Michigan State Law Class of 2015 Forum

[accidentalhippy]

I think I've narrowed down my choice. It's pretty crazy that I'm up thinking about this right now when I've got work in six hours! Right now MSU at 75% off is so damn tempting given my risk aversion. But I've been fortunate to break the T25 with 25% off. Anyone who knows they are attending MSU care to share their reasoning behind their decision? It's a good school that looks like it is on the rise so now It's just listing the pros and cons to make a decision.

Why I've chosen MSU:

• *I hate non-dischargeable debt & I have a full tuition scholly from MSU;
  *I want to eventually practice in MI, in service of a particular niche;
  *Since even some Harvard 3Ls are having to think outside the box career-wise, I'd rather go into law school planning to do so from the outset and without taking on crazy debt;
  *I like the campus vibe and the resources available for student parents, along with the family-friendliness of the Lansing area;
  *I'm really keen on the Urban Food, Farm & Ag Law practicum that'll be a clinic starting in the fall AND the small business/nonprofit clinic. Also at ASD, Dean H announced the launch of a Global Food Law program in the fall (I'm a bit of a foodie & I seriously dig gardening)

What I'm not looking forward to:

• *Tornado warnings. Seriously. I got caught in that nasty storm that made national news last week and let me tell you, this recovering Californian was seriously jonesing for an earthquake instead;
  *The uncertainty about MSU's long-term reputation. The rankings chatter is amusing sometimes, but let's face it, we want the school to continue climbing, not peak at 82.

Anyway, those are the thoughts of a career-changing, single mom.

[tooswolle]

I think I've narrowed down my choice. It's pretty crazy that I'm up thinking about this right now when I've got work in six hours! Right now MSU at 75% off is so damn tempting given my risk aversion. But I've been fortunate to break the T25 with 25% off. Anyone who knows they are attending MSU care to share their reasoning behind their decision? It's a good school that looks like it is on the rise so now It's just listing the pros and cons to make a decision.

Why I've chosen MSU:

• *I hate non-dischargeable debt & I have a full tuition scholly from MSU;
  *I want to eventually practice in MI, in service of a particular niche;
  *Since even some Harvard 3Ls are having to think outside the box career-wise, I'd rather go into law school planning to do so from the outset and without taking on crazy debt;
  *I like the campus vibe and the resources available for student parents, along with the family-friendliness of the Lansing area;
  *I'm really keen on the Urban Food, Farm & Ag Law practicum that'll be a clinic starting in the fall AND the small business/nonprofit clinic. Also at ASD, Dean H announced the launch of a Global Food Law program in the fall (I'm a bit of a foodie & I seriously dig gardening)

What I'm not looking forward to:

• *Tornado warnings. Seriously. I got caught in that nasty storm that made national news last week and let me tell you, this recovering Californian was seriously jonesing for an earthquake instead;
  *The uncertainty about MSU's long-term reputation. The rankings chatter is amusing sometimes, but let's face it, we want the school to continue climbing, not peak at 82.

Anyway, those are the thoughts of a career-changing, single mom.

Thanks for the quick response. From the sounds of it you're a fellow Californian. I suppose I'll write a scholarship reconsideration letter tommorrow. I know MSU is ranked in the 80's but it's improving each year. I highly suspect it could eventually land in the T1 range in the near future if they keep on recruiting people with stronger numbers. With that being said from the outset I knew I wanted to attend a law school. MSU rocks in sports is always a plus; I just really hope I don't regret forging a T25 school or another top school that offered me a deferred admission...... Does anyone know how employment prospects are for students at MSU? That's my biggest fear to be honest.

[accidentalhippy]

Thanks for the quick response. From the sounds of it you're a fellow Californian. I suppose I'll write a scholarship reconsideration letter tommorrow. I know MSU is ranked in the 80's but it's improving each year. I highly suspect it could eventually land in the T1 range in the near future if they keep on recruiting people with stronger numbers. With that being said from the outset I knew I wanted to attend a law school. MSU rocks in sports is always a plus; I just really hope I don't regret forging a T25 school or another top school that offered me a deferred admission...... Does anyone know how employment prospects are for students at MSU? That's my biggest fear to be honest.

