KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

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thelawdoctor
Posts: 416
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby thelawdoctor » Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:22 pm

ArthurEdens wrote:
deebs wrote:Anyone know of someone previously who didn't watch the videos and passed? I feel like I could make much better use of my time by just going through the outline books and bar notes, and then just hammering out practice questions. These videos put me to sleep.


I'm tempted to do the same, but I think that it's worth watching at 1.5x speed. It doesn't take up too much time (2-2.5 hrs) and is a good refresher before I really sit down to study/memorize the information. Learning the info in multiple formats, as cliched as it sounds, is probably a good idea, especially when the profs indicate the relative importance of different sections.

Although the bar app Qs throughout the lectures are mostly easy, there have been several where the answer wasn't obvious to me and clarified a point that was missing in the notes.

starchinkilt wrote:I dunno why Kaplan made me do a crim pro essay in my essay workshop when I haven't even gotten to crim pro in the schedule yet. It's like they want me to feel stupid and unprepared.


I'm saving the checkpoint quizzes until I've had a chance to review the information. Test prep companies love giving quizzes at the beginning just so they can say "look at how much improvement we provide to our students." I'll get more out of it once I'm more prepared.

I would say watch them, but remember that you don't want to void the refund/retake policy. I think if you click on the vids and then close them they still count as "watched" though as long as the checkmark is there.

tarheel87
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby tarheel87 » Mon Jun 10, 2013 10:20 pm

I'm averaging around 60-75% on the practice questions in general. My understanding based on our rep is that that is pretty good and low 60's should be enough to pass come test day (provided you do well on the essays). Remember: it is still super early. That being said, I am terrified of the essays.

Silverback
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby Silverback » Thu Jun 13, 2013 9:15 am

Has anyone reviewed their first submitted essay?

I just got mine back, and I can tell you that this is such a joke. The essay grader told me "nice job," but only made a few cursory remarks on essay itself, which were not helpful nor terribly insightful on his part. When it came to scoring, it seems as though he arbitrarily gave me a poor score on certain sections of the grading rubric. I reviewed the essay myself, and it contains all the formatting parts that Kaplan calls for, including IRAC format and headings. However, he said that I didn't follow IRAC? In the end, I got a "below standard" score. Keep in mind, I wrote all my essays in law school this way and have done very well.

At this point, I think I am understanding the Kaplan game. At least early on in the course, they are never going to tell you that you are doing well. Instead, it is their goal to dish out poor feedback on essays, checkpoint quizzes, etc. to induce you to study more. This may be beneficial to those who are slackers, but as someone who takes this seriously, I don't appreciate the manipulation. In the end, I believe it comes down to Kaplan's crusade against Barbi, and their reluctance to honor the free course guarantee. If they can tell you that you suck all along, they hope to scare students into studying more.

Maybe I am just being an anal perfectionist, but this stuff is starting to piss me off. The essay is what put me over the edge.

tarheel87
Posts: 144
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 8:22 pm

Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby tarheel87 » Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:01 pm

Silverback wrote:Has anyone reviewed their first submitted essay?

I just got mine back, and I can tell you that this is such a joke. The essay grader told me "nice job," but only made a few cursory remarks on essay itself, which were not helpful nor terribly insightful on his part. When it came to scoring, it seems as though he arbitrarily gave me a poor score on certain sections of the grading rubric. I reviewed the essay myself, and it contains all the formatting parts that Kaplan calls for, including IRAC format and headings. However, he said that I didn't follow IRAC? In the end, I got a "below standard" score. Keep in mind, I wrote all my essays in law school this way and have done very well.

At this point, I think I am understanding the Kaplan game. At least early on in the course, they are never going to tell you that you are doing well. Instead, it is their goal to dish out poor feedback on essays, checkpoint quizzes, etc. to induce you to study more. This may be beneficial to those who are slackers, but as someone who takes this seriously, I don't appreciate the manipulation. In the end, I believe it comes down to Kaplan's crusade against Barbi, and their reluctance to honor the free course guarantee. If they can tell you that you suck all along, they hope to scare students into studying more.

