BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

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Matteliszt
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Matteliszt » Tue Jul 23, 2013 9:55 pm

swc65 wrote:
c3pO4 wrote:
swc65 wrote:I bought an exam from the mbe website. Was testing at around 60% on the barbri questions and got 80% of the real mbe questions correct for a 165. Barbri sucks at writing questions. Their answers suck worse. This is why they tell you not to do too many questions in pace of reading the outlines. I think barbri makes you dumber the more you do their questions.


i don't follow your logic. assuming these questions are representative of the real MBE, it seems barbri has prepared you really well. my question is, would you recommend doing the NCBE online test? is it worth the 6 hours at this point?



The questions one the ncbe are just better written and don't suffer from the problems many people in this thread are discussing. I had the same experience with LSAT test prep. To me the barbri questions confuse the material because no Answr choice is good or they seem to be totally wrong.

The ncbe tests are one hundred questions each. An hour and half to two hours should be sufficient to take one. I totally think its worth it. They provide a scaled score and tell you what the average score was on a set of similar questions. To me their questions seem way less tricky, are shorter, and the explanation are great. They refer to old common law rules less often than barbri (I think only once in 100 questions thy asked about a rule that no longer exists). Ncbe also provides explanations for the questions get correct which is a good insight into how they test.


Anyway it's definitely better than doing a bunch of barbri questions



They also don't test the exceptions to the exceptions to the exceptions. I've done all 3 of those practice tests and every single time it's the same issues per topic (The issues Gusman told us to review in the MBE midterm videos) and they are all presented in a fairly straightforward manner. You miss the question because you don't know the rule, or you get the question right because you do.

Alternatively, all 3 100 question tests are available in the Strategies and Tactics book with (detailed) explanations of the answer choices.


Also if you got a 165 you're in great shape!
Last edited by Matteliszt on Tue Jul 23, 2013 9:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Mroberts3
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Mroberts3 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 9:58 pm

swc65 wrote:I bought an exam from the mbe website. Was testing at around 60% on the barbri questions and got 80% of the real mbe questions correct for a 165. Barbri sucks at writing questions. Their answers suck worse. This is why they tell you not to do too many questions in pace of reading the outlines. I think barbri makes you dumber the more you do their questions.


+1

I cannot stress enough how much everyone should buy these exams (there are 3). At a minimum buy one to do during this last week. You will see immediately how sucky Barbri is.

Edit: I also liked that I dominated them ;)
Last edited by Mroberts3 on Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JollyGreenGiant
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby JollyGreenGiant » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:00 pm

FINE. You talked me into it. Anybody got a link?

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swc65
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby swc65 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:00 pm

Mroberts3 wrote:
swc65 wrote:I bought an exam from the mbe website. Was testing at around 60% on the barbri questions and got 80% of the real mbe questions correct for a 165. Barbri sucks at writing questions. Their answers suck worse. This is why they tell you not to do too many questions in pace of reading the outlines. I think barbri makes you dumber the more you do their questions.


+1

I cannot stress enough how much everyone should buy these exams (there are 3). At a minimum buy one to do during this last week. You will see immediately how sucky Barbri is.


Ncbe actually tests their questions before using them for scoring. That's why we do two hundred but only one ninety are scored. I think that barbri just has some 1L in a room somewhere churning out questions !

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Mroberts3
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Mroberts3 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:01 pm

JollyGreenGiant wrote:FINE. You talked me into it. Anybody got a link?


--LinkRemoved--

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swc65
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby swc65 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:02 pm

Damn I shouldn't have opened my big mouth. There goes the curve. Guess I better study some more! Totally kidding.


The worst part about the ncbe exam is that it totally killed by motivation

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Matteliszt
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Matteliszt » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:03 pm

Mroberts3 wrote:
swc65 wrote:I bought an exam from the mbe website. Was testing at around 60% on the barbri questions and got 80% of the real mbe questions correct for a 165. Barbri sucks at writing questions. Their answers suck worse. This is why they tell you not to do too many questions in pace of reading the outlines. I think barbri makes you dumber the more you do their questions.


+1

I cannot stress enough how much everyone should buy these exams (there are 3). At a minimum buy one to do during this last week. You will see immediately how sucky Barbri is.



I just kind of stopped doing MBE's after those exams. I only have maybe 50 barbri questions and 50 kaplan questions left that I haven't done but there is pretty much no point now. I'm not smart enough/lack the retention to retain every single nuance and all of the Barbri/Kaplan questions just continually add more stuff to remember that is just more confusing and unnecessary. There certainly are people who can keep it all straight but I personally just can't. I do like 10-15 random Qs a day and shoot between 60-70%, it's good enough for government.

