Clerks Taking Questions

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Mar 24, 2018 1:56 pm

Does anyone know what the pay is for EDNY for someone 3 years out of law school by the time they start their clerkship? I wasn't sure what step I'd be on the GS scale.

ExperssioUnius

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby ExperssioUnius » Sat Mar 24, 2018 3:02 pm

JSP-13 would put you at $99,927 with the locality cost of living increase. Here is a link to the table:

http://www.uscourts.gov/sites/default/f ... k_2018.pdf

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:37 pm

What can one expect with a judge who hires on a "rolling" hiring timeline? Interviewed with a judge who has hired 2/4, but I forgot to ask him about his hiring timeline. I am guessing that there is no polite way to ask now, is there?

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:50 pm

Sry pls ignore -- accidental double post.

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Apr 04, 2018 10:35 pm

rpupkin wrote:
lavarman84 wrote:
I will not be doing it on principle. I will stand up to judicial abuses of my wallet by picking something trivial. Take that judge bond paper carer abouter.

Truthfully, I just don't think it's worth the time or effort for the marginal benefit.

I hope you realize that many parts of your application—including stuff like the content of your cover letter, the 1L internship on your resume, and that third LOR from a professor who really doesn't know you that well—are of marginal benefit.

For my judge, I'd say that 98% of what mattered was law school + grades + phone calls from profs my judge knew + interview. Everything else was pretty marginal. But that doesn't mean it was a good idea for an applicant to ignore the other stuff, as you never know when the 2% will matter.


This forum has been very helpful. I am currently applying to clerkships. I was talking to a colleague (non-lawyer) about the process. When I got to the point where I explained that you upload your grades she raised her eyebrow and said "so you can put in anything."

So this is a question for people on the other side that have helped their judge pick the next law clerk. How do you know that the grades posted on the grade report are accurate? Do these clerkships require anything beyond the grade sheet and an unofficial transcript? Or are we all operating on a honor system? Do chambers ever request the official transcript?

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 05, 2018 9:59 am

Anonymous User wrote:This forum has been very helpful. I am currently applying to clerkships. I was talking to a colleague (non-lawyer) about the process. When I got to the point where I explained that you upload your grades she raised her eyebrow and said "so you can put in anything."

So this is a question for people on the other side that have helped their judge pick the next law clerk. How do you know that the grades posted on the grade report are accurate? Do these clerkships require anything beyond the grade sheet and an unofficial transcript? Or are we all operating on a honor system? Do chambers ever request the official transcript?


Almost 100% honor system. But faking grades to a federal judge is the kind of thing that, if caught, would probably get you expelled from law school (if still in school) and would likely prevent you from ever being admitted to any bar (or disbarred if already admitted).

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby o0o0o0o » Thu Apr 05, 2018 11:17 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:This forum has been very helpful. I am currently applying to clerkships. I was talking to a colleague (non-lawyer) about the process. When I got to the point where I explained that you upload your grades she raised her eyebrow and said "so you can put in anything."

So this is a question for people on the other side that have helped their judge pick the next law clerk. How do you know that the grades posted on the grade report are accurate? Do these clerkships require anything beyond the grade sheet and an unofficial transcript? Or are we all operating on a honor system? Do chambers ever request the official transcript?


Almost 100% honor system. But faking grades to a federal judge is the kind of thing that, if caught, would probably get you expelled from law school (if still in school) and would likely prevent you from ever being admitted to any bar (or disbarred if already admitted).


See, e.g., https://dealbook.nytimes.com/2014/01/09 ... aw-school/

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Apr 09, 2018 3:54 pm

I've had a couple interviews with federal judges where after the interview a staff person or clerk says "we'll be in touch in some time - let us know if you get any other offers." Then I don't hear back from chambers for weeks, or in some cases months. Soft reject or is my application still under consideration? Anyone else had this experience?

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Apr 09, 2018 8:30 pm

o0o0o0o wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:This forum has been very helpful. I am currently applying to clerkships. I was talking to a colleague (non-lawyer) about the process. When I got to the point where I explained that you upload your grades she raised her eyebrow and said "so you can put in anything."

So this is a question for people on the other side that have helped their judge pick the next law clerk. How do you know that the grades posted on the grade report are accurate? Do these clerkships require anything beyond the grade sheet and an unofficial transcript? Or are we all operating on a honor system? Do chambers ever request the official transcript?


Almost 100% honor system. But faking grades to a federal judge is the kind of thing that, if caught, would probably get you expelled from law school (if still in school) and would likely prevent you from ever being admitted to any bar (or disbarred if already admitted).


See, e.g., https://dealbook.nytimes.com/2014/01/09 ... aw-school/


I can say that in my chambers, my judge has authorized me to reach out to professors who taught both me and the applicant (assuming he/she went to my law school), and to ask them what they think. Several times, I have mentioned the applicant's grade in the class, and two professors actually remembered the grade. If the professor had said he/she did not give that grade, I would immediately reported the discrepancy to my judge and the law school. Do not mess around with these transcripts.

