BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

(Study Tips, Dealing With Stress, Maintaining a Social Life, Financial Aid, Internships, Bar Exam, Careers in Law . . . )
User avatar
KeepitKind
Posts: 201
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 6:38 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby KeepitKind » Thu Jul 18, 2013 3:55 pm

kaiser wrote:
KeepitKind wrote:
kaiser wrote:
rnf1292 wrote:Does anyone have a short summary on car searches for MBE crim pro? My notes are confusing the hell out of me.


Always keep in mind the key overarching rule: If there is probable cause as to the car, the entire car can be searched, including all containers within. But the search of the car must be within the scope of the PC that justified the automobile search. So if they have PC over the car to find a stolen TV, you can't search the glove compartment. But if PC is for drugs, you can search anywhere drugs could reasonably be found (which includes many more small places). Of course, always distinguish this from the rules of searches incident to arrest (since the rules pertaining to car searches with the search is incident to arrest are different). Thus, as a threshold matter, determine why the car is being search. Was it incident to an arrest? Or did police have PC over the car for some reason, stopped the car, and conducted the search?


What about a Terry "frisk" of the car. Wouldn't that only require reasonable suspicion? And what are the limits on that semi-search?


I have to review back on a Terry frisk of the car, and what the procedure is. My guess is that it would be a quick protective sweep for weapons. Obviously would be pretty narrow. Of course, for the person, you can also seize contraband if you know from first touch that it is contraband (in that it takes no manipulation to figure out), but that doesn't really apply to cars.


Ok gotcha. I'm buried in Comm. Paper so prob won't look into it today, but please report back if you get a better understanding of the procedure before I do, and I'll do the same.

blong4133
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby blong4133 » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:03 pm

kaiser wrote:
rnf1292 wrote:Does anyone have a short summary on car searches for MBE crim pro? My notes are confusing the hell out of me.


Always keep in mind the key overarching rule: If there is probable cause as to the car, the entire car can be searched, including all containers within. But the search of the car must be within the scope of the PC that justified the automobile search. So if they have PC over the car to find a stolen TV, you can't search the glove compartment. But if PC is for drugs, you can search anywhere drugs could reasonably be found (which includes many more small places). Of course, always distinguish this from the rules of searches incident to arrest (since the rules pertaining to car searches with the search is incident to arrest are different). Thus, as a threshold matter, determine why the car is being search. Was it incident to an arrest? Or did police have PC over the car for some reason, stopped the car, and conducted the search?



I will add, that if you're searching a car pursuant to the automobile exception, the probable cause must exist before any search (whether of the person or the car).

So, if you have an officer who legitimately stops a car, but doesn't have probable cause to search, he can get that probable cause through plain view or some other method that doesn't involve an actual search. But once the officer performs any search (i.e. a terry frisk), the automobile exception goes out the window. based on the facts, you may be able to search based on search incident to an arrest/terry frisk of the car, but those are obviously more limited than the automobile exception.

Terry frisks of the car - If the officer has reason to believe that the driver or passenger is armed, he can frisk them, and search the car for weapons - but it's limited to those areas in which a weapon can be stored.

kaiser
Posts: 2940
Joined: Mon May 09, 2011 11:34 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby kaiser » Thu Jul 18, 2013 4:14 pm

blong4133 wrote:
kaiser wrote:
rnf1292 wrote:Does anyone have a short summary on car searches for MBE crim pro? My notes are confusing the hell out of me.


Always keep in mind the key overarching rule: If there is probable cause as to the car, the entire car can be searched, including all containers within. But the search of the car must be within the scope of the PC that justified the automobile search. So if they have PC over the car to find a stolen TV, you can't search the glove compartment. But if PC is for drugs, you can search anywhere drugs could reasonably be found (which includes many more small places). Of course, always distinguish this from the rules of searches incident to arrest (since the rules pertaining to car searches with the search is incident to arrest are different). Thus, as a threshold matter, determine why the car is being search. Was it incident to an arrest? Or did police have PC over the car for some reason, stopped the car, and conducted the search?