Maybe I am just being an anal perfectionist, but this stuff is starting to piss me off. The essay is what put me over the edge.


Honestly, this is starting to rub me the wrong way too. Maybe I'm just dumb, but it sure seems like they keep introducing entirely new topics and concepts on these practice quizzes so, accordingly, my grades on them are dropping like a stone (esp. this week; last week I was averaging in the upper 60s and this week low 50s). I've only submitted one essay but I had an experience that was very similar to yours.

Also, the Android App is 100% useless. Great in theory but simply does not work. I know I'm not alone on that because I looked up customer reviews as well and they all echo me.

That being said, DESPITE all that - I generally like the course. They need to work out some kinks (the app and essays being the main ones) but I think it is fundamentally well done.

mness
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby mness » Thu Jun 13, 2013 11:22 pm

tarheel87 wrote:
Silverback wrote:Has anyone reviewed their first submitted essay?

I just got mine back, and I can tell you that this is such a joke. The essay grader told me "nice job," but only made a few cursory remarks on essay itself, which were not helpful nor terribly insightful on his part. When it came to scoring, it seems as though he arbitrarily gave me a poor score on certain sections of the grading rubric. I reviewed the essay myself, and it contains all the formatting parts that Kaplan calls for, including IRAC format and headings. However, he said that I didn't follow IRAC? In the end, I got a "below standard" score. Keep in mind, I wrote all my essays in law school this way and have done very well.

At this point, I think I am understanding the Kaplan game. At least early on in the course, they are never going to tell you that you are doing well. Instead, it is their goal to dish out poor feedback on essays, checkpoint quizzes, etc. to induce you to study more. This may be beneficial to those who are slackers, but as someone who takes this seriously, I don't appreciate the manipulation. In the end, I believe it comes down to Kaplan's crusade against Barbi, and their reluctance to honor the free course guarantee. If they can tell you that you suck all along, they hope to scare students into studying more.

Maybe I am just being an anal perfectionist, but this stuff is starting to piss me off. The essay is what put me over the edge.


Honestly, this is starting to rub me the wrong way too. Maybe I'm just dumb, but it sure seems like they keep introducing entirely new topics and concepts on these practice quizzes so, accordingly, my grades on them are dropping like a stone (esp. this week; last week I was averaging in the upper 60s and this week low 50s). I've only submitted one essay but I had an experience that was very similar to yours.

Also, the Android App is 100% useless. Great in theory but simply does not work. I know I'm not alone on that because I looked up customer reviews as well and they all echo me.

That being said, DESPITE all that - I generally like the course. They need to work out some kinks (the app and essays being the main ones) but I think it is fundamentally well done.


I agree. I thought I was going crazy, but a lot of the red book questions and checkpoint quizzes include topics NOT covered in the lectures. Also, the course has so much work that I feel as though I'm already forgetting the first subjects we learned. I don't have the time, other than on weekends, to go back and do flashcards or practice Q's for older subjects. By the end of the course, I will have completely forgotten Contracts.

thelawdoctor
Posts: 416
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby thelawdoctor » Thu Jun 13, 2013 11:32 pm

mness wrote:
tarheel87 wrote:
Silverback wrote:Has anyone reviewed their first submitted essay?

I just got mine back, and I can tell you that this is such a joke. The essay grader told me "nice job," but only made a few cursory remarks on essay itself, which were not helpful nor terribly insightful on his part. When it came to scoring, it seems as though he arbitrarily gave me a poor score on certain sections of the grading rubric. I reviewed the essay myself, and it contains all the formatting parts that Kaplan calls for, including IRAC format and headings. However, he said that I didn't follow IRAC? In the end, I got a "below standard" score. Keep in mind, I wrote all my essays in law school this way and have done very well.