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 14, 2018 3:08 am

Anonymous User wrote:I've had a couple interviews with federal judges where after the interview a staff person or clerk says "we'll be in touch in some time - let us know if you get any other offers." Then I don't hear back from chambers for weeks, or in some cases months. Soft reject or is my application still under consideration? Anyone else had this experience?


Did anyone give you a timeframe on the hiring decision? In all likelihood a soft reject. That said, I did get an offer for one of my clerkships a solid 6-8 weeks after my interview, so there is still a slim chance. Then again, I also interviewed for a position where, two years later, I'm still waiting for my rejection letter. If you have not already sent a thank you card, it would be fair to reach out to a clerk and check on the status of your application.

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby connordalto » Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:04 pm

I'm finishing up 1L at a T20 with a 3.9 GPA (top 5%), moot court, and hopefully will be grading onto law review. Hoping to do a fed d. ct. clerkship, any region acceptable. Chance me??

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby ExperssioUnius » Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:19 pm

connordalto wrote:I'm finishing up 1L at a T20 with a 3.9 GPA (top 5%), moot court, and hopefully will be grading onto law review. Hoping to do a fed d. ct. clerkship, any region acceptable. Chance me??


If you get similar grades in the spring (and maybe 2L fall for judges who hire a bit later), you'll be very competitive and should get some interviews so long as you don't apply to only the most competitive districts. Just remember, although you have strong stats, judge's get hundreds of applications so always best to apply broadly.

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:27 pm

connordalto wrote:I'm finishing up 1L at a T20 with a 3.9 GPA (top 5%), moot court, and hopefully will be grading onto law review. Hoping to do a fed d. ct. clerkship, any region acceptable. Chance me??


Definitely competitive. Figure out from your school’s clerkship office which judges and courts have frequently hired from your school in the past. Your numbers are good enough that any judge with a history of hiring from your school should at least give your application a look.

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:04 am

Any idea the extent to which being EIC of your school's Law Review boosts your odds at Federal Clerkships? Like if you're only at a T20, top 33% grades, but then get EIC of LR?

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:17 am

Is it worth it to do a clerkship >> big law for 1-2 years >> circuit clerkship?

Also, when is it justified to make such a move? Is it mainly for prestige or do most people do this because they're interested in appellate lit/upscale lit boutiques.

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Apr 20, 2018 3:23 pm

FascinatedWanderer wrote:
jrf12886 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I know SDNY is the golden ticket for district court clerkships but would EDNY be considered a close second? In terms of overall job prospects after clerkship/prestige.


For NY firms, they typically invite 2d Cir., SDNY, and EDNY clerks to their clerk hiring events. I believe clerking at any of those courts will get your application seriously considered at most NY firms. I assume the general preference is 2d Cir>SDNY>EDNY, but that may be more correlation that causation, since that's also the general order of selectivity of those clerkships. Also, it is hard to get any of those clerkships, so I am not sure firms really make these fine distinctions.


And this is largely a geographical thing. NDCA/CDCA/DDC clerks logistically cannot make it out to NYC clerk receptions. I think that by and large the SDNY clerk pool probably has stronger credentials than CDCA/NDCA, but if your credentials are the same I don't think you're going to suffer for having clerked in LA or SF rather than NYC.



Looking for general advice about how to strategize apps for district court clerkships. I think my prospects should be solid: I'm finishing up 1L at a T14, and if my second semester grades mirror first, I'll be somewhere in the top 10-15% of the class. I'm interested in district court because I want to go trial litigation, preferably at a top big law.

What I'm trying to figure out is how to prioritize districts. I'm open to practicing many places, preferably a coastal city or Chicago. So aside from the fact that clerking in any given city will give you a leg up in that particular city, what's the general consensus on best/most prestigious districts? Also how much does prestige of the district affect my odds of a prestigious lit placement?

I know it's a rough estimate but here's what I'm thinking so far (in order). Am I on track?

SDNY/DDC (these even better than flyover circuits like 8/10?)
ND Cal
EDNY/ND Ill/D Mass
All other Cal (ED, CD, SD)/EDPa/DDel (only for bankruptcy work)
Other big cities (Seattle, Phoenix, Baltimore, Dallas, Houston)
Everything else

Also how much does the district's prestige carry over to senior judges? Like if I land a senior SDNY is the better than an active in like Philly/Boston/LA?

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby jd20132013 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:59 pm

no one cares, focus on finding a good clerkship experience not “prestige”

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby BlackAndOrange84 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:10 pm

I wish this were satire. Please tell me it is.

Anonymous User wrote:
FascinatedWanderer wrote:
jrf12886 wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I know SDNY is the golden ticket for district court clerkships but would EDNY be considered a close second? In terms of overall job prospects after clerkship/prestige.