I will add, that if you're searching a car pursuant to the automobile exception, the probable cause must exist before any search (whether of the person or the car).

So, if you have an officer who legitimately stops a car, but doesn't have probable cause to search, he can get that probable cause through plain view or some other method that doesn't involve an actual search. But once the officer performs any search (i.e. a terry frisk), the automobile exception goes out the window. based on the facts, you may be able to search based on search incident to an arrest/terry frisk of the car, but those are obviously more limited than the automobile exception.

Terry frisks of the car - If the officer has reason to believe that the driver or passenger is armed, he can frisk them, and search the car for weapons - but it's limited to those areas in which a weapon can be stored.


Ok, thats what I figured, just a protective sweep of the car for weapon (only if he suspects someone is armed)

User avatar
iShotFirst
Posts: 460
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 2:13 am

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby iShotFirst » Thu Jul 18, 2013 6:39 pm

Does anyone else read the sample essay answers in the "Testing" books and just get sick to their stomach? Those answers are so detailed it seems impossible to ever perform to that standard. Everytime I read one I just get really hot, start sweating, etc.

User avatar
Matteliszt
Posts: 1301
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 7:38 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Matteliszt » Thu Jul 18, 2013 6:41 pm

iShotFirst wrote:Does anyone else read the sample essay answers in the "Testing" books and just get sick to their stomach? Those answers are so detailed it seems impossible to ever perform to that standard. Everytime I read one I just get really hot, start sweating, etc.



That answer is an objective 10 and you need a curved 5 to pass. As long as you got the issue with some relevant law and applied the law in a manner that makes logical sense you're probably good, you don't need to know every intricate nuance. Remember, the standard for passage is minimum competency, not legal brilliance.

User avatar
sundevil77
Posts: 391
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 8:34 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby sundevil77 » Thu Jul 18, 2013 8:01 pm

iShotFirst wrote:Does anyone else read the sample essay answers in the "Testing" books and just get sick to their stomach? Those answers are so detailed it seems impossible to ever perform to that standard. Everytime I read one I just get really hot, start sweating, etc.


I want to stab the sample answers in the eye.

User avatar
MBZags
Posts: 552
Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:21 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby MBZags » Thu Jul 18, 2013 8:18 pm

sundevil77 wrote:
iShotFirst wrote:Does anyone else read the sample essay answers in the "Testing" books and just get sick to their stomach? Those answers are so detailed it seems impossible to ever perform to that standard. Everytime I read one I just get really hot, start sweating, etc.


I want to stab the sample answers in the eye.


+1

FryVBender
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 3:34 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby FryVBender » Thu Jul 18, 2013 8:23 pm

Anyone taking the UBE have predictions as to the 6 MEE essays? I noticed in Feb the essays were property, contracts, const law, agency/partnership, evidence, and neg instruments. Would they throw another neg instruments at us this summer? I kind of want to just punt on neg instruments since I missed the lecture for that subject and have only been using the CMR for review.

User avatar
sundevil77
Posts: 391
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 8:34 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby sundevil77 » Thu Jul 18, 2013 9:04 pm

Has anyone done Real Property Essay 10? I thought I nailed this one, now I think I might punch a kitten.

My main issue was with the battle between "Daughter" (donee with a wild deed) vs. "Purchaser" (a BFP) in a notice jurisdiction.

I concluded that Purchaser did not have actual, inquiry, or record notice of Daughter's wild deed, so Purchaser would win in a notice jurisdiction. I also concluded that Purchaser would take subject to Railroad's easement, since Purchaser was likely on inquiry notice because of the railroad tracks running through the land. The model answer disagrees. It believes Purchaser was on inquiry notice of not only Railroad's easement, but that it was also on inquiry notice of Daughter's interest. How so? Because inquiry notice of Railroad's easement would "likely" lead it to find out about Sam, which would lead it to find out about Daughter. WTF?! Barbri is trolling me good.

c3pO4
Posts: 835
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2011 1:34 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby c3pO4 » Thu Jul 18, 2013 9:21 pm

sundevil77 wrote:Has anyone done Real Property Essay 10? I thought I nailed this one, now I think I might punch a kitten.

