BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

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traehekat
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby traehekat » Mon Jul 29, 2013 2:54 am

clashjones87 wrote:
sundevil77 wrote:Tomorrow's not too late to learn commercial paper, right? Riiiiiight? (Crickets).


I think you can learn the basics of any topic in a day.


What about the basics of say, oh... 7 topics?

Geist13
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Geist13 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 3:42 am

17/18 on that free NCBE practice set. Done studying. Fuck tomorrow. Maybe I'll do one MPT since I haven't been able to finish any of my previous 4 attempts in 90 minutes, but whatever. Fuck this shit. Barbri, fuck you, biggest waste of money in my life (including law school).

Dear Kids, don't do barbri. Go on ebay, get the barbri outlines and study those. Maybe sign up for one of those cheap companies (a few hundred dollars) that give you lots of multi-choice questions. but don't give barbri a dime.

clashjones87
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby clashjones87 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 3:43 am

traehekat wrote:
clashjones87 wrote:
sundevil77 wrote:Tomorrow's not too late to learn commercial paper, right? Riiiiiight? (Crickets).


I think you can learn the basics of any topic in a day.


What about the basics of say, oh... 7 topics?


Which 7? And have you actually not studied 7 topics?

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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby imchuckbass58 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 6:47 am

wildhaggis wrote:Hate to ask another obvious question, but are you guys actually putting your laptops in a 2-1/2 gallon bag for the first day? A little surprised we can't bring them in laptop bags.


I'm going to bring one of those semi-disposable tote bags and just throw it out (or, stash it in a corner outside security and not care if it gets thrown out).

On the way back, I guess I'll just carry my laptop in hand.

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englawyer
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby englawyer » Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:05 am

T, in his will, gives Blackacre to his two children A and B as joint tenants with right of survivorship. A predeceases, leaving C as issue.

which result:

#1) anti-lapse applies. C and B become tenants in common. it doesn't matter that A died first because A predeceased T. but A's death is a sufficient event to sever the joint tenancy, and C and B are tenants in common.

#2) anti-lapse applies. C and B become joint tenants with right of survivorship. it doesn't matter that A died first because A predeceased T

#2) A dies before B, so B takes a fee simple, even though A and B did not get an interest until T's death.

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Joe Quincy
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Joe Quincy » Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:36 am

englawyer wrote:T, in his will, gives Blackacre to his two children A and B as joint tenants with right of survivorship. A predeceases, leaving C as issue.

which result:

#1) anti-lapse applies. C and B become tenants in common. it doesn't matter that A died first because A predeceased T. but A's death is a sufficient event to sever the joint tenancy, and C and B are tenants in common.

#2) anti-lapse applies. C and B become joint tenants with right of survivorship. it doesn't matter that A died first because A predeceased T

#2) A dies before B, so B takes a fee simple, even though A and B did not get an interest until T's death.


No idea but I argue the first #2.

But I also don't see this being asked on the bar.

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traehekat
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby traehekat » Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:03 am

clashjones87 wrote:
traehekat wrote:
clashjones87 wrote:
sundevil77 wrote:Tomorrow's not too late to learn commercial paper, right? Riiiiiight? (Crickets).


I think you can learn the basics of any topic in a day.


What about the basics of say, oh... 7 topics?


Which 7? And have you actually not studied 7 topics?


Trusts, Equity, Surety, Admin, Personal Property, Fex Tax, Conflicts.

I've done the lectures but have barely reviewed and done no essay. It's not too bad, though. Fed Tax and Surety won't be on it, so don't have to study for those. Conflicts is never it's own question, and there isn't much to it anyway. Equity and Personal Property are pretty short, simple topic so not really worried about that.

Trusts and Admin are the wild cards. I probably really need to focus on trusts today, and then making sure I remember everything else.

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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby PirateCap'n » Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:05 am

Joe Quincy wrote:
englawyer wrote:T, in his will, gives Blackacre to his two children A and B as joint tenants with right of survivorship. A predeceases, leaving C as issue.

which result:

#1) anti-lapse applies. C and B become tenants in common. it doesn't matter that A died first because A predeceased T. but A's death is a sufficient event to sever the joint tenancy, and C and B are tenants in common.

#2) anti-lapse applies. C and B become joint tenants with right of survivorship. it doesn't matter that A died first because A predeceased T

#2) A dies before B, so B takes a fee simple, even though A and B did not get an interest until T's death.


No idea but I argue the first #2.

But I also don't see this being asked on the bar.


Sadly, that's the exact kind of thing I expect to be on the bar.

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Joe Quincy
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Joe Quincy » Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:08 am

PirateCap'n wrote:
Sadly, that's the exact kind of thing I expect to be on the bar.


