Anonymous User wrote:I work for a COA chambers that is sticking to the Plan. 2Ls -- please don't submit applications to our chambers in the hopes that we'll make an exception for you. We want to see at least one or two more semesters' worth of grades before considering you, and sending in an application with only 1Ls grades despite a clear notice on OSCAR saying we're on the Plan is a good way to get an express trip to the autoding pile.

Sorry. Vent over.


A bit petty, eh? It really doesn't take that long to file the apps... Plus, more likely than not, they were going to be rejected anyways... And, how does one even know how to follow the plan? My judges have never followed the plan, but its hard to fault students applying early when, if I recall correctly, they moved up the plan date by 3 months in the middle of the application process.

That said, students would be well-advised to apply earlier than later.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273316
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:36 am

Anonymous User wrote:I work for a COA chambers that is sticking to the Plan. 2Ls -- please don't submit applications to our chambers in the hopes that we'll make an exception for you. We want to see at least one or two more semesters' worth of grades before considering you, and sending in an application with only 1Ls grades despite a clear notice on OSCAR saying we're on the Plan is a good way to get an express trip to the autoding pile.

Sorry. Vent over.


OP here. I admit the comment was a bit hastily made, and I figure I have some 'splainin to do. If I were a clerkship applicant, I would follow the general rule to apply early if the judge was known to be off plan or it wasn't clear from an OSCAR posting, etc. If there was an old "we stick to the hiring plan" message from the '13 or '14 cycle, I might give the chambers a call and just ask if they intend on staying with the Plan for the '15 cycle. If the clerkship description said the chambers was on plan or there was some other indication on OSCAR that the judge was sticking to the Plan for the upcoming cycle, I'd probably hold off on an application.

In any event, we do file applications and will give everyone a serious look once Plan time rolls around again. I didn't mean to suggest otherwise (just so current applicants can rest easy). The autoding comment was crudely constructed and wasn't well thought out. Mea culpa. It really was directed at the rare applicant who submits an application explicitly stating in their cover letter something to the effect of, "I saw on your OSCAR posting that you're not taking applications now, but just in case you are, here it is." I sympathize with someone who just doesn't know what the timeline is and takes a chance. But if you tell us in your cover letter that you know we're not taking applications now and admit that you've decided to send one in anyway, I suppose I'm not as sympathetic. If you're not sure what the tea leaves say, it may be best to refrain from mentioning the fact that our OSCAR posting says we're on plan.

ClerkAdvisor is absolutely correct. Aside from calling chambers, there is just no way of knowing whether a judge is on plan. Even the old data are unreliable because the Plan dates keep moving up and judges may have changed their minds in light of the June timetable.

User avatar
bruinfan10
Posts: 510
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2011 12:25 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby bruinfan10 » Mon Oct 28, 2013 11:21 am

That makes sense. And I will say that I did call all the chambers to which I applied for my first clerkship to make sure I wouldn't offend anyone by sending an application early. But I don't think many people feel comfortable intruding into chambers like that, and many JA's aren't too keen on it.

User avatar
Arbiter213
Posts: 2249
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2010 10:16 pm

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Arbiter213 » Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:25 pm

So glad to have aged out of the plan restrictions.

User avatar
bk1
Posts: 18421
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2010 7:06 pm

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby bk1 » Tue Oct 29, 2013 7:28 pm

ph14 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I work for a COA chambers that is sticking to the Plan. 2Ls -- please don't submit applications to our chambers in the hopes that we'll make an exception for you. We want to see at least one or two more semesters' worth of grades before considering you, and sending in an application with only 1Ls grades despite a clear notice on OSCAR saying we're on the Plan is a good way to get an express trip to the autoding pile.

Sorry. Vent over.


You really shouldn't fault applicants. Not every judge updates their Oscar page, and maybe the applicant is unsure whether it is last year, before the plan really collapsed.

Not only this where information is out of date, but I have seen plenty of judges have patently false information posted on OSCAR.

As for advice to applicants: I think there is a very real chance (as evinced by the anon) that submitting too early can get you autodinged though I don't think that it's applicable to a large percentage of judges. Obviously the ideal time to apply is when the judge is looking at applications, but the reality is that it isn't always that easy to time things perfectly. I think the best thing to do is err on the side of submitting too early since the downside of too early (some judges will autoding you) is far smaller than the downside of too late (the judge is no longer hiring).

User avatar
hoos89
Posts: 1969
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:09 pm

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby hoos89 » Sat Nov 02, 2013 2:35 pm

.
Last edited by hoos89 on Sun Apr 12, 2015 12:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
A. Nony Mouse
Posts: 22842
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:51 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Sat Nov 02, 2013 6:23 pm

Yes to sending off-plan apps by snail-mail (unless there's info somewhere that the chambers accepts applications by e-mail, but IME that's uncommon).

As for contacting chambers - I don't think it generally hurts (it's not like you have to ID yourself), it's just a lot of work if you're sending out a reasonable number of applications. Also, what year are you in school? If you're a 3L, absolutely send everything ASAP - you're way behind the curve. If you're a 2L, though, I would wait till you get fall grades back - that's still pretty early, even with the plan change (unless you're applying to the uber-selective REALLY-early hirers, but if that's the case, you probably have other people you can ask about this).

