Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

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03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Fri May 01, 2015 1:24 am

i don't understand how that could possibly translate into diminishing revenues. fy 2010 revenues were 2.064 billion. fy 2015 they're projecting 2.799 billion. the major capital expenditures for uae were years ago

explain

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rpupkin
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby rpupkin » Fri May 01, 2015 1:24 am

rpupkin wrote:The stage is set for a savage 1L vs. 2L rivalry at NYU Law next year.

I am confident that TLS will have front-row seats.


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star fox
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby star fox » Fri May 01, 2015 1:47 am

Brut wrote:moving a spot or two up or down in some random magazine's ranking is completely meaningless
who cares what bob morse and us news thinks about law schools?

there are many factors prospective students should be paying attention to. us news rankings aren't one of them

Solid initial post. Why did you have to engage this skool fellow?

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Fri May 01, 2015 1:53 am

i saw that
was better the way you had it :wink:

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star fox
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby star fox » Fri May 01, 2015 2:13 am

Brut wrote:i saw that
was better the way you had it :wink:

yeah auto correct.

dabigchina
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby dabigchina » Fri May 01, 2015 4:27 am

A better question is will t6 be a destination anybody should care about in 10 years

The answer is no.

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jbagelboy
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby jbagelboy » Fri May 01, 2015 11:29 pm

christ. this thread was the worst before brut started doing his thing. now its just rancid

for the purposes of us news and world report, the ranking of the top six schools -- or any school -- depends on the metric applied, which could undergo a change. the rankings have zero independent, exogenous rooting; they depend on input variables determined by the editors of a commercial magazine.

the rankings would definitely change if, for example, the editors removed the bloated emphasis on applicant standardized exam scores and LSAC reported undergraduate GPAs. or they could decide to emphasize some more obscure criteria, like acceptance rate (which would help yield protect abusers significantly) or faculty publication or graduate salaries.

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Fri May 01, 2015 11:40 pm

my responses were proportionate to his stupidity

there's no sense in trying to fix the usnwr methodology
if you get rid of lsat/gpa, they'll just have to weigh prestige factors more (look at what atl does w/ scotus clerks)
student selectivity might actually be a better measure of prestige than reputation outside of top schools, since i doubt attorneys can meaningfully judge the reputation of random tier 2 schools

unless we say fuck prestige altogether and go off of outcomes
in which case c>hys
which you would celebrate, but seems disingenuous to me

idk how you get around the hys problem
Last edited by 03152016 on Fri May 01, 2015 11:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby BizBro » Fri May 01, 2015 11:40 pm


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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby jbagelboy » Sat May 02, 2015 12:09 am

Brut wrote:my responses were proportionate to his stupidity

there's no sense in trying to fix the usnwr methodology
if you get rid of lsat/gpa, they'll just have to weigh prestige factors more (look at what atl does w/ scotus clerks)
student selectivity might actually be a better measure of prestige than reputation outside of top schools, since i doubt attorneys can meaningfully judge the reputation of random tier 2 schools

unless we say fuck prestige altogether and go off of outcomes
in which case c>hys
which you would celebrate, but seems disingenuous to me

idk how you get around the hys problem


lol. ranking by determining where to place the ranked items a priori and then constructing a quantitative methodology that produces that outcome falls somewhere between theatrical inanity and the political philosophy of joseph goebbels. you are wringing your hands for nothing

they don't "have" to do anything to make a particular school fall in a particular slot. they could adjust the metric as they have in the past to reflect a different theory of excellence
Last edited by jbagelboy on Sat May 02, 2015 12:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:10 am

i don't think we should rank schools at all
i'm just saying your method is dumb

e: the post this was in reply to was edited
Last edited by 03152016 on Sat May 02, 2015 12:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

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jbagelboy
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby jbagelboy » Sat May 02, 2015 12:11 am

Brut wrote:i don't think we should rank schools at all
i'm just saying your method is dumb


my method? please, enlighten me as to where I provided a "method"