For NY firms, they typically invite 2d Cir., SDNY, and EDNY clerks to their clerk hiring events. I believe clerking at any of those courts will get your application seriously considered at most NY firms. I assume the general preference is 2d Cir>SDNY>EDNY, but that may be more correlation that causation, since that's also the general order of selectivity of those clerkships. Also, it is hard to get any of those clerkships, so I am not sure firms really make these fine distinctions.


And this is largely a geographical thing. NDCA/CDCA/DDC clerks logistically cannot make it out to NYC clerk receptions. I think that by and large the SDNY clerk pool probably has stronger credentials than CDCA/NDCA, but if your credentials are the same I don't think you're going to suffer for having clerked in LA or SF rather than NYC.



Looking for general advice about how to strategize apps for district court clerkships. I think my prospects should be solid: I'm finishing up 1L at a T14, and if my second semester grades mirror first, I'll be somewhere in the top 10-15% of the class. I'm interested in district court because I want to go trial litigation, preferably at a top big law.

What I'm trying to figure out is how to prioritize districts. I'm open to practicing many places, preferably a coastal city or Chicago. So aside from the fact that clerking in any given city will give you a leg up in that particular city, what's the general consensus on best/most prestigious districts? Also how much does prestige of the district affect my odds of a prestigious lit placement?

I know it's a rough estimate but here's what I'm thinking so far (in order). Am I on track?

SDNY/DDC (these even better than flyover circuits like 8/10?)
ND Cal
EDNY/ND Ill/D Mass
All other Cal (ED, CD, SD)/EDPa/DDel (only for bankruptcy work)
Other big cities (Seattle, Phoenix, Baltimore, Dallas, Houston)
Everything else

Also how much does the district's prestige carry over to senior judges? Like if I land a senior SDNY is the better than an active in like Philly/Boston/LA?

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby mjb447 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:33 pm

I’d need to see the underlying numbers.

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Necho2 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:51 pm

Lol @ subtly trying to slip the rest of CA districts below freaking Mass/IL...

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 21, 2018 1:51 am

Necho2 wrote:Lol @ subtly trying to slip the rest of CA districts below freaking Mass/IL...


EDCA and SDCA are absolutely less “prestigious” than NDIL (Chicago), which is close to on par with CDCA. D. Mass. is probably nationally regarded as a better clerkship than both of the “outer California” districts as well. (Standard disclaimer, of course, that any California district will be preferable to NDIL/D.Mass. if you are planning to practice in California.)

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby jd20132013 » Sat Apr 21, 2018 8:59 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Necho2 wrote:Lol @ subtly trying to slip the rest of CA districts below freaking Mass/IL...


EDCA and SDCA are absolutely less “prestigious” than NDIL (Chicago), which is close to on par with CDCA. D. Mass. is probably nationally regarded as a better clerkship than both of the “outer California” districts as well. (Standard disclaimer, of course, that any California district will be preferable to NDIL/D.Mass. if you are planning to practice in California.)



cool story

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Sat Apr 21, 2018 1:13 pm

Everyone's ranking is subtly different. I think it is:

SDNY
DDC/ND Cal
CD Cal/ND Ill/D Mass/EDNY
Other big cities + other district courts in CA/NY + D. Del (for patent or BK especially)
Everything else

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 24, 2018 10:49 am

When I graduate, I'll be clerking for a district judge and then for a circuit judge. My understanding is that my district judge likes clerks to attend court.

I'm wondering how I should plan to dress for my clerkship(s)? Suit every day? Or can I get away with business formal dresses that aren't actually a suit. I'm trying to plan my wardrobe and am wondering what percentage of it needs to be made up of suits versus nice dresses/sweaters/etc.

If it makes a difference in answering, the courts are two of the following: EDNY/SDNY/DDC, 2/DC/1.

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Re: Clerks Taking Questions

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 24, 2018 2:28 pm

Anonymous User wrote:When I graduate, I'll be clerking for a district judge and then for a circuit judge. My understanding is that my district judge likes clerks to attend court.

I'm wondering how I should plan to dress for my clerkship(s)? Suit every day? Or can I get away with business formal dresses that aren't actually a suit. I'm trying to plan my wardrobe and am wondering what percentage of it needs to be made up of suits versus nice dresses/sweaters/etc.

If it makes a difference in answering, the courts are two of the following: EDNY/SDNY/DDC, 2/DC/1.


District Court: You should assume you'll be in court every day. Wear court-appropriate clothes, or have them available. I'm a male, so I wore or had available a suit and tie every day. For women, I don't think a suit is strictly necessary -- e.g., a blazer over a nice dress is probably fine.

Court of Appeals: Most days you won't be in court. It depends much more on the judge and the culture of the chambers. Business formal during argument days/weeks.



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