Maybe you should drop out of law school.

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Happy 2012!

That's a good point, thanks for the advice.
90
25%
NO IT WILL BE DIFFERENT FOR ME I LOVE DEBT, UNEMPLOYMENT, AND SORROW.
265
75%
 
Total votes: 355

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thesealocust
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby thesealocust » Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:31 am

To everyone asking whether or not you should drop out of law school:

Yes, because clearly your reading comprehension is awful, as the original post contains all of the information you need to make that decision.

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Haymarket
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby Haymarket » Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:32 am

thesealocust wrote: I'm still in law school for the same reason I went to law school. Because I hate myself.

This is the smartest thing anyone has said. Ever.

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thesealocust
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby thesealocust » Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:34 am

Haymarket wrote:
thesealocust wrote: I'm still in law school for the same reason I went to law school. Because I hate myself.

This is the smartest thing anyone has said. Ever.


Self awareness is important!

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PDaddy
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby PDaddy » Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:42 am

Gettingstarted1928 wrote:Somebody ban this troll. Everyone knows that JD = 1%er. I guess OP doesn't watch movies.


You saw my thread! Glad someone was reading! :wink: It's bleak, but not as bleak as it looks. Lawyers still have other professions and specialties open to them. And for every two of the 30,000 "entry-level" lawyer positions open every year, there's another experienced lawyer retiring from the field altogether or leaving for another reason, which means another 15,000 open jobs - even if they are not dubbed entry-level.

After all, the substance/alcohol abuse, bankruptcies, depressions, untimely deaths, disbarments, terminations, single-shingles and career changes don't stop. The new trend in law schools is going to be entreprenuership folks. The law schools and students alike will have to recondition themselves to think entreprenuership instead of "job", and that will create more innovative niches within the profession, competition between firms for top-flight talent, reduced training costs and more satisfaction, not to mention greater meritocricy and the weeding out of the pretenders.

I think the field is about to revolutionize, and that is reason to continue pursuing a law career if you really want it badly enough. Don't get it twisted, I am an extremely pragmatic person who does not believe in incurring massive debt with no payoff. But who says a J.D. has to lead to zero payoff simply because you aren't guaranteed a job? The current model is the problem, and it is up to us as students of the game to change it. A real lawyer is in the game to make change, not to sit on the sidelines, do the minimum necessary job and simply collect a paycheck. That's lame!

While you are in school, talk to your schools about adding entreprenuer clinics for lawyers, so that you can start your own law groups or address the neglected areas within the profession and create new niches. Take charge!

HiImDavid
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby HiImDavid » Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:47 am

flcath wrote:
HiImDavid wrote:I'm a 1L who just finished my first semester and ranked 50% at a T1 (50-60). I have a BA in Econ/Finance, it would take me a year to meet prerequisites for a MS in Accountancy and it would take another year to finish the MS. Seriously considering it, considering tomorrow is the last day for 100% tuition. Any advice?

How much debt for that program?


I spend probably about $20k a semester total (rent/books/tuition)... If I stick it out 1 more semester its $40k for the year.

nStiver
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby nStiver » Mon Jan 23, 2012 2:52 am

You know what potential employers really love to see? A quitter, that's what. Knock em dead.

HiImDavid
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby HiImDavid » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:03 am

nStiver wrote:You know what potential employers really love to see? A quitter, that's what. Knock em dead.

It's that black and white?

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MTal
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby MTal » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:11 am

There are no jobs. Most of the ones to be had are there for the well connected, there are truly few openings for those on the outside who don't have an in. Don't be suckered into taking on mortgage sized debt for something worth only a small fraction of that amount.

HiImDavid
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby HiImDavid » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:15 am

Problem is, will an MS in accounting be any different?

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MTal
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby MTal » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:19 am

HiImDavid wrote:Problem is, will an MS in accounting be any different?


YES. Not nearly as much debt as the JD, you'll always have work available, CPA can work in any state without additional licensing requirements, potential to lateral into other things, etc etc....

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Antilles Haven
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby Antilles Haven » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:27 am

PDaddy wrote:
Gettingstarted1928 wrote:Somebody ban this troll. Everyone knows that JD = 1%er. I guess OP doesn't watch movies.


You saw my thread! Glad someone was reading! :wink: It's bleak, but not as bleak as it looks. Lawyers still have other professions and specialties open to them. And for every two of the 30,000 "entry-level" lawyer positions open every year, there's another experienced lawyer retiring from the field altogether or leaving for another reason, which means another 15,000 open jobs - even if they are not dubbed entry-level.