At this point, I think I am understanding the Kaplan game. At least early on in the course, they are never going to tell you that you are doing well. Instead, it is their goal to dish out poor feedback on essays, checkpoint quizzes, etc. to induce you to study more. This may be beneficial to those who are slackers, but as someone who takes this seriously, I don't appreciate the manipulation. In the end, I believe it comes down to Kaplan's crusade against Barbi, and their reluctance to honor the free course guarantee. If they can tell you that you suck all along, they hope to scare students into studying more.

Maybe I am just being an anal perfectionist, but this stuff is starting to piss me off. The essay is what put me over the edge.


Honestly, this is starting to rub me the wrong way too. Maybe I'm just dumb, but it sure seems like they keep introducing entirely new topics and concepts on these practice quizzes so, accordingly, my grades on them are dropping like a stone (esp. this week; last week I was averaging in the upper 60s and this week low 50s). I've only submitted one essay but I had an experience that was very similar to yours.

Also, the Android App is 100% useless. Great in theory but simply does not work. I know I'm not alone on that because I looked up customer reviews as well and they all echo me.

That being said, DESPITE all that - I generally like the course. They need to work out some kinks (the app and essays being the main ones) but I think it is fundamentally well done.


I agree. I thought I was going crazy, but a lot of the red book questions and checkpoint quizzes include topics NOT covered in the lectures. Also, the course has so much work that I feel as though I'm already forgetting the first subjects we learned. I don't have the time, other than on weekends, to go back and do flashcards or practice Q's for older subjects. By the end of the course, I will have completely forgotten Contracts.

At a certain point I will start doing the combined subjects tests to try to avoid that issue of forgetting the past issues too much.
What week do you plan to start doing the combos?

mness
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby mness » Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:05 am

thelawdoctor wrote:
mness wrote:
tarheel87 wrote:
Silverback wrote:Has anyone reviewed their first submitted essay?

I just got mine back, and I can tell you that this is such a joke. The essay grader told me "nice job," but only made a few cursory remarks on essay itself, which were not helpful nor terribly insightful on his part. When it came to scoring, it seems as though he arbitrarily gave me a poor score on certain sections of the grading rubric. I reviewed the essay myself, and it contains all the formatting parts that Kaplan calls for, including IRAC format and headings. However, he said that I didn't follow IRAC? In the end, I got a "below standard" score. Keep in mind, I wrote all my essays in law school this way and have done very well.

At this point, I think I am understanding the Kaplan game. At least early on in the course, they are never going to tell you that you are doing well. Instead, it is their goal to dish out poor feedback on essays, checkpoint quizzes, etc. to induce you to study more. This may be beneficial to those who are slackers, but as someone who takes this seriously, I don't appreciate the manipulation. In the end, I believe it comes down to Kaplan's crusade against Barbi, and their reluctance to honor the free course guarantee. If they can tell you that you suck all along, they hope to scare students into studying more.

Maybe I am just being an anal perfectionist, but this stuff is starting to piss me off. The essay is what put me over the edge.


Honestly, this is starting to rub me the wrong way too. Maybe I'm just dumb, but it sure seems like they keep introducing entirely new topics and concepts on these practice quizzes so, accordingly, my grades on them are dropping like a stone (esp. this week; last week I was averaging in the upper 60s and this week low 50s). I've only submitted one essay but I had an experience that was very similar to yours.

Also, the Android App is 100% useless. Great in theory but simply does not work. I know I'm not alone on that because I looked up customer reviews as well and they all echo me.

That being said, DESPITE all that - I generally like the course. They need to work out some kinks (the app and essays being the main ones) but I think it is fundamentally well done.


I agree. I thought I was going crazy, but a lot of the red book questions and checkpoint quizzes include topics NOT covered in the lectures. Also, the course has so much work that I feel as though I'm already forgetting the first subjects we learned. I don't have the time, other than on weekends, to go back and do flashcards or practice Q's for older subjects. By the end of the course, I will have completely forgotten Contracts.

At a certain point I will start doing the combined subjects tests to try to avoid that issue of forgetting the past issues too much.
What week do you plan to start doing the combos?


Good idea. Where do we find combined subject tests? Or are you referring to building custom MBE Q-Bank quizzes with multiple subjects?