My main issue was with the battle between "Daughter" (donee with a wild deed) vs. "Purchaser" (a BFP) in a notice jurisdiction.

I concluded that Purchaser did not have actual, inquiry, or record notice of Daughter's wild deed, so Purchaser would win in a notice jurisdiction. I also concluded that Purchaser would take subject to Railroad's easement, since Purchaser was likely on inquiry notice because of the railroad tracks running through the land. The model answer disagrees. It believes Purchaser was on inquiry notice of not only Railroad's easement, but that it was also on inquiry notice of Daughter's interest. How so? Because inquiry notice of Railroad's easement would "likely" lead it to find out about Sam, which would lead it to find out about Daughter. WTF?! Barbri is trolling me good.


conclusion irrelevant, if ou analyzed both sides

blong4133
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby blong4133 » Thu Jul 18, 2013 9:23 pm

sundevil77 wrote:Has anyone done Real Property Essay 10? I thought I nailed this one, now I think I might punch a kitten.

My main issue was with the battle between "Daughter" (donee with a wild deed) vs. "Purchaser" (a BFP) in a notice jurisdiction.

I concluded that Purchaser did not have actual, inquiry, or record notice of Daughter's wild deed, so Purchaser would win in a notice jurisdiction. I also concluded that Purchaser would take subject to Railroad's easement, since Purchaser was likely on inquiry notice because of the railroad tracks running through the land. The model answer disagrees. It believes Purchaser was on inquiry notice of not only Railroad's easement, but that it was also on inquiry notice of Daughter's interest. How so? Because inquiry notice of Railroad's easement would "likely" lead it to find out about Sam, which would lead it to find out about Daughter. WTF?! Barbri is trolling me good.



I did that one a while ago and I was none too happy. Complete BS. I get that they are trying to write complete answers, but that is stupid. If anyone who actually got that when the question was asked on the bar, I'd like to meet them and shake their hand. But that's just my "i'm going to fail the bar/I don't know anything" opinion.

Stinson
Posts: 257
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:01 am

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Stinson » Thu Jul 18, 2013 9:54 pm

iShotFirst wrote:Does anyone else read the sample essay answers in the "Testing" books and just get sick to their stomach? Those answers are so detailed it seems impossible to ever perform to that standard. Everytime I read one I just get really hot, start sweating, etc.


Yes.

ninereal
Posts: 85
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2011 6:39 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby ninereal » Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:06 pm

Okay, let me see if I get the concept for the HDC/personal defenses thing in Comm Paper:

A gives B a $1,000 promissory note to provide entertainment for A's birthday party. Before the party, B validly transfers to C, for value, in good faith, without notice of defenses, making C an HDC. B then does not perform at the birthday party. But, because C is an HDC and failure of consideration is a personal defense, C can still get payment from A. Is that accurate?

User avatar
usuaggie
Posts: 585
Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2009 8:43 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby usuaggie » Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:26 pm

FryVBender wrote:Anyone taking the UBE have predictions as to the 6 MEE essays? I noticed in Feb the essays were property, contracts, const law, agency/partnership, evidence, and neg instruments. Would they throw another neg instruments at us this summer? I kind of want to just punt on neg instruments since I missed the lecture for that subject and have only been using the CMR for review.



Doubt. And I would be shocked if civil procedure wasn't on it.

Civ pro
Wills or trusts
Crim
Torts
Corporations
Secured transactions

FryVBender
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 3:34 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby FryVBender » Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:53 pm

Yeah that's the list I'm thinking too. Along with Family law/conflicts

usuaggie wrote:
FryVBender wrote:Anyone taking the UBE have predictions as to the 6 MEE essays? I noticed in Feb the essays were property, contracts, const law, agency/partnership, evidence, and neg instruments. Would they throw another neg instruments at us this summer? I kind of want to just punt on neg instruments since I missed the lecture for that subject and have only been using the CMR for review.



Doubt. And I would be shocked if civil procedure wasn't on it.

