BarBri Thread: People taking Barbri for July 2013 exam Forum

[hds2388]

This has been discussed before, but lets get real about MPQ2 vs. the real MBE. People who have been taking the NCBE questions: are which MPQ2 sets are they most like? Or are they more like the SFE?

I think I'm anomylous, because while I did well on the simulated MBE (148/96%-ile), I haven't been blowing the MPQ2 sets out of the water (hovering around 78%). My NCBE score was 74%. So, in my opinion the MPQ2 is very close. On the MPQ2 Set 7, I got a 74% (it's one of the slightly more difficult ones). Maybe use that as a proxy? I got a 75% on the SFE. I think I might just be wildly consistent though, regardless of difficulty.

[stratocophic]

So guys I may have missed this but what is the consensus on auto-pass MBE score for those JX's where it is 50-50% and essays are graded on 1-7 scale?

Thanks!!

Seems like that would depend on how many points you have to get total. Here are my thoughts on my JX's test, where you have to get 270 out of 400, MBE/essay is 50/50, and 115 is the minimum MBE score

Look at it this way tho - if you manage a 156 on the MBE, you can pass with an essay score so low that if it was your MBE score they wouldn't bother grading the other half of the test. Have to think anything within 10 points of that is setting you up pretty well, especially when you can get up to 88 points from the MPTs w/o knowing any state law at all (so 150 + say 70 = 220, leaving only 50 out of 112 points needed from the actual subject matter essays - that's two killer essays and two blank pieces of paper or four essays that are only half competent)

[Matteliszt]

This has been discussed before, but lets get real about MPQ2 vs. the real MBE. People who have been taking the NCBE questions: are which MPQ2 sets are they most like? Or are they more like the SFE?

The easy MPQ2 sets. the majority of us shot something like 70-75% on the MBE website tests. I have a hunch if you're shooting something like 70-75% on the MBE website Qs you'll do > 65% on the real deal, given that the real thing is bound to have a smattering of harder Qs as well.

[Glock]

Thanks for the responses guys. I am doing quite well on the MPQ2s and just wanted some childish assurances that it wasn't so much easier than the real thing. Most encouragingly I did really well on MPQ2 7-9, which apparently are the harder ones?

Maybe I will buy one of those NCBE tests.

[BCLS]

So guys I may have missed this but what is the consensus on auto-pass MBE score for those JX's where it is 50-50% and essays are graded on 1-7 scale?

Thanks!!

Seems like that would depend on how many points you have to get total. Here are my thoughts on my JX's test, where you have to get 270 out of 400, MBE/essay is 50/50, and 115 is the minimum MBE score

Look at it this way tho - if you manage a 156 on the MBE, you can pass with an essay score so low that if it was your MBE score they wouldn't bother grading the other half of the test. Have to think anything within 10 points of that is setting you up pretty well, especially when you can get up to 88 points from the MPTs w/o knowing any state law at all (so 150 + say 70 = 220, leaving only 50 out of 112 points needed from the actual subject matter essays - that's two killer essays and two blank pieces of paper or four essays that are only half competent)

Freakin good to hear. Hit upper 150's on the simulated exam. Hoping to make up for my crappy essays.

My state requires 264/400 to pass.

[phonepro]

My people, were almost there: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTB46FJOF5w

[kaiser]

Took NCBE 3, and got 87/100 for 176 scaled. This one felt like it was the easiest of the 3, but difficulty was largely consistent with the other ones. Had something like 47/50 at the halfway point, and then managed to get 4 out of the last 7 wrong.

So these NCBE tests are very consistent in their balance of Q difficulty. Once again, crim seemed like the most difficult thing, with evidence not too far behind. No clue why I keep screwing up crim on these NCBE tests, yet doing great on crim on Barbri Q's. Con law and torts seemed particularly easy on this test, as it did with the other tests. Even property, where I get 50% wrong on BarBri, seems easier here. That is because MBE is testing more basic property rules, and even where I'm unsure, some logical thought often leads me to the right choice. The mortgage shit, at the end of the day, has to make some real-world logical sense.

Now that I'm out of these NCBE tests, I'm definitely done with MBE studying (aside from whatever MBE-based essay practice I do). To those of you hesitant about spending the $$ for these tests, I'd definitely say buy them, and do it soon.

[Matteliszt]

Took NCBE 3, and got 87/100 for 176 scaled. This one felt like it was the easiest of the 3, but difficulty was largely consistent with the other ones. Had something like 47/50 at the halfway point, and then managed to get 4 out of the last 7 wrong.

So these NCBE tests are very consistent in their balance of Q difficulty. Once again, crim seemed like the most difficult thing, with evidence not too far behind. No clue why I keep screwing up crim on these NCBE tests, yet doing great on crim on Barbri Q's. Con law and torts seemed particularly easy on this test, as it did with the other tests. Even property, where I get 50% wrong on BarBri, seems easier here. That is because MBE is testing more basic property rules, and even where I'm unsure, some logical thought often leads me to the right choice. The mortgage shit, at the end of the day, has to make some real-world logical sense.

