contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

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bloobook
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Postby bloobook » Wed Jul 11, 2012 2:57 pm

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Last edited by bloobook on Fri Jul 27, 2012 5:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

HOPEFORCHANGE
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby HOPEFORCHANGE » Wed Jul 11, 2012 2:58 pm

So you owe taxes on the forgiven amout, oh well. You have 25 years notice about this if they don't change the law to make it so you don't have to pay taxes on the forgiven amount in between. Also, you get it forgiven after 10 years if you work in the public sector. I am not stating that IBR is the ideal option, but it is an option if you are worried about the loans and really want to be a lawyer.

HOPEFORCHANGE
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby HOPEFORCHANGE » Wed Jul 11, 2012 2:59 pm

Also, with public sector you DON'T have to pay taxes on the forgiven amount

rad lulz
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby rad lulz » Wed Jul 11, 2012 3:28 pm

bloobook wrote:I wouldn't bitch about paying taxes on interest if I've gotten out of paying loans altogether. Sheesh, some people are never happy.

For the record, I'm 83% certain that public interest loan forgiveness only takes 10 years, so if OP is interested in Public Interest + Makes No Money = relatively happy times 10 years after beginning repayment. Assuming OP doesn't fail the bar or become a violent drunk.

If you make no payments on the $150k, it could easily balloon to waaaaay more than that when you're not even paying the interest payments. You pay taxes on that amount. Also LOL at above poaster hoping they will change the law to take away the tax bomb. In this political climate, it's probably more likely they would end IBR. They just took away subsidized Staffords.

Public interest jobs are now insanely competitive due to budget cuts and PSLF. Also 10 years is a long time not to get the axe. Government jobs do not provide the career security they once did.

IBR was simply not designed for sums of this magnitude.

HOPEFORCHANGE
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby HOPEFORCHANGE » Thu Jul 12, 2012 3:23 am

Sorry, but I get thoroughly irritated when people disseminate incorrect information on the internet. Heavenwood, I get that you're on Easy Street by being at Penn and all, but please check your facts before presenting your opinions as gospel. First, they may get rid of IBR eventually, but not now. There is no point in the government having EVERYONE default on loans. Yes, I know that they can't be discharged through bankruptcy, but you can't bleed a turnip. Also, once you start paying on IBR, they can't tell you you're screwed ten years later. So you're safe once you start paying. Moreover, the TAX laws are actually more likely to change to make forgiven IBR debt non-taxable. It hasn't happened yet, but the nature and tradition of the Internal Revenue Code is in favor of not having people be taxed to the point of destitution. Look it up. That's the trend.

Also, public sector jobs include more than just government work. For example, my goal is to be a law professor. That counts.

Everyone has to decide what is right for themselves. One thing though about "ballooning debt" - I was always under the impression that creditors view student loans differently. I guess I'd care more if I didn't already own a house. Bottom line though, don't let negative jerks deter you from being a lawyer if that's what you want to do. They have every incentive to discourage you; they are competing against you afterall. A law professor told me that.

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cinephile
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby cinephile » Thu Jul 12, 2012 3:37 am

HOPEFORCHANGE wrote:Don't let negative jerks deter you from being a lawyer if that's what you want to do. They have every incentive to discourage you; they are competing against you afterall. A law professor told me that.


People are legitmately trying to help. I would try to stop someone from making the same mistakes I made, and that's what people are doing here when they say don't take on more debt than you can repay (without relying on programs that may or may not be there in the future). You're not doing this person a service.

timbs4339
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby timbs4339 » Thu Jul 12, 2012 1:00 pm

HOPEFORCHANGE wrote:Sorry, but I get thoroughly irritated when people disseminate incorrect information on the internet. Heavenwood, I get that you're on Easy Street by being at Penn and all, but please check your facts before presenting your opinions as gospel. First, they may get rid of IBR eventually, but not now. There is no point in the government having EVERYONE default on loans. Yes, I know that they can't be discharged through bankruptcy, but you can't bleed a turnip. Also, once you start paying on IBR, they can't tell you you're screwed ten years later. So you're safe once you start paying. Moreover, the TAX laws are actually more likely to change to make forgiven IBR debt non-taxable. It hasn't happened yet, but the nature and tradition of the Internal Revenue Code is in favor of not having people be taxed to the point of destitution. Look it up. That's the trend.

Also, public sector jobs include more than just government work. For example, my goal is to be a law professor. That counts.

Everyone has to decide what is right for themselves. One thing though about "ballooning debt" - I was always under the impression that creditors view student loans differently. I guess I'd care more if I didn't already own a house. Bottom line though, don't let negative jerks deter you from being a lawyer if that's what you want to do. They have every incentive to discourage you; they are competing against you afterall. A law professor told me that.