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JollyGreenGiant
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby JollyGreenGiant » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:03 pm

$50?! In Barbri I trust.

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Matteliszt
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Matteliszt » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:04 pm

swc65 wrote:Damn I shouldn't have opened my big mouth. There goes the curve. Guess I better study some more! Totally kidding.


The worst part about the ncbe exam is that it totally killed by motivation



Dude with your score even if you did 20 points worse on the real thing you're in phenomenal shape

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swc65
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby swc65 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:26 pm

Matteliszt wrote:
swc65 wrote:Damn I shouldn't have opened my big mouth. There goes the curve. Guess I better study some more! Totally kidding.


The worst part about the ncbe exam is that it totally killed by motivation



Dude with your score even if you did 20 points worse on the real thing you're in phenomenal shape


Thanks! I'm hoping a good mbe score will compensate for my inability to regurgitate legal rules

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swc65
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby swc65 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:28 pm

Has anyone though of an attack plan for the ny day?

I was thinking:

Am:
MC first (to help jog the memory for legal rules)
Essays

Pm:

Essays ( so I can erase ny shit immediately before cramming new law into my overly full head for the mpt)

MPT

c3pO4
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby c3pO4 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:28 pm

Mroberts3 wrote:
JollyGreenGiant wrote:FINE. You talked me into it. Anybody got a link?


--LinkRemoved--


ok, you convinced me. i am concerned that i will get faked out when i see easy quesitons because im always looking for the crazy barbri trick, so this will be useful to reinforce what to do when a question really is easy.

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usuaggie
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby usuaggie » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:49 pm

I also tried the practice exam on advice of a friend. Scored a 169 scaled. Would obviously freak out if I got that on the real thing.

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tfer2222
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby tfer2222 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:54 pm

swc65 wrote:Has anyone though of an attack plan for the ny day?

I was thinking:

Am:
MC first (to help jog the memory for legal rules)
Essays

Pm:

Essays ( so I can erase ny shit immediately before cramming new law into my overly full head for the mpt)

MPT


thats the Barbri recommended sequence.

what about timing? I kinda wanna have specific times i need to have each section/essay finished ready to go before the exam. does the exam start on an exact time or is it just when everyone is settled in?

I should probably look this stuff up somewhere. ugh.

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tfer2222
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby tfer2222 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:58 pm

Matteliszt wrote:
Alternatively, all 3 100 question tests are available in the Strategies and Tactics book with (detailed) explanations of the answer choices.


Also if you got a 165 you're in great shape!


My S&T only has a 200 question practice exam in it.

and are you saying they're the same questions as the released exams? I did the 200 in S&T and got around an 80% but was still skeptical as to how realistic it was.

Green Crayons
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Green Crayons » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:00 pm

englawyer wrote:this was discussed a bit before, but I have seen way too many questions where a fundamental right is involved and the question asks EP clause or SDP clause of the 14th amendment.

What are some cases (if any) where SDP unambiguously is the winner? Barbri says the test is: does it affect all people, or only some people: SDP for the former, EP for the later.

I saw a question where "State X passes a law requiring English literacy before anyone can vote". My thought was: The law affects all people ("anyone"), so therefore its an SDP. Wrong, the answer states that it is EP because it discriminates between the English-literate and the non-English-literate. If even this is EP, I am not sure when SDP will ever be the right answer choice.

examples:

Abortion. Must be EP because it discriminates between men and women?
Gay Sex. Must be EP because it discriminates between straight and gay?
Welfare Durational Requirements (travel). Must be EP because it discriminates between long term and short term residents?

It seems like there is always a colorable argument that EP is the correct answer....
Ask who is being denied the right, not who the law regulates. A law can regulate "everyone" in that a law is generally applicable to a population, but that is not what you're looking for to determine if the EPC is implicated. You are looking to see if a law is discriminatory in determining who is denied the ability to exercise the right (arising from the fact that the EPC prohibits a law that is discriminatory in both its intent and effect).

For example:

- The English-literacy requirement seeks to prohibit a class (non-English speakers) from exercising the right to vote; it does not seek to prohibit everyone from voting. Thus, EPC is implicated.
- BUT: an abortion prohibition seeks to prohibit all people from exercising the right to an abortion (by its terms; no abortion prohibition will state "only women cannot get abortion," so there's no call of an EPC issue in the facts -- but, if it did, you have an EPC issue).

Marriage and private sexual activities are fundamental SDP rights, but equal protection is a large component in litigation surrounding those issues. So the MBE folks probably don't want to touch it, especially after this past April.


Also, the prohibition of non-English fluency speakers from exercising their right to vote is really a trick question, as it's a denial of both equal protection and a fundamental right!