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ndirish2010
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby ndirish2010 » Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:23 am

The site being down right now is not fun. I am working full time, so not being able to watch the video at night is putting me behind a day. This weekend should be so much fun.

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tstyler98
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby tstyler98 » Fri Jun 14, 2013 7:48 am

mness wrote:
tarheel87 wrote:
Silverback wrote:Has anyone reviewed their first submitted essay?

I just got mine back, and I can tell you that this is such a joke. The essay grader told me "nice job," but only made a few cursory remarks on essay itself, which were not helpful nor terribly insightful on his part. When it came to scoring, it seems as though he arbitrarily gave me a poor score on certain sections of the grading rubric. I reviewed the essay myself, and it contains all the formatting parts that Kaplan calls for, including IRAC format and headings. However, he said that I didn't follow IRAC? In the end, I got a "below standard" score. Keep in mind, I wrote all my essays in law school this way and have done very well.

At this point, I think I am understanding the Kaplan game. At least early on in the course, they are never going to tell you that you are doing well. Instead, it is their goal to dish out poor feedback on essays, checkpoint quizzes, etc. to induce you to study more. This may be beneficial to those who are slackers, but as someone who takes this seriously, I don't appreciate the manipulation. In the end, I believe it comes down to Kaplan's crusade against Barbi, and their reluctance to honor the free course guarantee. If they can tell you that you suck all along, they hope to scare students into studying more.

Maybe I am just being an anal perfectionist, but this stuff is starting to piss me off. The essay is what put me over the edge.


Honestly, this is starting to rub me the wrong way too. Maybe I'm just dumb, but it sure seems like they keep introducing entirely new topics and concepts on these practice quizzes so, accordingly, my grades on them are dropping like a stone (esp. this week; last week I was averaging in the upper 60s and this week low 50s). I've only submitted one essay but I had an experience that was very similar to yours.

Also, the Android App is 100% useless. Great in theory but simply does not work. I know I'm not alone on that because I looked up customer reviews as well and they all echo me.

That being said, DESPITE all that - I generally like the course. They need to work out some kinks (the app and essays being the main ones) but I think it is fundamentally well done.


I agree. I thought I was going crazy, but a lot of the red book questions and checkpoint quizzes include topics NOT covered in the lectures. Also, the course has so much work that I feel as though I'm already forgetting the first subjects we learned. I don't have the time, other than on weekends, to go back and do flashcards or practice Q's for older subjects. By the end of the course, I will have completely forgotten Contracts.


I don't really mind that there's questions on stuff not in the lecture. Don't need to have the lectures any longer than they already are. The material is probably less highly tested, but they want to make sure we see it in some form so that we don't come back after getting a question on the real thing and say "Kaplan didn't teach us that." If it's something I don't already have in a flashcard, I just make one for that material.

Silverback
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby Silverback » Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:54 pm

The teaching format for Evidence is rough. Looks like I will have to be doing a lot of leg work when I go to outline the material on my own.

london24
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby london24 » Fri Jun 14, 2013 3:53 pm

I'm a little behind because of a late graduation. Is the MPT video/practice even worth it? Seems straightforward enough but I don't want to spite myself.

Silverback
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby Silverback » Fri Jun 14, 2013 4:30 pm

london24 wrote:I'm a little behind because of a late graduation. Is the MPT video/practice even worth it? Seems straightforward enough but I don't want to spite myself.


Are you referring to the mini-course in the beginning before the actual bar course? I felt that it was since it gave you a general exposure to all of the areas that you will be going through in detail. Plus, you do quite a few MBE problems between each section, but I do believe that these questions are much easier than the ones that they give you later. I was crushing a few of the sections in the MPT, but later, the checkpoint quizzes seemed to be much more difficult, where I have been pleased with anything over 70%.

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starchinkilt
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby starchinkilt » Fri Jun 14, 2013 4:54 pm

Silverback wrote:The teaching format for Evidence is rough. Looks like I will have to be doing a lot of leg work when I go to outline the material on my own.