My pleasure. Clearly I'm up late too.

At ASD I got the impression that the students who maximized networking opportunities with faculty and through summer placements were enjoying some success on the job market. This was also reiterated by faculty who, in the panel, cited examples of students who had RAed with them and were able to find work through the profs' connections. In effect, it sounds like folks who treat law school as more of a professional apprenticeship and start the job hustle early do better than folks who treated it like school, only belatedly taking the networking opportunities seriously.

It was also interesting that none of the students in the unmediated student lunch mentioned placement in posh regional law firms. That could've been a scheduling issue (ie no students with those placements could attend that day, since our ASD was the last Saturday of spring break).

If you want to eventually return to Cali to practice, you might ask the alumni office for the contact information for alums in the market where you want to work.

[tooswolle]

Thanks for the quick response. From the sounds of it you're a fellow Californian. I suppose I'll write a scholarship reconsideration letter tommorrow. I know MSU is ranked in the 80's but it's improving each year. I highly suspect it could eventually land in the T1 range in the near future if they keep on recruiting people with stronger numbers. With that being said from the outset I knew I wanted to attend a law school. MSU rocks in sports is always a plus; I just really hope I don't regret forging a T25 school or another top school that offered me a deferred admission...... Does anyone know how employment prospects are for students at MSU? That's my biggest fear to be honest.

My pleasure. Clearly I'm up late too.

At ASD I got the impression that the students who maximized networking opportunities with faculty and through summer placements were enjoying some success on the job market. This was also reiterated by faculty who, in the panel, cited examples of students who had RAed with them and were able to find work through the profs' connections. In effect, it sounds like folks who treat law school as more of a professional apprenticeship and start the job hustle early do better than folks who treated it like school, only belatedly taking the networking opportunities seriously.

It was also interesting that none of the students in the unmediated student lunch mentioned placement in posh regional law firms. That could've been a scheduling issue (ie no students with those placements could attend that day, since our ASD was the last Saturday of spring break).

If you want to eventually return to Cali to practice, you might ask the alumni office for the contact information for alums in the market where you want to work.

Thanks for the the advice. Where I work isn't so much of a concern to me. I'm a younger individual with no ties other then family I'm CA. The biggest fear is leaving a good paying job and ending up getting paid the same as before or less! In the end getting a good paying job is the main concern and I'm sure the top students fair well, but one can't assume that going in. I suppose I could just deposit the 350 soon and worry about the te final decision a little after that. If my T25 offered me an increased scholarship I'd go there but as it stands 166,000 compared to 75,000 in debt after graduation I'm leaning towards MSU.

[lawgeekgrl]

I love MSU. If I didn't have a strong interest in staying in California, I'd go there in a heartbeat.

[knotts]

The rankings chatter is amusing sometimes, but let's face it, we want the school to continue climbing, not peak at 82.[/list]

I can't see MSU peaking at 82. Besides climbing for the past several years, its a nationally known school and they seem to have a lot of money to entice applicants that would otherwise be going to a t1 school. If I don't get off the wait list at UC Davis (fellow Californian), I will definitely be going here.

[lawgeekgrl]

The rankings chatter is amusing sometimes, but let's face it, we want the school to continue climbing, not peak at 82.[/list]

I can't see MSU peaking at 82. Besides climbing for the past several years, its a nationally known school and they seem to have a lot of money to entice applicants that would otherwise be going to a t1 school. If I don't get off the wait list at UC Davis (fellow Californian), I will definitely be going here.

Wow, I can't believe so many Californians are into it.

I love MSU's philosophy, that's why I would have loved to go there.

[knotts]

Wow, I can't believe so many Californians are into it.

I love MSU's philosophy, that's why I would have loved to go there.

I'm excited about it even though I will be leaving family, friends, and gf. I plan on returning to CA after graduation, but I realize that I may be stuck for a few years doing legal work in MI or IL. Plus the 75% scholarship is hard to refuse.

[lawgeekgrl]

Wow, I can't believe so many Californians are into it.