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Matteliszt
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby Matteliszt » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:13 pm

tfer2222 wrote:
Matteliszt wrote:
Alternatively, all 3 100 question tests are available in the Strategies and Tactics book with (detailed) explanations of the answer choices.


Also if you got a 165 you're in great shape!


My S&T only has a 200 question practice exam in it.

and are you saying they're the same questions as the released exams? I did the 200 in S&T and got around an 80% but was still skeptical as to how realistic it was.



Your S and T book has one 200 question practice MBE and another 100 practice MBE quesitons scattered through each chapter (maybe more?) the 3 online exams are 100 questions each, 200 of which it sounds like you've already done. Those are previously released MBE questions. I imagine they wont all be that easy, but you've got a good handle on the ones that are released it sounds like.

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tfer2222
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby tfer2222 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:19 pm

Matteliszt wrote:
Your S and T book has one 200 question practice MBE and another 100 practice MBE quesitons scattered through each chapter (maybe more?) the 3 online exams are 100 questions each, 200 of which it sounds like you've already done. Those are previously released MBE questions. I imagine they wont all be that easy, but you've got a good handle on the ones that are released it sounds like.


oh, yeah. duh. sorry my brain has been perpetually fried since july hit.

dude you've done ALL the barbri questions except for 50?! well i feel like a complete slacker now.

wildhaggis
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby wildhaggis » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:37 pm

Is it just me or does BarBri consistently put issues in their essays that they don't really teach us about?

Going through some of the latter family law and trusts essays in their book and sort of freaking out about being grossly underprepared. I studied the lecture material over and over and had it down, sat down to do some essays, and was fairly stumped. I feel like on some of the subjects, such as trusts or family law, the essays hit on so many issues that BarBri doesn't prepare us for.

Any insight?
Last edited by wildhaggis on Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

taxman021
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby taxman021 » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:49 pm

is it just me or is barbri's answer to essay #r-37 in new york totally wrong?

"furthermore, in new york, co-conspirators are liable for all acts in furtherance of the conspiracy." (p. 200)

i thought ny rejected pinkerton liability???

kaiser
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby kaiser » Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:54 pm

Went and bought one of the NCBE 100 Q tests. Did 1/2 of the test, and got 40/50, for 80% correct.

Vast majority of these Q's are SO much shorter. And for so many of them, you literally know what the answer is before you even read the choices. Property still messes me up (since I suck at property), but its more doable here than the BarBri Q's.

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tfer2222
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby tfer2222 » Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:06 am

taxman021 wrote:is it just me or is barbri's answer to essay #r-37 in new york totally wrong?

"furthermore, in new york, co-conspirators are liable for all acts in furtherance of the conspiracy." (p. 200)

i thought ny rejected pinkerton liability???


NY rejects Pinkerton liability to the extent that they didn't even participate in the crime. So in New York if you just agree and don't actually help out in the crime at all, you won't be held liable for any crimes committed pursuant to the agreement, like you would at common law.

However if you do actually participate in some way you can still be held liable for crimes in furtherance of the conspiracy.

Not sure of the specific question you're talking about (my book is in my car) but I remember being caught off guard by that as well. I originally thought NY cut off ALL of that liability as well.
Last edited by tfer2222 on Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

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jawsthegreat
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby jawsthegreat » Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:07 am

taxman021 wrote:is it just me or is barbri's answer to essay #r-37 in new york totally wrong?

"furthermore, in new york, co-conspirators are liable for all acts in furtherance of the conspiracy." (p. 200)

i thought ny rejected pinkerton liability???


Haven't looked at that questions, but did they actually participate in the conspiracy? You can still be liable for acts in furtherance of the conspiracy if you were an active participant rather than a mere conspirator. (I'm pretty sure).

taxman021
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby taxman021 » Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:14 am

jawsthegreat wrote:
taxman021 wrote:is it just me or is barbri's answer to essay #r-37 in new york totally wrong?

"furthermore, in new york, co-conspirators are liable for all acts in furtherance of the conspiracy." (p. 200)

i thought ny rejected pinkerton liability???


Haven't looked at that questions, but did they actually participate in the conspiracy? You can still be liable for acts in furtherance of the conspiracy if you were an active participant rather than a mere conspirator. (I'm pretty sure).




well, so the guy hired a guy to burn down his building and gave him the keys to that building. i thought since ny didn't recognize pinkerton liability, that accomplice liability was the only way to go? getting more confused by this though

kaiser
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Re: BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam

Postby kaiser » Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:20 am

^^^

I did that same essay Q today, and went the same route, talking about how he didn't participate in it, since he merely solicited the other guy into doing it and then sat back and waited for it to happen. But then again, the facts aren't clear as to his level of participation. Yet nothing suggests he did anything more than ask the other guy to do it.




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