how was legal employment during the boom years?

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resilience99
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how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby resilience99 » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:04 pm

There are about 22,000 - 24,000 entry level legal jobs for graduating law student for the past couple years. What was the number of entry level jobs between the years 2000-2007 ? how much better was it?

Void
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby Void » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:02 pm

resilience99 wrote:There are about 22,000 - 24,000 entry level legal jobs for graduating law student for the past couple years. What was the number of entry level jobs between the years 2000-2007 ? how much better was it?


It was way better.

Why does this thread exist?

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CG614
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby CG614 » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:26 pm

Void wrote:
resilience99 wrote:There are about 22,000 - 24,000 entry level legal jobs for graduating law student for the past couple years. What was the number of entry level jobs between the years 2000-2007 ? how much better was it?


It was way better.

Why does this thread exist?

This is a legit question. I think the magnitude is interesting. Why do you feel the need to internet bully?

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Amity
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby Amity » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:48 pm

Shooting fish in a barrel was a common sentiment. How far down the food chain this went would be interesting to know but this sentiment certainly existed with the majority of top tier 1 law schools.
Keep in mind that years ago employment data was manipulated by a number of schools.

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ggocat
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby ggocat » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:55 pm

"boom years" lol.

Lord Randolph McDuff
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:57 pm

CG614 wrote:
Void wrote:
resilience99 wrote:There are about 22,000 - 24,000 entry level legal jobs for graduating law student for the past couple years. What was the number of entry level jobs between the years 2000-2007 ? how much better was it?


It was way better.

Why does this thread exist?

This is a legit question. I think the magnitude is interesting. Why do you feel the need to internet bully?


Loser in real life.

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BarbellDreams
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby BarbellDreams » Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:13 pm

One of my friends graduated from a TTTT with a 2.5, graduated without looking for a job, failed the bar her first time and still got a biglaw offer the second she passed. In fact she said she had multiple biglaw firms that made her offers. She basically said anyone in her class who wanted an interview got one and most people who were not socially awkward received offers.

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CG614
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby CG614 » Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:33 pm

Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:
CG614 wrote:
Void wrote:
resilience99 wrote:There are about 22,000 - 24,000 entry level legal jobs for graduating law student for the past couple years. What was the number of entry level jobs between the years 2000-2007 ? how much better was it?


It was way better.

Why does this thread exist?

This is a legit question. I think the magnitude is interesting. Why do you feel the need to internet bully?


Loser in real life.

Good one. Now go back to your self loathing.


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Tiago Splitter
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby Tiago Splitter » Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:42 am

BarbellDreams wrote:One of my friends graduated from a TTTT with a 2.5, graduated without looking for a job, failed the bar her first time and still got a biglaw offer the second she passed. In fact she said she had multiple biglaw firms that made her offers. She basically said anyone in her class who wanted an interview got one and most people who were not socially awkward received offers.


Do you really think anyone believes this? Around 20% of all law grads landed biglaw jobs even in the best of times.

The idea that things were so much better pre-recession is one of the biggest flames going.

31,086 bar passage required jobs for class of 2007

27,224 bar passage required jobs for class of 2011

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IAFG
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby IAFG » Fri Oct 11, 2013 12:10 pm

Tiago Splitter wrote:
BarbellDreams wrote:One of my friends graduated from a TTTT with a 2.5, graduated without looking for a job, failed the bar her first time and still got a biglaw offer the second she passed. In fact she said she had multiple biglaw firms that made her offers. She basically said anyone in her class who wanted an interview got one and most people who were not socially awkward received offers.


Do you really think anyone believes this? Around 20% of all law grads landed biglaw jobs even in the best of times.

The idea that things were so much better pre-recession is one of the biggest flames going.

31,086 bar passage required jobs for class of 2007

27,224 bar passage required jobs for class of 2011

JDU and its whining was at its heyday during the boom. Lots of TT grads doing doc review being MAF.

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thesealocust
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby thesealocust » Sat Oct 12, 2013 1:58 pm

Big firm summer associate positions probably went from a peak near 6,000 to a low near 4,000. There was always a big problem of under or unemployment for the bottom law schools, but it was easier to sweep under the rug in the expansive heighday of big firm hiring.

When the majority of businesses are making money hand over fist, legal services can become cost insensitive. New hires tended to mean a better capacity to bill, and since everyone was busy each associate walking in the door meant a low-6 figure salary in exchange for potentially 7 figures of revenue.

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BarbellDreams
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby BarbellDreams » Sat Oct 12, 2013 2:19 pm

Tiago Splitter wrote:
BarbellDreams wrote:One of my friends graduated from a TTTT with a 2.5, graduated without looking for a job, failed the bar her first time and still got a biglaw offer the second she passed. In fact she said she had multiple biglaw firms that made her offers. She basically said anyone in her class who wanted an interview got one and most people who were not socially awkward received offers.


Do you really think anyone believes this? Around 20% of all law grads landed biglaw jobs even in the best of times.

The idea that things were so much better pre-recession is one of the biggest flames going.

31,086 bar passage required jobs for class of 2007

27,224 bar passage required jobs for class of 2011


Class of 2007? No, my friend graduated in the 90s. Apparently bottom 10% students went to PD/DA offices and those interviews were basically a formality because the offices wanted more people than were willing to work there. Also, I am not saying this was necessarily the norm, but she got what she got with literally the shittiest resume/connections/school/grades possible. Pick a secondary market without a T14 anywhere near it and look at the firm's senior partners credentials. Half of them went to joke schools that don't have a chance in hell right now. While biglaw was certainly not guaranteed, it was more or less a coinflip, and getting ANY legal job was basically guaranteed barring the shittiest personality of all time.

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Tiago Splitter
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby Tiago Splitter » Sat Oct 12, 2013 2:37 pm

BarbellDreams wrote:Class of 2007? No, my friend graduated in the 90s. Apparently bottom 10% students went to PD/DA offices and those interviews were basically a formality because the offices wanted more people than were willing to work there. Also, I am not saying this was necessarily the norm, but she got what she got with literally the shittiest resume/connections/school/grades possible. Pick a secondary market without a T14 anywhere near it and look at the firm's senior partners credentials. Half of them went to joke schools that don't have a chance in hell right now. While biglaw was certainly not guaranteed, it was more or less a coinflip, and getting ANY legal job was basically guaranteed barring the shittiest personality of all time.

I don't know anything about PD/DA, but your original post said people with awful grades from terrible schools were seeing BigLaw firms fight over them. This just simply isn't true. 13% of the class of 1999 found jobs in firms of 251+. And this link shows that things improved from the beginning of the 90's to the end across most markets. For the class of 2012 the number in firms of 251+ was down to about 10%. A drop certainly, but not a sea change.

EDIT: Here's a good link showing full time legal jobs from 1985-2000. Wasn't exactly rosy in the 1990's.

http://www.nalp.org/2001junemploymenttrends

mr.hands
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Re: how was legal employment during the boom years?

Postby mr.hands » Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:38 pm

Things were certainly a lot better for T14 students. Median and below students could get prestigious BigLaw jobs that paid market. Based on the (largely useless) anecdotal evidence i've heard, "ties" weren't as big of a deal either. (The question of *how much* better is probably unanswerable. It's difficult to quantify that.)

At non-T14 it may not have been as rosy, though. The stats quoted by the poster above speak to that fact




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