Civ pro
Wills or trusts
Crim
Torts
Corporations
Secured transactions

anonymcoffee
Posts: 188
Joined: Fri Jan 28, 2011 8:31 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby anonymcoffee » Thu Jul 18, 2013 11:47 pm

I'm seeing all these predictions, any ideas for the Texas Bar essay topics? Or..we shouldn't even bother?

de5igual
Posts: 1463
Joined: Mon Dec 08, 2008 11:52 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby de5igual » Thu Jul 18, 2013 11:57 pm

anonymcoffee wrote:I'm seeing all these predictions, any ideas for the Texas Bar essay topics? Or..we shouldn't even bother?


it's always the same 12 topics

blong4133
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby blong4133 » Fri Jul 19, 2013 12:50 am

How much time have you all spent on essay subjects so far?

I've been following barbri's program and haven't looked at any of the essay specific subjects since the lectures. I have a basic understanding of everything, but I definitely don't think I have a good enough handle to write a passing answer. I'm starting to get a little freaked realizing how much stuff I still have to memorize before exam day in less than 2 weeks.

Anyone else doing this or are most of you just going off on your own and doing whatever?

For whatever it's worth, my state is 50% MBE, 20%MPT and 30% Essay. I've been exceeding the benchmarks, with the occasional set where I'm either right at it, or one question below.

User avatar
traehekat
Posts: 3195
Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 4:00 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby traehekat » Fri Jul 19, 2013 12:54 am

blong4133 wrote:How much time have you all spent on essay subjects so far?

I've been following barbri's program and haven't looked at any of the essay specific subjects since the lectures. I have a basic understanding of everything, but I definitely don't think I have a good enough handle to write a passing answer. I'm starting to get a little freaked realizing how much stuff I still have to memorize before exam day in less than 2 weeks.

Anyone else doing this or are most of you just going off on your own and doing whatever?

For whatever it's worth, my state is 50% MBE, 20%MPT and 30% Essay. I've been exceeding the benchmarks, with the occasional set where I'm either right at it, or one question below.


Same boat.

blong4133
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 12:35 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby blong4133 » Fri Jul 19, 2013 1:01 am

traehekat wrote:
blong4133 wrote:How much time have you all spent on essay subjects so far?

I've been following barbri's program and haven't looked at any of the essay specific subjects since the lectures. I have a basic understanding of everything, but I definitely don't think I have a good enough handle to write a passing answer. I'm starting to get a little freaked realizing how much stuff I still have to memorize before exam day in less than 2 weeks.

Anyone else doing this or are most of you just going off on your own and doing whatever?

For whatever it's worth, my state is 50% MBE, 20%MPT and 30% Essay. I've been exceeding the benchmarks, with the occasional set where I'm either right at it, or one question below.


Same boat.


At least I'm not the only one. haha The only good thing is that I took secured transactions and comm. paper first semester of 3L and I think I remember enough about secured to where I could at least come close a passing answer, maybe comm. paper. But it would probably suck hard if I never took either and was trying to learn them in two days as Barbri tells us to do.

User avatar
traehekat
Posts: 3195
Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 4:00 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby traehekat » Fri Jul 19, 2013 1:05 am

blong4133 wrote:
traehekat wrote:
blong4133 wrote:How much time have you all spent on essay subjects so far?

I've been following barbri's program and haven't looked at any of the essay specific subjects since the lectures. I have a basic understanding of everything, but I definitely don't think I have a good enough handle to write a passing answer. I'm starting to get a little freaked realizing how much stuff I still have to memorize before exam day in less than 2 weeks.

Anyone else doing this or are most of you just going off on your own and doing whatever?

For whatever it's worth, my state is 50% MBE, 20%MPT and 30% Essay. I've been exceeding the benchmarks, with the occasional set where I'm either right at it, or one question below.


Same boat.