+1. This is awful. Luckily I got last years CMR from a friend, and that helped with a lot of the confusion.

london24
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby london24 » Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:17 pm

Silverback wrote:ring to the mini-course in the beginning before the actual bar course? I felt that it was since it gave you a general exposure to all of the areas that you will be going through in detail. Plus, you do quite a few MBE problems between each section, but I do believe that these questions are much easier than the ones that they give you later. I was crushing a few of the sections in the MPT, but later, the checkpoint quizzes seemed to be much more difficult, where I have been pleased with anything over 70%.


No sorry should have been more specific- I was talking about the Multistate Practice Test videos and exam for NY. I started practicing one and watched a little bit of the video and just feel like its a waste of time.

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ndirish2010
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby ndirish2010 » Fri Jun 14, 2013 10:45 pm

Silverback wrote:The teaching format for Evidence is rough. Looks like I will have to be doing a lot of leg work when I go to outline the material on my own.


Is it me, or are the bar app questions totally missing?

Silverback
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby Silverback » Sat Jun 15, 2013 9:05 am

ndirish2010 wrote:
Silverback wrote:The teaching format for Evidence is rough. Looks like I will have to be doing a lot of leg work when I go to outline the material on my own.


Is it me, or are the bar app questions totally missing?


If you go into the academic support tab, you will find that they have an update there for evidence, and in the update, there is a document that includes the bar applications and hypotheticals that the lecturer discusses. Additionally, it has some rules in there, but it is mainly questions and hypotheticals divided by topic. As the update explains, they are attempting to do this topic in a slightly different manner to make it "easier" for us. I think it is more of a pain in the ass to have to look at my bar notes and this handout at the same time. Moreover, I think its easier to pay attention when I have bar notes to actually fill in, whereas the evidence bar notes mostly have you follow along with only a few sections to complete on your own.

Whatever. So far, my technique has been to compile the bar notes into a "one sheet" after each day for the respective topic. Basically, I use the bar notes to boil down the information into an attack outline. It does take some time, but reorganizing the information into a more succinct form does make you think about the material and how it fits into the big picture. Evidence is going to require me to do some more work at this rate, and I may even bust out my FRE booklet.

In addition to the attack outline, I have another document going for my MBE workbook for each topic. Following the completion of each problem set, I start a new section with a header that includes the problems I did and the results I achieved. Below the header, I type out the information from the answers that I got wrong. For me, if I get something wrong and make it a point to review it, it always sticks in my head. Therefore, I feel it is almost beneficial for me to get things wrong, since it leaves an impression in my brain!

Going back to the essays, I got another essay back from the same grader who gave me a poor score last time. Again, he made very few comments, such as, "instead of using in this case' to start your application, you should use the word 'here.'" Wow thanks! Miraculously and in a similarly arbitrary fashion, he gave me a "meets the standard" as opposed to my previous "below the standard / failing." I get the feeling that the grader is some trained lackey and not an actual attorney or someone with legal experience. They really don't give any actual feedback other than the "additional comments" left a the bottom of the page. All of the other feedback you see seems to be rubber stamped after the grader fills out some sort of grading Kaplan grading rubric. Oh well. Either way it is practice.

mness
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby mness » Sat Jun 15, 2013 2:03 pm

I'm getting very frustrated with Kaplan. I'm scoring 50% on the Redbook Crim questions. They jammed all of crim law and crim pro into two days, and many of these Redbook questions are based on specific cases we do not know. The answer will state that "answer b, because so and so case held this," but it is not in the lecture or the outline. Plus the essay grading seems arbitrary. Starting to wish I just did Barbri.

uvauvauva
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby uvauvauva » Sat Jun 15, 2013 2:21 pm

I was a kaplan rep for two years. Used the product for one weeks.

I paid for Barbri.

Silverback
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby Silverback » Sat Jun 15, 2013 6:21 pm

To be honest, Barbri students haven't been getting nearly as much practice with MBE questions as I have with Kaplan. I am generally satisfied with Kaplan, but I wish that they gave you a bit more guidance on how you need to score on their practice problems.