Now that I'm out of these NCBE tests, I'm definitely done with MBE studying (aside from whatever MBE-based essay practice I do). To those of you hesitant about spending the $$ for these tests, I'd definitely say buy them, and do it soon.

Why do you think you did so much better on that one? I had done a bunch of the questions before so my score was skewed but I do think that one felt a little easier

[kaiser]

Took NCBE 3, and got 87/100 for 176 scaled. This one felt like it was the easiest of the 3, but difficulty was largely consistent with the other ones. Had something like 47/50 at the halfway point, and then managed to get 4 out of the last 7 wrong.

So these NCBE tests are very consistent in their balance of Q difficulty. Once again, crim seemed like the most difficult thing, with evidence not too far behind. No clue why I keep screwing up crim on these NCBE tests, yet doing great on crim on Barbri Q's. Con law and torts seemed particularly easy on this test, as it did with the other tests. Even property, where I get 50% wrong on BarBri, seems easier here. That is because MBE is testing more basic property rules, and even where I'm unsure, some logical thought often leads me to the right choice. The mortgage shit, at the end of the day, has to make some real-world logical sense.

Now that I'm out of these NCBE tests, I'm definitely done with MBE studying (aside from whatever MBE-based essay practice I do). To those of you hesitant about spending the $$ for these tests, I'd definitely say buy them, and do it soon.

Why do you think you did so much better on that one? I had done a bunch of the questions before so my score was skewed but I do think that one felt a little easier

Not entirely sure. I think it just came down to minimizing the damage a bit more on my worse subjects, and spending a bit more time when I was torn between two answers. I'm finding that, when I'm confused, if I really scrutinize the wording, I can find some word that just doesn't sit right with me for some reason, and often, I end up guessing correctly because of that. This test took me longer than either of the other 2. I only had about 20 minutes to spare, whereas for test 1, I had nearly an hour left. So that shows you how much more time I spend carefully reading, even on the easier ones.

My spread isn't all that huge. 10 question difference between my lowest and highest. A few guesses here and there, or a few silly mistakes could spike it up or drag it down pretty quickly.

[wildhaggis]

Are you guys paying $50 for each NCBE test?

[stayway]

I did the S & T Emmanuels practice MBE (in the back - 200 Qs) and came out with 142/200. Finished about 8 mins early for each session.

Been getting 5-6 on the barbri submitted essays....wtf..?

Scared shitless still.

Do you guys know if the bar examiners grade the essays strictly? I'm a little afraid that I won't be able to type out the black letter law like you need to do on law school exams (like super eloquently using similar words as it is stated in the BLL). Because I think I can type out the law some what correctly but not to a "tee" if you know what i mean.

Gonna try to type out the BLL for every general tort/crime/law tomorrow and memorize the sheet...

P.S. Is anyone really bothering with the NYMC or the MPT?

[kaiser]

^^^

I paid 125 for the set of all 3. And honestly, after all the money spent on LSAT prep, law school tuition, living expenses and whatnot, we are right here at the final hurdle so I'd just spend that last bit since its definitely very useful.

[rnf1292]

Took NCBE 3, and got 87/100 for 176 scaled. This one felt like it was the easiest of the 3, but difficulty was largely consistent with the other ones. Had something like 47/50 at the halfway point, and then managed to get 4 out of the last 7 wrong.

So these NCBE tests are very consistent in their balance of Q difficulty. Once again, crim seemed like the most difficult thing, with evidence not too far behind. No clue why I keep screwing up crim on these NCBE tests, yet doing great on crim on Barbri Q's. Con law and torts seemed particularly easy on this test, as it did with the other tests. Even property, where I get 50% wrong on BarBri, seems easier here. That is because MBE is testing more basic property rules, and even where I'm unsure, some logical thought often leads me to the right choice. The mortgage shit, at the end of the day, has to make some real-world logical sense.

Now that I'm out of these NCBE tests, I'm definitely done with MBE studying (aside from whatever MBE-based essay practice I do). To those of you hesitant about spending the $$ for these tests, I'd definitely say buy them, and do it soon.

Thanks for all your info kaiser. Any idea what made the crim qs tricky?

[kaiser]

Took NCBE 3, and got 87/100 for 176 scaled. This one felt like it was the easiest of the 3, but difficulty was largely consistent with the other ones. Had something like 47/50 at the halfway point, and then managed to get 4 out of the last 7 wrong.

So these NCBE tests are very consistent in their balance of Q difficulty. Once again, crim seemed like the most difficult thing, with evidence not too far behind. No clue why I keep screwing up crim on these NCBE tests, yet doing great on crim on Barbri Q's. Con law and torts seemed particularly easy on this test, as it did with the other tests. Even property, where I get 50% wrong on BarBri, seems easier here. That is because MBE is testing more basic property rules, and even where I'm unsure, some logical thought often leads me to the right choice. The mortgage shit, at the end of the day, has to make some real-world logical sense.

Now that I'm out of these NCBE tests, I'm definitely done with MBE studying (aside from whatever MBE-based essay practice I do). To those of you hesitant about spending the $$ for these tests, I'd definitely say buy them, and do it soon.