They absolutely could kill IBR if they wanted to and make you start paying again- you're lying to yourself if you think they won't. It's a question of how much political power IBR users have and the prevailing political climate. Remember, these are people for whom "fairness" isn't a persuasive argument.

rad lulz
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby rad lulz » Thu Jul 12, 2012 1:47 pm

HOPEFORCHANGE wrote:Sorry, but I get thoroughly irritated when people disseminate incorrect information on the internet. Heavenwood, I get that you're on Easy Street by being at Penn and all, but please check your facts before presenting your opinions as gospel. First, they may get rid of IBR eventually, but not now. There is no point in the government having EVERYONE default on loans. Yes, I know that they can't be discharged through bankruptcy, but you can't bleed a turnip. Also, once you start paying on IBR, they can't tell you you're screwed ten years later. So you're safe once you start paying. Moreover, the TAX laws are actually more likely to change to make forgiven IBR debt non-taxable. It hasn't happened yet, but the nature and tradition of the Internal Revenue Code is in favor of not having people be taxed to the point of destitution. Look it up. That's the trend.

Also, public sector jobs include more than just government work. For example, my goal is to be a law professor. That counts.

Everyone has to decide what is right for themselves. One thing though about "ballooning debt" - I was always under the impression that creditors view student loans differently. I guess I'd care more if I didn't already own a house. Bottom line though, don't let negative jerks deter you from being a lawyer if that's what you want to do. They have every incentive to discourage you; they are competing against you afterall. A law professor told me that.

You're well on your way to being a law professor. You already exhibit a hilarious head in the sand mentality.

Also LOL if you think I'm worried about competition from this rando poaster on the net. You're an idiot.

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ChikaBoom
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby ChikaBoom » Thu Jul 12, 2012 2:07 pm

Seriously...Hope- weren't you a part of the 'LOL- just go work in a library' thread yesterday? IBR and all the other schemes out there are not a golden parachute. Take only what you must in loans and plan to pay them back in FULL. Don't wait for the IBR fairy to come along and clear YOUR debt.

I hope that reform on the student loan stuff does come along, but I am not going to advise someone to pin their future on it.

The OP isn't in that bad of a position. It's still feasible that this could work out. Everyone was trying to help him before you showed up. Didn't notice how many people actually advised him to stay? Does that sound like people that are trying to weed him out or consider him competition?

Jaysus. :shock:

HeavenWood
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby HeavenWood » Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:42 pm

HOPEFORCHANGE wrote:Sorry, but I get thoroughly irritated when people disseminate incorrect information on the internet. Heavenwood, I get that you're on Easy Street by being at Penn and all, but please check your facts before presenting your opinions as gospel. First, they may get rid of IBR eventually, but not now. There is no point in the government having EVERYONE default on loans. Yes, I know that they can't be discharged through bankruptcy, but you can't bleed a turnip. Also, once you start paying on IBR, they can't tell you you're screwed ten years later. So you're safe once you start paying. Moreover, the TAX laws are actually more likely to change to make forgiven IBR debt non-taxable. It hasn't happened yet, but the nature and tradition of the Internal Revenue Code is in favor of not having people be taxed to the point of destitution. Look it up. That's the trend.

Also, public sector jobs include more than just government work. For example, my goal is to be a law professor. That counts.

Everyone has to decide what is right for themselves. One thing though about "ballooning debt" - I was always under the impression that creditors view student loans differently. I guess I'd care more if I didn't already own a house. Bottom line though, don't let negative jerks deter you from being a lawyer if that's what you want to do. They have every incentive to discourage you; they are competing against you afterall. A law professor told me that.

Hi, I never posted in this thread. I also know next to nothing about the loan repayment process, so I've never really given any advice on the matter beyond the commonsensical "borrowing money to pay full sticker for a TTT is a bad idea."

So who the fuck are you?

rad lulz
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby rad lulz » Fri Jul 13, 2012 4:42 pm

HOPEFORCHANGE wrote:For example, my goal is to be a law professor.

Also LOL if you think you're gonna get a job as a tenure track law professor from Pitt. The odds of that are just infinitesimal.

HeavenWood
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby HeavenWood » Fri Jul 13, 2012 4:49 pm

rad lulz wrote:
HOPEFORCHANGE wrote:For example, my goal is to be a law professor.

Also LOL if you think you're gonna get a job as a tenure track law professor from Pitt. The odds of that are just infinitesimal.

BUT HE WAS BORN AND BRED FOR SUCCESS AND ACHIEVEMENT.

shock259
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby shock259 » Fri Jul 13, 2012 4:51 pm

Also, you can't bleed a turnip.