Even if it were, the actual conclusion would be worth little. There are plenty of things to talk about:
- Lapse
- Antilapse
- How JTs and ROS work
- Vesting
- Why it isn't absolutely clear (apply facts)
- Result if TIC
- Result if the ROS was effective
- Come up with some kind of reason
- Apply to facts and conclusion

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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby FamilyLawEsq » Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:19 am

englawyer wrote:T, in his will, gives Blackacre to his two children A and B as joint tenants with right of survivorship. A predeceases, leaving C as issue.

which result:

#1) anti-lapse applies. C and B become tenants in common. it doesn't matter that A died first because A predeceased T. but A's death is a sufficient event to sever the joint tenancy, and C and B are tenants in common.

#2) anti-lapse applies. C and B become joint tenants with right of survivorship. it doesn't matter that A died first because A predeceased T

#2) A dies before B, so B takes a fee simple, even though A and B did not get an interest until T's death.



The answer is #3 or the second #2. This is exactly the time of thing you will see on the bar.

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Joe Quincy
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Joe Quincy » Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:28 am

FamilyLawEsq wrote:
englawyer wrote:T, in his will, gives Blackacre to his two children A and B as joint tenants with right of survivorship. A predeceases, leaving C as issue.

which result:

#1) anti-lapse applies. C and B become tenants in common. it doesn't matter that A died first because A predeceased T. but A's death is a sufficient event to sever the joint tenancy, and C and B are tenants in common.

#2) anti-lapse applies. C and B become joint tenants with right of survivorship. it doesn't matter that A died first because A predeceased T

#2) A dies before B, so B takes a fee simple, even though A and B did not get an interest until T's death.



The answer is #3 or the second #2. This is exactly the time of thing you will see on the bar.


I could see this answer too, but I think both are arguable. The grant hasn't vested yet so no ROS. 3 is probably closest to the testator's intent but some states read the statute more strictly. (Then again, arguably the testator would have changed his will if he didn't want C to take in place of A after A's death.)

This is a ROS, but not words of survivorship that would overcome the antilapse statute. I see nothing in VA's antilapse statute (for example) that would suggest 3 is obviously correct over 2. You have a beneficiary who is a lineal descendant of a grandparent, a gift, that is lapsing, and no words of survivorship conditioning the gift upon surviving the testator.

What makes you think 3 is correct? I'd have to think that some states are at least split on this.

Edit: Arguably this grant wouldn't truly lapse because A's interest couldn't really go the residuary if he predeceased. I still think you'd get substantial credit for arguing it either way.
Last edited by Joe Quincy on Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:46 am, edited 8 times in total.

dudders
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby dudders » Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:31 am

imchuckbass58 wrote:
wildhaggis wrote:Hate to ask another obvious question, but are you guys actually putting your laptops in a 2-1/2 gallon bag for the first day? A little surprised we can't bring them in laptop bags.


I'm going to bring one of those semi-disposable tote bags and just throw it out (or, stash it in a corner outside security and not care if it gets thrown out).

On the way back, I guess I'll just carry my laptop in hand.


This is what I'm doing. All those free Westlaw and Lexis swag bags are coming in handy.

FamilyLawEsq
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby FamilyLawEsq » Mon Jul 29, 2013 10:35 am

I remember my daughter telling me that the only Fed Tax issue she had on the 2011 bar essays related to alimony in a family law question. In order to qualify as alimony:

There must be a written agreement or court order;
It is tax deductible for the payor;
It is included as income for the payee spouse;
It terminates upon the death of either spouse.

Certain states, but not the IRS, may require it to end upon the cohabitation or remarriage of the payee spouse. Remember, child support is not tax deductible or includable as income.

Good luck. I still have my Convisor mini review from 1981, it saved me. I got an automatic pass because MBE portion was high enough that they did not grade my essays. You guys will all do well. Get a good night's sleep and eat something decent for breakfast.

legalnoeagle
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby legalnoeagle » Mon Jul 29, 2013 11:19 am

Nvm

kaiser
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby kaiser » Mon Jul 29, 2013 4:57 pm

sundevil77 wrote:Tomorrow's not too late to learn commercial paper, right? Riiiiiight? (Crickets).


Literally had no idea what a commercial paper was up until a few hours ago. I figure so long as I can say the elements of a negotiable instrument, say what a holder in due course is, and say some stupid shit about the liability of the drawee bank, thats probably enough to get a point. Same thing with secured transactions. Would likely at most be 1/3 of an essay and nothing more.

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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby ninereal » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:13 pm

kaiser wrote:
sundevil77 wrote:Tomorrow's not too late to learn commercial paper, right? Riiiiiight? (Crickets).


Literally had no idea what a commercial paper was up until a few hours ago. I figure so long as I can say the elements of a negotiable instrument, say what a holder in due course is, and say some stupid shit about the liability of the drawee bank, thats probably enough to get a point. Same thing with secured transactions. Would likely at most be 1/3 of an essay and nothing more.