Thanks for all your info kaiser. Any idea what made the crim qs tricky?

Not really sure. A few times, I just didn't read carefully enough. I found the criminal procedure questions a bit tougher. A lot more questions about what goes on the courtroom than BarBri has us do. BarBri's crim pro is more focused on Miranda, Sixth Amendment right to counsel, searches, etc. I find the NCBE tests to have some procedural courtroom stuff I just didn't entirely know.

[Stinson]

I did the S & T Emmanuels practice MBE (in the back - 200 Qs) and came out with 142/200. Finished about 8 mins early for each session.

Been getting 5-6 on the barbri submitted essays....wtf..?

Scared shitless still.

Do you guys know if the bar examiners grade the essays strictly? I'm a little afraid that I won't be able to type out the black letter law like you need to do on law school exams (like super eloquently using similar words as it is stated in the BLL). Because I think I can type out the law some what correctly but not to a "tee" if you know what i mean.

Gonna try to type out the BLL for every general tort/crime/law tomorrow and memorize the sheet...

P.S. Is anyone really bothering with the NYMC or the MPT?

I'm not taking NY but they did give us a perfect essay for my state, MA. The person did not write stuff out that sounded treatise-ready. It was more colloquial, as if you were explaining the law to a layperson and not uttering magic words. Indeed, he does not even make an upfront statement of what the law is. What he did do, and I think this is good advice, is take a total shotgun approach. You could tell there was stuff in there that he just couldn't weave into a coherent paragraph, so he just wrote out single, isolated sentences at the end. But he put everything he could possibly think up in there.

[usuaggie]

Crim was easy for me on test 3. I think I only missed 2. Con law was my worst but all were above the average by a good chunk

Is anybody else wondering how people do poorly on the bar? Is there just a section of people who don't study? I don't mean pass or fail, I mean people who get 45% on the mbe

[JollyGreenGiant]

Is there just a section of people who don't study?

Hopefully that comprises the 10% who fail my bar.

[traehekat]

I enjoy doing Evidence MBE questions if for no other reason but the fact that they are on average much shorter questions than any other MBE topic.

[kaiser]

Crim was easy for me on test 3. I think I only missed 2. Con law was my worst but all were above the average by a good chunk

Is anybody else wondering how people do poorly on the bar? Is there just a section of people who don't study? I don't mean pass or fail, I mean people who get 45% on the mbe

I'm praying its people who don't study, and people who barely speak English. If some kid who barely speaks english ends up passing and I don't, I'll be pissed.

[bgdddymtty]

Is anybody else wondering how people do poorly on the bar? Is there just a section of people who don't study? I don't mean pass or fail, I mean people who get 45% on the mbe

I found this report (LinkRemoved) very interesting on that front. It's limited to one February bar exam at one lower-T3 school, but the results are still stark. Fifty students had GPA's above B- (2.66), and 48 of them (96%) passed. Of the 33 who had GPA's lower than that, only 17 (52%) passed. It seems that some folks just don't have the intellectual firepower for this.

[wildhaggis]

Is there really a non-negligible amount of folks who don't study?

[rnf1292]

Is anybody else wondering how people do poorly on the bar? Is there just a section of people who don't study? I don't mean pass or fail, I mean people who get 45% on the mbe

I've been wondering the same. We've put so much work in, the thought of not passing is just NO.

[usuaggie]

Is anybody else wondering how people do poorly on the bar? Is there just a section of people who don't study? I don't mean pass or fail, I mean people who get 45% on the mbe

I found this report (LinkRemoved) very interesting on that front. It's limited to one February bar exam at one lower-T3 school, but the results are still stark. Fifty students had GPA's above B- (2.66), and 48 of them (96%) passed. Of the 33 who had GPA's lower than that, only 17 (52%) passed. It seems that some folks just don't have the intellectual firepower for this.

I guess I just don't see myself as being so much smarter than people with worse grades that I'd pass and they wouldn't. I had a 3.15 at 50 percentile but I feel like I'm on pace to pass. I wish Utah had some crappy schools to supply more students. I have easily studied more this summer than all law school combined though. By fives times, probably.

[KeepitKind]

Can someone kindly explain the diff between the mechanics of a k modification v. an accord + satisfaction? Tyia

[Matteliszt]

Is anybody else wondering how people do poorly on the bar? Is there just a section of people who don't study? I don't mean pass or fail, I mean people who get 45% on the mbe

I found this report (LinkRemoved) very interesting on that front. It's limited to one February bar exam at one lower-T3 school, but the results are still stark. Fifty students had GPA's above B- (2.66), and 48 of them (96%) passed. Of the 33 who had GPA's lower than that, only 17 (52%) passed. It seems that some folks just don't have the intellectual firepower for this.

I guess I just don't see myself as being so much smarter than people with worse grades that I'd pass and they wouldn't. I had a 3.15 at 50 percentile but I feel like I'm on pace to pass. I wish Utah had some crappy schools to supply more students. I have easily studied more this summer than all law school combined though. By fives times, probably.

I think a fair amount of people let one minor mess up on an essay or the MBE bring their entire performance downhill.