Clerks Taking Questions Forum

[Anonymous User]

Can a transfer applicant send the new school transcript only or do will it not be a complete app unless you send in both schools transcript?

I just talked to one chamber's secretary who is in charge of applications who said just to send in the current school. This doesn't sound right to me but personally, I'd rather not send in first school. My first school may make the difference of me NOT getting the clerkship. If this secretary was incorrect & I only send in the current school transcript do you think my app will be overlooked/thrown out....?

Thank you.

[Tangerine Gleam]

Does your new school transcript have your 1L grades from your previous school?

[Anonymous User]

Does your new school transcript have your 1L grades from your previous school?

The classes are listed, no grades. The secretary said judge is only concerned with 2L grades. Do you think I can get away with only new school transcript?

[Anonymous User]

Some questions about recommendations:

1. How long before D-day should recommenders place calls to judges?
2. Will a judge care if one's recommenders are all 1L professors? I really didn't make any close connections to any faculty during 2L.
3. How are recommendations from other clerks viewed? I'm externing for a fed COA judge right now, and can get a recommendation from the clerks in the chambers (but not the judge). Are these given much less weight than, say, professor recommendations?

[Anonymous User]

I am sure this has been asked and answered somewhere in this 50+ page thread, but what is the norm for writing sample length? I will be using my Law Review Note and it is 40 pages double spaced. I am obviously going to cut it down, but how many pages should I shoot for?

[Anonymous User]

Does your new school transcript have your 1L grades from your previous school?

The classes are listed, no grades. The secretary said judge is only concerned with 2L grades. Do you think I can get away with only new school transcript?

Maybe for that one judge. For everyone else, you need to send both. Every judge I have ever come into contact with, or heard about, evaluates candidates total academic performance, as opposed to just one particular year.

Yea, I'd love to just send in current school transcript to this one particular judge but do you think the secretary could possibly be wrong or not truly understand what I was saying? Do I call her yet again? Do I trust that her authority is the final word? if not, do I send in app without 1L school then call & ask "is my file complete?"? Will I believe her when she then says "yes it is complete"? Believe me, I wouldn't put you guys through all this anguish if I wasn't much better off without the 1L school transcript. Thank you.

[Anonymous User]

For those of us who sent our applications via snail mail (as opposed to OSCAR) and were too cheap to pay for delivery confirmation, how long should we wait before contacting chambers to confirm that they received the application? I was thinking 2-3 weeks seems reasonable. Am I off base?

[Anonymous User]

For those of us who sent our applications via snail mail (as opposed to OSCAR) and were too cheap to pay for delivery confirmation, how long should we wait before contacting chambers to confirm that they received the application? I was thinking 2-3 weeks seems reasonable. Am I off base?

Unless chambers is expecting your application (i.e., a recommender called/emailed the judge about you) or you have some other specific connection to the judge, I don't really see any point in doing this.

[Anonymous User]

For those of us who sent our applications via snail mail (as opposed to OSCAR) and were too cheap to pay for delivery confirmation, how long should we wait before contacting chambers to confirm that they received the application? I was thinking 2-3 weeks seems reasonable. Am I off base?

Unless chambers is expecting your application (i.e., a recommender called/emailed the judge about you) or you have some other specific connection to the judge, I don't really see any point in doing this.

any point in doing what? confirming that it got there? why would chambers need to expect my application? I'm not understanding ....

[Anonymous User]

For those of us who sent our applications via snail mail (as opposed to OSCAR) and were too cheap to pay for delivery confirmation, how long should we wait before contacting chambers to confirm that they received the application? I was thinking 2-3 weeks seems reasonable. Am I off base?

They received your application... and hundreds of others, and thus it's infeasible for them to notify everyone who applied that their application was received.

[ToTransferOrNot]

For those of us who sent our applications via snail mail (as opposed to OSCAR) and were too cheap to pay for delivery confirmation, how long should we wait before contacting chambers to confirm that they received the application? I was thinking 2-3 weeks seems reasonable. Am I off base?

Unless chambers is expecting your application (i.e., a recommender called/emailed the judge about you) or you have some other specific connection to the judge, I don't really see any point in doing this.

any point in doing what? confirming that it got there? why would chambers need to expect my application? I'm not understanding ....

/facepalm

[Citizen Genet]

Don't contact chambers to see if they received your application; if you are concerned enough about it, buy the tracking for .85 cents.

[Anonymous User]

I am sure this has been asked and answered somewhere in this 50+ page thread, but what is the norm for writing sample length? I will be using my Law Review Note and it is 40 pages double spaced. I am obviously going to cut it down, but how many pages should I shoot for?

Just bumping so it doesn't get lost. Hoping to edit my Note down over the weekend and would like to know how many pages to shoot for. Thanks!

[Anonymous User]

For clerkship apps where I'm sure you receive a lot of resumes where students have had their LR note published, how do you recommend listing it? Does a separate publication section just for a LR note come across as douchey? Should it just be as a bullet point under the LR line under education? I'm curious as to how it comes across to clerks who are reviewing hundreds of these resumes.

[Anonymous User]

For clerkship apps where I'm sure you receive a lot of resumes where students have had their LR note published, how do you recommend listing it? Does a separate publication section just for a LR note come across as douchey? Should it just be as a bullet point under the LR line under education? I'm curious as to how it comes across to clerks who are reviewing hundreds of these resumes.