SecTrans isn't actually that hard - just read through like ten or so of the essays and you'll start to pick it up pretty fast. It sounds awful when you've just heard the lecture, but it actually makes a lot more sense once you see the fact patterns.

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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby td6624 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:17 pm

ninereal wrote:SecTrans isn't actually that hard - just read through like ten or so of the essays and you'll start to pick it up pretty fast. It sounds awful when you've just heard the lecture, but it actually makes a lot more sense once you see the fact patterns.


This is my plan for later this evening. Just read model answers and get some patterns/vocab down so I can hope for a point or two.

At this point I'm just glad I'm not in California.

kaiser
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby kaiser » Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:29 pm

ninereal wrote:
kaiser wrote:
sundevil77 wrote:Tomorrow's not too late to learn commercial paper, right? Riiiiiight? (Crickets).


Literally had no idea what a commercial paper was up until a few hours ago. I figure so long as I can say the elements of a negotiable instrument, say what a holder in due course is, and say some stupid shit about the liability of the drawee bank, thats probably enough to get a point. Same thing with secured transactions. Would likely at most be 1/3 of an essay and nothing more.


SecTrans isn't actually that hard - just read through like ten or so of the essays and you'll start to pick it up pretty fast. It sounds awful when you've just heard the lecture, but it actually makes a lot more sense once you see the fact patterns.


I don't think I even brought the NY Testing book with me on my trip. Will check up the sample essay answers on the BOLE site to learn some more buzzwords. I'm not sure if tonight should be dedicated to those tiny little areas we are unlikely to see, bolstering a bit more in the big areas we are likely to see, or just chilling the hell out and relaxing.

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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Brassica7 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 7:56 pm

Question about intent for battery: if you make an intentional movement and accidentally hit someone, is that battery? For example, if I get excited and wave my hands and accidentally backhand someone I didn't know was behind me, did I commit battery? It was an intentional movement (not an involuntary spasm), but I did not intend harmful or offensive contact. Thanks for the help!

kaiser
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby kaiser » Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:17 pm

Last time checking in before gametime. Just reading over some essay sample answers tonight to have some phrases and buzzwords fresh in my mind.

Just wanted to wish you all good luck. Its been a wild 2 months, and I don't think it will be wasted time for anyone on here. We are all gonna pass, then look back and laugh at how crazy we got. So go rock it tomorrow.

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traehekat
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby traehekat » Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:22 pm

ninereal wrote:
kaiser wrote:
sundevil77 wrote:Tomorrow's not too late to learn commercial paper, right? Riiiiiight? (Crickets).


Literally had no idea what a commercial paper was up until a few hours ago. I figure so long as I can say the elements of a negotiable instrument, say what a holder in due course is, and say some stupid shit about the liability of the drawee bank, thats probably enough to get a point. Same thing with secured transactions. Would likely at most be 1/3 of an essay and nothing more.


SecTrans isn't actually that hard - just read through like ten or so of the essays and you'll start to pick it up pretty fast. It sounds awful when you've just heard the lecture, but it actually makes a lot more sense once you see the fact patterns.


I would kill for a Secured Transactions question.

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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby bgdddymtty » Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:43 pm

Brassica7 wrote:Question about intent for battery: if you make an intentional movement and accidentally hit someone, is that battery? For example, if I get excited and wave my hands and accidentally backhand someone I didn't know was behind me, did I commit battery? It was an intentional movement (not an involuntary spasm), but I did not intend harmful or offensive contact. Thanks for the help!

No. There must be the intent to cause (harmful or offensive) contact with someone.

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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby stratocophic » Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:49 pm

bgdddymtty wrote:
Brassica7 wrote:Question about intent for battery: if you make an intentional movement and accidentally hit someone, is that battery? For example, if I get excited and wave my hands and accidentally backhand someone I didn't know was behind me, did I commit battery? It was an intentional movement (not an involuntary spasm), but I did not intend harmful or offensive contact. Thanks for the help!

No. There must be the intent to cause (harmful or offensive) contact with someone.

cr, it'd be negligence

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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby BeenDidThat » Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:33 pm

stratocophic wrote:
bgdddymtty wrote:
Brassica7 wrote:Question about intent for battery: if you make an intentional movement and accidentally hit someone, is that battery? For example, if I get excited and wave my hands and accidentally backhand someone I didn't know was behind me, did I commit battery? It was an intentional movement (not an involuntary spasm), but I did not intend harmful or offensive contact. Thanks for the help!

No. There must be the intent to cause (harmful or offensive) contact with someone.

cr, it'd be negligence


Or, like nothing at all. We impliedly consent to daily contacts of life and all. But you're right, that's the best possible suit if you had to bring one.

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newyorker88
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby newyorker88 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:45 pm

What's everyone doing about laptops? We're not supposed to bring a laptop case. I'm curious what I should put it in so I'm not leaving the javits center with a laptop in my hands.




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