Whatever that means.

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Julio_El_Chavo
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby Julio_El_Chavo » Fri Jul 13, 2012 5:55 pm

If you're even ASKING about dropping out, you should drop out. Practicing law sucks if you have any doubts whatsoever that this is what you want to be doing. Also, being in law school is unimaginably more fun than practicing law. If you think it sucks now, GTFO.

r6_philly
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby r6_philly » Fri Jul 13, 2012 6:45 pm

rad lulz wrote:
bloobook wrote:^ Yes!

If you earn very little, your payments could potentially be 0$ per month - meaning, 0$ COUNTS TOWARD A PAYMENT.

Then your interest will continue to accrue because you are paying nothing or close to nothing and you will likely owe taxes on the amount forgiven after 25 years.


You can work in the public sector under IBR and pay 0, then have the loan forgiven in 10, and the forgiveness is not taxable.

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Flash
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby Flash » Fri Jul 13, 2012 7:12 pm

Julio_El_Chavo wrote:If you're even ASKING about dropping out, you should drop out. Practicing law sucks if you have any doubts whatsoever that this is what you want to be doing. Also, being in law school is unimaginably more fun than practicing law. If you think it sucks now, GTFO.

This.

All the cool kids are dropping out.

rad lulz
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby rad lulz » Fri Jul 13, 2012 7:52 pm

r6_philly wrote:
rad lulz wrote:
bloobook wrote:^ Yes!

If you earn very little, your payments could potentially be 0$ per month - meaning, 0$ COUNTS TOWARD A PAYMENT.

Then your interest will continue to accrue because you are paying nothing or close to nothing and you will likely owe taxes on the amount forgiven after 25 years.


You can work in the public sector under IBR and pay 0, then have the loan forgiven in 10, and the forgiveness is not taxable.

Yes we all know that, but it's really fucking hard to get a PSLF jerb.

r6_philly
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby r6_philly » Fri Jul 13, 2012 8:03 pm

rad lulz wrote:Yes we all know that, but it's really fucking hard to get a PSLF jerb.


It can be any public sector job. Doesn't have to be JD/bar required. It's not ideal, but that is at least some sort of back up for trying to rid yourself of massive loans if there are no other options.

But yes I agree you shouldn't count on this being the top option.

bloobook
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Postby bloobook » Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:57 pm

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Last edited by bloobook on Fri Jul 27, 2012 4:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Honey_Badger
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby Honey_Badger » Fri Jul 13, 2012 10:58 pm

Julio_El_Chavo wrote:If you're even ASKING about dropping out, you should drop out. Practicing law sucks if you have any doubts whatsoever that this is what you want to be doing. Also, being in law school is unimaginably more fun than practicing law. If you think it sucks now, GTFO.

MrAnon
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby MrAnon » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:10 pm

If you know in your heart that dropping out is the correct thing to do then you must do it. You aren't living life to please others like your parents. You are living life to help support them when they are older and have a family of your own. If law won't do that for you then you need to find something else that will.

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Lawquacious
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby Lawquacious » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:12 pm

No.

ze2151
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby ze2151 » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:12 pm

drop out. here's why.

by the time you finish you will have accrued at the very minimum 115 thousand dollars in debt. most financial people don't recommend taking out more loan money than what your starting salary would be (for example, you'd need a 115k/yr job to make this a sound decision).

you're almost definitely not going to get one of those.

ibr is not exactly a panacea. and who's to say ibr as a program will still exist in 3-5 years, or even 1-3 years?

drop out. drop out now.

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Lawquacious
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby Lawquacious » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:13 pm

MrAnon wrote:If you know in your heart that dropping out is the correct thing to do then you must do it. You aren't living life to please others like your parents. You are living life to help support them when they are older and have a family of your own. If law won't do that for you then you need to find something else that will.



But yes. I just wouldn't do it only because of the ITE panic.

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2014
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Re: contemplating dropping out - what do you think?

Postby 2014 » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:52 pm

I really doubt they just up and axe IBR (though I've seen stupider things).

So let's say they do get rid of it and start "making you pay". Well great, now a large amount of people are faced with a loan payment that is more than half of their pre-tax income. Bankruptcy doesn't do shit so faced with no other choice they default. What happens then? The government garnishes a certain percent of their disposable income? Oh wait, that is exactly what IBR does just minus months of red tape to get there.

I would think our esteemed congressmen would realize this and figure out another solution. Probably one that allows student loans to be discharged, penalizes schools for being retarded and hiking tuition to obscene levels as salaries barely rise with inflation, or whatever.




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