You could place it under an other category at the bottom; or under your the law review entry. This really just depends on how much work experience and other items you have on your resume (i.e., if you are K-JD you can probably waste more space than if you worked for a decade). As far as how it's viewed, I have no idea (only a soon to be a clerk). I imagine like most things, however, that all things being equal between two candidates, it helps. I doubt that its going to overcome a non-competitive GPA for a given judge, nor a lack of strong recommenders; but, it certainly can only help.

As a side note (not directed at above), I've noticed that people are starting to get far more demanding of GTL's advice -- he's doing a great service by taking the time to answer questions. Don't bump something instead of looking to see whether he answered it.

[kalvano]

It's my understanding that publications are a big deal, and warrant a separate section on your resume.

[me!0712]

Not sure if any of the clerks are still taking questions but here it goes. I have just been accepted to schools and I'm trying to make a decision based on my chances at getting a CoA clerkship (I know, I know, this is extremely difficult but hey shoot for the moon and you will land among the stars right?) I know that grades are extremely important but besides that what about school rank/prestige. I'm currently trying to decide between UT, Berkeley and Michigan. Do you think I will have a decent chance at a CoA crekship coming out of UT with extremely good grades? Or would Berkeley or Mich. give me better chances over all?

[leobowski]

This is a little dated but still fairly useful: http://lawclerkaddict2009.blogspot.com/ ... chart.html

I'm surprised that Texas doesn't have the lead out of those schools; I would have thought it dominated regionally.

[Anonymous User]

Not sure if any of the clerks are still taking questions but here it goes. I have just been accepted to schools and I'm trying to make a decision based on my chances at getting a CoA clerkship (I know, I know, this is extremely difficult but hey shoot for the moon and you will land among the stars right?) I know that grades are extremely important but besides that what about school rank/prestige. I'm currently trying to decide between UT, Berkeley and Michigan. Do you think I will have a decent chance at a CoA crekship coming out of UT with extremely good grades? Or would Berkeley or Mich. give me better chances over all?

I do not know if there are data out there that would help us answer this question with any degree of confidence. USNWR publishes Article III placement, and some schools get slightly more granular than that, but we would need multi-year COA data for all three schools to give an accurate answer.

One thing to consider is whether you want any COA clerkship or specific ones. For instance, if you refuse to clerk in Lexington, Kentucky, or El Dorado, Arkansas, that might affect your
preferences. UM and UT are more likely to place people in those sort of locations than Boalt. My loose, generally unsupported guess, is that all three schools place about the same number of COA clerks per capita, with Michigan placing most broadly and UT focused in the south and southeast.

Thank you! That makes sense, and I really just want any COA crekship not a specific one.

[Anonymous User]

This is a little dated but still fairly useful: http://lawclerkaddict2009.blogspot.com/ ... chart.html

I'm surprised that Texas doesn't have the lead out of those schools; I would have thought it dominated regionally.

The link was helpful. Thanks!

[Anonymous User]

What are the exit options like for a state supreme court clerk in a large state (think CA, NY, IL, TX, MA)? Is biglaw an option?

[Anonymous User]

What are the exit options like for a state supreme court clerk in a large state (think CA, NY, IL, TX, MA)? Is biglaw an option?

Biglaw probably is an option for some clerks from the courts you mention. IIRC, the CA supreme court does not have term clerks. The others probably do a good job placing their clerks into in-state biglaw and midlaw. But I doubt any of the clerkships you mention are a lock for biglaw, or even close to it. Things are tough out there right now.

[ggocat]

What are the exit options like for a state supreme court clerk in a large state (think CA, NY, IL, TX, MA)? Is biglaw an option?

Biglaw probably is an option for some clerks from the courts you mention. IIRC, the CA supreme court does not have term clerks. The others probably do a good job placing their clerks into in-state biglaw and midlaw. But I doubt any of the clerkships you mention are a lock for biglaw, or even close to it. Things are tough out there right now.

This. But state supreme court clerkships in those states are probably going to be more difficult or about as difficult to obtain as biglaw generally. I would be surprised if many clerks did not already have biglaw doors open to them before the clerkship.

I cringe when you mentioned MA state courts, though. I am reminded of these stories:
(1) MA state courts rescind two dozen offers to prospective law clerks. http://abovethelaw.com/2009/05/massachu ... ip-offers/
(2) MA state courts hire deferred biglaw associates (still on the payroll at firms) as year-long "volunteer interns" to replace the booted prospective law clerks.
http://abovethelaw.com/2009/06/deferred ... achusetts/

[traydeuce]

It's my understanding that UT has one of the best clerkship counselors out there - also that they did really well this year. Berkeley may play better on the 9th, though, and some firms will value a 9th cir clerkship more than a clerkship on one of the circuits where UT's strongest (e.g. 5, 10).

[Anonymous User]

It's my understanding that UT has one of the best clerkship counselors out there - also that they did really well this year. Berkeley may play better on the 9th, though, and some firms will value a 9th cir clerkship more than a clerkship on one of the circuits where UT's strongest (e.g. 5, 10).

I'm not sure firms (or anyone) really cares about which circuit someone clerks on. If a firm regularly files in certain districts, then clerking on that COA would probably be relevant. Likewise, a firm that does a ton of administrative litigation might like DC more. Otherwise, I don't really see why a firm would care which Circuit someone clerks on (self-selection probably drives more of a coastal bias, to the extent one exists). And, honestly, I've never heard of anyone other than law students trying to engage in a ranking of circuits. For the vast majority of people, the best clerkship is one that provides the best learning experience/quality of life rather than marginal prestige differences between circuits.

I would add the caveat that the district of a district court clerkship is probably more important. There is something to be said about the experience that is gained in SDNY/EDNY/NDCA/EDVA versus a random district.