I love MSU's philosophy, that's why I would have loved to go there.

I'm excited about it even though I will be leaving family, friends, and gf. I plan on returning to CA after graduation, but I realize that I may be stuck for a few years doing legal work in MI or IL. Plus the 75% scholarship is hard to refuse.

You're my hero.

I also had 75% at MSU, but 15% at Irvine. MSU was really one of my choices, but I couldn't pass up going to Irvine since I really wanted to go there :/

[accidentalhippy]

The rankings chatter is amusing sometimes, but let's face it, we want the school to continue climbing, not peak at 82.[/list]

I can't see MSU peaking at 82. Besides climbing for the past several years, its a nationally known school and they seem to have a lot of money to entice applicants that would otherwise be going to a t1 school. If I don't get off the wait list at UC Davis (fellow Californian), I will definitely be going here.

Wow, I can't believe so many Californians are into it.

I love MSU's philosophy, that's why I would have loved to go there.

I'm a former Californian (San Jose, San Diego and Santa Cruz), soon to be a former Washingtonian.

I also dig the MSU philosophy and the professional climate of the place. I don't expect that it will peak at 82 either. Whether it will ever break the top tier... who knows? I don't really care, since what I plan to do is a bit off-the-wall anyway and the ranking won't matter. I'm more impressed with the bar exam passage rates and their determination to be honest with students about the state of the legal job market for their graduates. Nothing in life is guaranteed, but making decisions based on information from professionals who demonstrate a genuine and sincere commitment to helping their students learn and prepare for the field, makes the uncertainties much easier to handle.

[lawgeekgrl]

I'm a former Californian (San Jose, San Diego and Santa Cruz), soon to be a former Washingtonian.

I also dig the MSU philosophy and the professional climate of the place. I don't expect that it will peak at 82 either. Whether it will ever break the top tier... who knows? I don't really care, since what I plan to do is a bit off-the-wall anyway and the ranking won't matter. I'm more impressed with the bar exam passage rates and their determination to be honest with students about the state of the legal job market for their graduates. Nothing in life is guaranteed, but making decisions based on information from professionals who demonstrate a genuine and sincere commitment to helping their students learn and prepare for the field, makes the uncertainties much easier to handle.

Seriously. I heard people say "Hastings job placement at graduation at 40% is abysmal." And all I do is sit back and think, there's no freaking way all law schools in the country can place in the 90s. No freaking way. But no one seems to get this!

[accidentalhippy]

Seriously. I heard people say "Hastings job placement at graduation at 40% is abysmal." And all I do is sit back and think, there's no freaking way all law schools in the country can place in the 90s. No freaking way. But no one seems to get this!

I remember reading somewhere that something like 45k law school grads are produced annually, but there are only about 25k positions open in a year (and I think that includes attrition from retirement, career-changers and deaths [natural and otherwise http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKCQNx0m ... ata_player - I love mockumentaries]).

I believe in a nation of laws, there will always be a need for professionals who have a keen understanding of the law. En route to becoming one, we may just have to think outside the box a bit and network, network, network.

[lawgeekgrl]

Seriously. I heard people say "Hastings job placement at graduation at 40% is abysmal." And all I do is sit back and think, there's no freaking way all law schools in the country can place in the 90s. No freaking way. But no one seems to get this!

I remember reading somewhere that something like 45k law school grads are produced annually, but there are only about 25k positions open in a year (and I think that includes attrition from retirement, career-changers and deaths [natural and otherwise http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKCQNx0m ... ata_player - I love mockumentaries]).

I believe in a nation of laws, there will always be a need for professionals who have a keen understanding of the law. En route to becoming one, we may just have to think outside the box a bit and network, network, network.

Too bad you're not coming to my school. I'd love to be able to mingle with individuals who can think like this.

We need government, we need laws. This won't go away for a while. So the profession will stick. We just need to innovate, make ourselves relevant again!

MSU is very lucky to have you.

[accidentalhippy]

Too bad you're not coming to my school. I'd love to be able to mingle with individuals who can think like this.