User avatar
Arbiter213
Posts: 2249
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2010 10:16 pm

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Arbiter213 » Sat Nov 02, 2013 11:05 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:Yes to sending off-plan apps by snail-mail (unless there's info somewhere that the chambers accepts applications by e-mail, but IME that's uncommon).

As for contacting chambers - I don't think it generally hurts (it's not like you have to ID yourself), it's just a lot of work if you're sending out a reasonable number of applications. Also, what year are you in school? If you're a 3L, absolutely send everything ASAP - you're way behind the curve. If you're a 2L, though, I would wait till you get fall grades back - that's still pretty early, even with the plan change (unless you're applying to the uber-selective REALLY-early hirers, but if that's the case, you probably have other people you can ask about this).


This is the 15-16 thread- arguably for non DC/2d circuit, this is still too early to apply even as a 3L.

User avatar
A. Nony Mouse
Posts: 22842
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:51 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Sat Nov 02, 2013 11:10 pm

Arbiter213 wrote:
A. Nony Mouse wrote:Yes to sending off-plan apps by snail-mail (unless there's info somewhere that the chambers accepts applications by e-mail, but IME that's uncommon).

As for contacting chambers - I don't think it generally hurts (it's not like you have to ID yourself), it's just a lot of work if you're sending out a reasonable number of applications. Also, what year are you in school? If you're a 3L, absolutely send everything ASAP - you're way behind the curve. If you're a 2L, though, I would wait till you get fall grades back - that's still pretty early, even with the plan change (unless you're applying to the uber-selective REALLY-early hirers, but if that's the case, you probably have other people you can ask about this).


This is the 15-16 thread- arguably for non DC/2d circuit, this is still too early to apply even as a 3L.

RC fail. Sorry.

User avatar
hoos89
Posts: 1969
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:09 pm

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby hoos89 » Mon Nov 04, 2013 4:45 pm

https://oscar.symplicity.com/blog_post/ ... iring_Plan


2Ls can now sign up. Also looks like you can send apps through OSCAR ahead of the hiring plan.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273316
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:43 pm

Pooler has hired at least one for 15-16.

User avatar
Danger Zone
Posts: 7305
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:36 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Danger Zone » Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:09 pm

hoos89 wrote:https://oscar.symplicity.com/blog_post/_1/21/OSCAR_De-links_from_the_Hiring_Plan


2Ls can now sign up. Also looks like you can send apps through OSCAR ahead of the hiring plan.

In. There are a lot of judges that appear to be looking at apps from 2Ls already. Geez, I thought I was getting in on this early :?

User avatar
hoos89
Posts: 1969
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:09 pm

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby hoos89 » Tue Nov 05, 2013 6:34 pm

.
Last edited by hoos89 on Sun Apr 12, 2015 12:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Scotusnerd
Posts: 813
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 7:36 pm

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Scotusnerd » Tue Nov 05, 2013 7:17 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I work for a COA chambers that is sticking to the Plan. 2Ls -- please don't submit applications to our chambers in the hopes that we'll make an exception for you. We want to see at least one or two more semesters' worth of grades before considering you, and sending in an application with only 1Ls grades despite a clear notice on OSCAR saying we're on the Plan is a good way to get an express trip to the autoding pile.

Sorry. Vent over.



Anon, could you update us on this now that the bombshell about the plan being scrapped dropped? I'm curious as to what you folks are up to.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273316
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Nov 06, 2013 9:03 am

Scotusnerd wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I work for a COA chambers that is sticking to the Plan. 2Ls -- please don't submit applications to our chambers in the hopes that we'll make an exception for you. We want to see at least one or two more semesters' worth of grades before considering you, and sending in an application with only 1Ls grades despite a clear notice on OSCAR saying we're on the Plan is a good way to get an express trip to the autoding pile.

Sorry. Vent over.



Anon, could you update us on this now that the bombshell about the plan being scrapped dropped? I'm curious as to what you folks are up to.


We're reevaluating our hiring schedule. In the meantime, I'll stick to the advice I gave later on in this thread: apply unless you have reason not to (e.g., OSCAR post says don't apply if you don't have at least one semester's worth of 2L grades).

Anonymous User wrote:
OP here. I admit the comment was a bit hastily made, and I figure I have some 'splainin to do. If I were a clerkship applicant, I would follow the general rule to apply early if the judge was known to be off plan or it wasn't clear from an OSCAR posting, etc. If there was an old "we stick to the hiring plan" message from the '13 or '14 cycle, I might give the chambers a call and just ask if they intend on staying with the Plan for the '15 cycle. If the clerkship description said the chambers was on plan or there was some other indication on OSCAR that the judge was sticking to the Plan for the upcoming cycle, I'd probably hold off on an application.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273316
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Nov 10, 2013 8:01 pm

If you have a 2014 district clerkship and are applying for 2015 circuit clerkships, how should that be signaled in your application? In the cover letter?

User avatar
A. Nony Mouse
Posts: 22842
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:51 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Sun Nov 10, 2013 8:05 pm

I would definitely mention it in your cover letter, although it should be listed on your resume anyway.

Anonymous User
Posts: 273316
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 12, 2013 3:53 pm

Updates? Rumors about who is interviewing?

Anonymous User
Posts: 273316
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: 2015-2016 Clerkship Application Thread

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Nov 12, 2013 11:56 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Updates? Rumors about who is interviewing?


Griffith on DC Cir.
Reinhardt on 9th.




Return to “Judicial Clerkships”

Who is online

The online users are hidden on this forum.