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:14 am

come on bagel you're trying too hard
we know why you want to eliminate student selectivity

the rankings are fucked to begin with
there's no sense in trying to "fix" it

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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby jbagelboy » Sat May 02, 2015 12:21 am

right, I didn't articulate a method, you just inferred one. regardless, agreed that rankings are fucked and I am neither in favor of nor do I care for any of the changes available to us news other than eliminating their practice of ranking academic institutions altogether

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:24 am

acceptance rate is just another way to get at prestige, it's no better than lsat/gpa
faculty publication? i can't think of a worse way for students to base their decision
graduate salaries? maybe when we have decent disclosure. but as things stand? no.

getting rid of last/gpa simply puts more weight on reputation factors that are completely meaningless for most regionals. student selectivity is basically a proxy for reputation for ~100 schools most lawyers have barely heard of
and it puts more weight on ft/lt, which is easily manipulable and isn't a good measure of placement at top schools

let's not try to square the circle
the rankings are fucked per se

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:24 am

jbagelboy wrote:right, I didn't articulate a method, you just inferred one. regardless, agreed that rankings are fucked and I am neither in favor of nor do I care for any of the changes available to us news other than eliminating their practice of ranking academic institutions altogether

ya i agree w this entirely

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:29 am

.
Last edited by 03152016 on Sat May 02, 2015 12:34 am, edited 1 time in total.

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jbagelboy
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby jbagelboy » Sat May 02, 2015 12:30 am

Brut wrote:acceptance rate is just another way to get at prestige, it's no better than lsat/gpa
faculty publication? i can't think of a worse way for students to base their decision
graduate salaries? maybe when we have decent disclosure. but as things stand? no.

getting rid of last/gpa simply puts more weight on reputation factors that are completely meaningless for most regionals. student selectivity is basically a proxy for reputation for ~100 schools most lawyers have barely heard of
and it puts more weight on ft/lt, which is easily manipulable and isn't a good measure of placement at top schools

let's not try to square the circle
the rankings are fucked per se


I think you realize that I wasn't suggesting the above because I think they qualify as valuable alternatives, I was illustrating the idea that the rankings would change if you modified the input variables by identifying some of the more prominent examples used by other ranking systems, which is something US News could do, regardless of whether you or I find it stochastically or normatively appropriate

ETA: I did not edit anything out of any of my posts. I added to one of them.

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:37 am

my bad was referencing the wrong post

of course the rankings change if you change the inputs

i don't see how lsat/gpa is worse or more disproportionately emphasized than any of the other factors they use, except maybe employment

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:40 am

like the reputational factor thing is dumb
to me at least
but it seems the weight given to lsat/gpa makes it less dumb
b/c it corrects for the fact that most practitioners have no knowledge whatsoever of half the schools in the poll

not to keep belaboring the same point

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:43 am

i take a more parochial view of law schools
lsat/gpa seems to get at what reputation gets at, but on a more regional basis

03152016
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby 03152016 » Sat May 02, 2015 12:54 am

bagel i'm about to self impose a ban bc i have absolutely no self control and will fail finals
was hoping for a reply before i made the request, but i gtg

if you or anyone else wants to continue the convo plz pm me with e-mail in subject header (that way i'll see it when i get the pm notification in my e-mail)

bye all see you in a few weeks

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jbagelboy
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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby jbagelboy » Sat May 02, 2015 12:55 am

Brut wrote:i take a more parochial view of law schools
lsat/gpa seems to get at what reputation gets at, but on a more regional basis


whatever floats your boat. I tend to agree that there is a place for selectivity (and in pursuit of manageable standards, to fall back on undergraduate performance and standardized test scores) in thinking about these schools. I don't know if its a 25% place. I don't really have very sophisticated thoughts on the issue actually. What it shows most to me is that institutional signaling perpetuates itself, which isn't a very nuanced or debatable point. it just reflects how stupid the exercise is to begin with

gl with finals brut

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Re: Will the T-6 be the same 10 years from now?

Postby Hikikomorist » Sat May 02, 2015 2:32 am

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... _endowment

Relative to other schools with large endowments, NYU seems to have handled theirs well in recent years, as they've had solid growth. It's still not in great shape, given the number of students, but they seem headed in the right direction.




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