We need government, we need laws. This won't go away for a while. So the profession will stick. We just need to innovate, make ourselves relevant again!

MSU is very lucky to have you.

Aw, shucks (http://youtu.be/EDY9awmmWtA), thank you LGG! But I'm sure there will be people awesome folks at UCI too.

[Wick3d0n3]

Wow, I can't believe so many Californians are into it.

I love California and have lived here all my life! It was a hard decision to leave all this beautiful weather, family and friends for the cold and bleak winters of Michigan. I wanted so dearly to make USF work out but it was just too expensive. If Michigan State didn't have such a strong academic and writing program then my decision to stay here in California would be a quick and easy one. Instead, I'm making the trip, embarking on the journey, and taking the plunge. MSU, I hope you're ready for me!

[PrinceKasra]

Hi everyone. I am from Los Angeles and I have been accepted to Michigan State as well. I will most likely attend this upcoming fall unless I miraculously get an acceptance from one of my California schools. My only reason for hesitating to choose MSU is because I would live far from my family, but I would be looking forward to attending this great school.

[sammyk]

Hey guys!

I just want to quickly congratulate everyone who was accepted at this school, and wish everyone good luck who is still waiting on this school or any of their dream schools!

I just wanted to know if anyone had any insight as to how long the applications take to go off of review?

I have been complete and on review since March 15th, I know it hasn't even been a month yet, but I am so ANXIOUS! I guess no news is good news?

[ChristFirst]

Hey guys!

I just want to quickly congratulate everyone who was accepted at this school, and wish everyone good luck who is still waiting on this school or any of their dream schools!

I just wanted to know if anyone had any insight as to how long the applications take to go off of review?

I have been complete and on review since March 15th, I know it hasn't even been a month yet, but I am so ANXIOUS! I guess no news is good news?

When I applied, they accepted me in a few weeks. Have you called the Admissions Office yet to check the status?

[spartanlaw877]

Hey guys, I hope everyone is enjoying life at MSU Law.

I am currently an undergrad here at MSU applying to law school.

What have you all enjoyed in your first few months here, what haven't you?

And if you don't mind, what scores GPA/LSAT did you report to get the scholarships you did? I am looking for a full-ride. Did you have any insight on how to wait out your response to their offer to get more money?


Thanks

[llachans]

I ended up not attending MSU, but I got a 75% scholarship with a 3.5/160. Hope that helps!

Edit: I'm not entirely sure, but I believe MSU has a floor for each of it's scholarship percentages. If you dig around their site, I'm sure you could find out what their floor is for a full ride.

[Rdubs]

Hey guys, I hope everyone is enjoying life at MSU Law.

I am currently an undergrad here at MSU applying to law school.

What have you all enjoyed in your first few months here, what haven't you?

And if you don't mind, what scores GPA/LSAT did you report to get the scholarships you did? I am looking for a full-ride. Did you have any insight on how to wait out your response to their offer to get more money?


Thanks

158 + 3.6 gets you a full-ride. 161 + 3.75 gets you King's Scholars (or at least it did last cycle).

As far as waiting MSU out for a better offer, don't bet on it. I tried that game, and every other game I could think of (lower grade stip, no grade stip, enrolling early, taking more credits the first semester, pretty much anything I could think of to test whether they were willing to work with me) and they would not budge. Perhaps it is the mentality that playing hard ball will get them into the higher ranks faster, but I found that pretty much every school that was ranked higher was willing to work with me in order to get me to attend. MSU basically said "this is what you get, take it or leave it." I ended up leaving it for an absurd amount of debt at a higher ranked school after my LSAT jumped, but had they been more flexible I might have taken the offer and forgone re-taking that dreaded test.

Good luck in your cycle.

PS: While they weren't willing to budge, showing their offer to other schools got me $75k + more than had I not negotiated elsewhere, so if you aren't set on MSU Law you could definitely use that scholarship to get a better offer from a different school.


With all of that said, anyone still reading this should check out the Law School Word of the Day facebook group! Now that you've adjusted to life as a 1L, the time has come to have a little fun on your cold calls.

http://www.facebook.com/groups/295266493918891/