At least I'm not the only one. haha The only good thing is that I took secured transactions and comm. paper first semester of 3L and I think I remember enough about secured to where I could at least come close a passing answer, maybe comm. paper. But it would probably suck hard if I never took either and was trying to learn them in two days as Barbri tells us to do.


yeah i'm more worried about wills and trusts.

kaiser
Posts: 2940
Joined: Mon May 09, 2011 11:34 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby kaiser » Fri Jul 19, 2013 1:09 am

traehekat wrote:
blong4133 wrote:
traehekat wrote:
blong4133 wrote:How much time have you all spent on essay subjects so far?

I've been following barbri's program and haven't looked at any of the essay specific subjects since the lectures. I have a basic understanding of everything, but I definitely don't think I have a good enough handle to write a passing answer. I'm starting to get a little freaked realizing how much stuff I still have to memorize before exam day in less than 2 weeks.

Anyone else doing this or are most of you just going off on your own and doing whatever?

For whatever it's worth, my state is 50% MBE, 20%MPT and 30% Essay. I've been exceeding the benchmarks, with the occasional set where I'm either right at it, or one question below.


Same boat.


At least I'm not the only one. haha The only good thing is that I took secured transactions and comm. paper first semester of 3L and I think I remember enough about secured to where I could at least come close a passing answer, maybe comm. paper. But it would probably suck hard if I never took either and was trying to learn them in two days as Barbri tells us to do.


yeah i'm more worried about wills and trusts.


I hated wills the first time around and didn't understand a word Fine was saying (she is an awful lecturer). But, now that I review the material, its really not all that bad. Sure, they can put in some narrow nit-picky points, but in general this isn't all that tough. I will get around to the smaller subjects, but I feel like time now is best spent memorizing the areas that will play a bigger role, like wills, NY practice, etc.

User avatar
usuaggie
Posts: 585
Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2009 8:43 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby usuaggie » Fri Jul 19, 2013 1:52 am

blong4133 wrote:
traehekat wrote:
blong4133 wrote:How much time have you all spent on essay subjects so far?

I've been following barbri's program and haven't looked at any of the essay specific subjects since the lectures. I have a basic understanding of everything, but I definitely don't think I have a good enough handle to write a passing answer. I'm starting to get a little freaked realizing how much stuff I still have to memorize before exam day in less than 2 weeks.

Anyone else doing this or are most of you just going off on your own and doing whatever?

For whatever it's worth, my state is 50% MBE, 20%MPT and 30% Essay. I've been exceeding the benchmarks, with the occasional set where I'm either right at it, or one question below.


Same boat.


At least I'm not the only one. haha The only good thing is that I took secured transactions and comm. paper first semester of 3L and I think I remember enough about secured to where I could at least come close a passing answer, maybe comm. paper. But it would probably suck hard if I never took either and was trying to learn them in two days as Barbri tells us to do.



I have done 200 questions the last two days and got 83% right so I'm going to turn to cramming some essay knowledge now.

User avatar
sundevil77
Posts: 391
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2009 8:34 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby sundevil77 » Fri Jul 19, 2013 2:23 am

rnf1292 wrote:
JollyGreenGiant wrote:
usuaggie wrote:
0L Hoping for 1 wrote:How have people done on the half day exam in the MPQ2? I just took it today and I know it says the goal is 60% but I don't know at what timing that is (mainly, is that the average barbri student score from a month before the exam, because I only have two weeks left). I scored right around the goal.


Scored 65

63 here.


I got a 62. MPQ2 sets 1 and 2 were significantly easier.


MPQ2's are definitely much easier. The half-day exam seemed very similar in difficulty to the simulated mbe.

User avatar
englawyer
Posts: 1270
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 10:57 pm

Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby englawyer » Fri Jul 19, 2013 8:47 am

ninereal wrote:Okay, let me see if I get the concept for the HDC/personal defenses thing in Comm Paper:

A gives B a $1,000 promissory note to provide entertainment for A's birthday party. Before the party, B validly transfers to C, for value, in good faith, without notice of defenses, making C an HDC. B then does not perform at the birthday party. But, because C is an HDC and failure of consideration is a personal defense, C can still get payment from A. Is that accurate?


looks right. A can still sue B though




Return to “Forum for Law School Students”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: LgownaCav, OhmyAtticus, ramadar and 5 guests