I guess it is somewhat like weightlifting for a sport. You want to train heavy, and when game day comes, it seems like a breeze.

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MG95
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby MG95 » Sat Jun 15, 2013 9:54 pm

Checking in.
Last edited by MG95 on Thu Aug 13, 2015 5:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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SAOJD10
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby SAOJD10 » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:06 pm

Silverback wrote:To be honest, Barbri students haven't been getting nearly as much practice with MBE questions as I have with Kaplan. I am generally satisfied with Kaplan, but I wish that they gave you a bit more guidance on how you need to score on their practice problems.

I guess it is somewhat like weightlifting for a sport. You want to train heavy, and when game day comes, it seems like a breeze.



I know that in the orientation videos they said to shoot for 50% on the check point quizzes, but it would be nice to get a "goal" for the problem sets. I think they also said 115-117 on the midterm is what to shoot for raw score wise

Silverback
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby Silverback » Sun Jun 16, 2013 10:37 am

SAOJD10 wrote:
Silverback wrote:To be honest, Barbri students haven't been getting nearly as much practice with MBE questions as I have with Kaplan. I am generally satisfied with Kaplan, but I wish that they gave you a bit more guidance on how you need to score on their practice problems.

I guess it is somewhat like weightlifting for a sport. You want to train heavy, and when game day comes, it seems like a breeze.



I know that in the orientation videos they said to shoot for 50% on the check point quizzes, but it would be nice to get a "goal" for the problem sets. I think they also said 115-117 on the midterm is what to shoot for raw score wise


I am curious if the PMBR questions more closely resemble that of the actual bar questions. When contrasting the PMBR questions to the checkpoint quizzes and workbook problems, they seem much more manageable, where I can normally determine the answer by knowing the law. The PMBR questions may contain a few tricks that test an exception or particular intricacy in a rule, but they do not seem nearly as confusing as the questions we are doing now. The current questions almost seem like they are more aimed to confuse you or find some way to trip you up. However, I will admit that the PMBR questions now seem much easier after working through the current Kaplan questions. I suppose that this is the point of working through only difficult problems. Even so, a target goal for the current questions would be more reassuring, but I guess if you are let in the dark, you are more likely to take studying seriously.

mness
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby mness » Sun Jun 16, 2013 12:35 pm

Silverback wrote:
SAOJD10 wrote:
Silverback wrote:To be honest, Barbri students haven't been getting nearly as much practice with MBE questions as I have with Kaplan. I am generally satisfied with Kaplan, but I wish that they gave you a bit more guidance on how you need to score on their practice problems.

I guess it is somewhat like weightlifting for a sport. You want to train heavy, and when game day comes, it seems like a breeze.



I know that in the orientation videos they said to shoot for 50% on the check point quizzes, but it would be nice to get a "goal" for the problem sets. I think they also said 115-117 on the midterm is what to shoot for raw score wise


I am curious if the PMBR questions more closely resemble that of the actual bar questions. When contrasting the PMBR questions to the checkpoint quizzes and workbook problems, they seem much more manageable, where I can normally determine the answer by knowing the law. The PMBR questions may contain a few tricks that test an exception or particular intricacy in a rule, but they do not seem nearly as confusing as the questions we are doing now. The current questions almost seem like they are more aimed to confuse you or find some way to trip you up. However, I will admit that the PMBR questions now seem much easier after working through the current Kaplan questions. I suppose that this is the point of working through only difficult problems. Even so, a target goal for the current questions would be more reassuring, but I guess if you are let in the dark, you are more likely to take studying seriously.



What do you mean by PMBR questions?

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SAOJD10
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby SAOJD10 » Sun Jun 16, 2013 2:31 pm

What do you mean by PMBR questions?[/quote]


Probably means the redbook mbe questions and the questions you can do online

Silverback
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Re: KAPLAN BAR REVIEW hangout

Postby Silverback » Sun Jun 16, 2013 5:23 pm

The questions that they gave you during the intro crash course that took place prior to the actual bar course.




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