After all, the substance/alcohol abuse, bankruptcies, depressions, untimely deaths, disbarments, terminations, single-shingles and career changes don't stop. The new trend in law schools is going to be entreprenuership folks. The law schools and students alike will have to recondition themselves to think entreprenuership instead of "job", and that will create more innovative niches within the profession, competition between firms for top-flight talent, reduced training costs and more satisfaction, not to mention greater meritocricy and the weeding out of the pretenders.

I think the field is about to revolutionize, and that is reason to continue pursuing a law career if you really want it badly enough. Don't get it twisted, I am an extremely pragmatic person who does not believe in incurring massive debt with no payoff. But who says a J.D. has to lead to zero payoff simply because you aren't guaranteed a job? The current model is the problem, and it is up to us as students of the game to change it. A real lawyer is in the game to make change, not to sit on the sidelines, do the minimum necessary job and simply collect a paycheck. That's lame!

While you are in school, talk to your schools about adding entreprenuer clinics for lawyers, so that you can start your own law groups or address the neglected areas within the profession and create new niches. Take charge!

I genuinely question the ceiling of your cognitive faculties.

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sunynp
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby sunynp » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:27 am

HiImDavid wrote:
nStiver wrote:You know what potential employers really love to see? A quitter, that's what. Knock em dead.

It's that black and white?

I don't agree with this in the context of changing fields. People don't mind if you tried something else for a semester, realized it wasn't for you, and then joined their profession. This whole idea of you should stay in law school because employers will shun you if you quit is wrong. If you are the bottom half of your class, you will be struggling to get job, leaving when you realize it is the wrong choice makes sense.

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FryBreadPower
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby FryBreadPower » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:37 am

MTal wrote:There are no jobs. Most of the ones to be had are there for the well connected, there are truly few openings for those on the outside who don't have an in. Don't be suckered into taking on mortgage sized debt for something worth only a small fraction of that amount.


I have a gut feeling this may be a sweeping generalization.

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Ludo!
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby Ludo! » Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:06 am

MTal wrote:There are no jobs. Most of the ones to be had are there for the well connected, there are truly few openings for those on the outside who don't have an in. Don't be suckered into taking on mortgage sized debt for something worth only a small fraction of that amount.


This is why you are annoying. This is such a stupid overstatement that it's totally unhelpful.

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Bildungsroman
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby Bildungsroman » Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:25 am

MTal wrote:There are no jobs. Most of the ones to be had are there for the well connected, there are truly few openings for those on the outside who don't have an in. Don't be suckered into taking on mortgage sized debt for something worth only a small fraction of that amount.

This is the "Forum for Law School Students." Get the fuck out.

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MTal
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby MTal » Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:28 am

Waah waah waah, cry me a river.

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Haymarket
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby Haymarket » Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:42 am

MTal wrote:Waah waah waah, cry me a river.

Your fragile butt could not be any more tightly stuffed with sour grapes.

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MTal
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby MTal » Mon Jan 23, 2012 2:48 pm

Haymarket wrote:
MTal wrote:Waah waah waah, cry me a river.

Your fragile butt could not be any more tightly stuffed with sour grapes.


Thank you for the compliment.

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MrPapagiorgio
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby MrPapagiorgio » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:15 pm

--ImageRemoved--

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romothesavior
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby romothesavior » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:16 pm

FryBreadPower wrote:
MTal wrote:There are no jobs. Most of the ones to be had are there for the well connected, there are truly few openings for those on the outside who don't have an in. Don't be suckered into taking on mortgage sized debt for something worth only a small fraction of that amount.


I have a gut feeling this may be a sweeping generalization.

Nah, mtal doesn't make sweeping generalizations.

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3|ink
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby 3|ink » Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:49 pm

MTal wrote:There are no jobs. Most of the ones to be had are there for the well connected, there are truly few openings for those on the outside who don't have an in. Don't be suckered into taking on mortgage sized debt for something worth only a small fraction of that amount.

What came first? Did you fail out of law school before or after you realized that law school was a scam?

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thesealocust
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby thesealocust » Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:31 pm

Guys lay off Mtal. He and I are right. Less talky more drop outy.

nStiver
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby nStiver » Wed Jan 25, 2012 12:08 am

Obviously i was kidding about employers not wanting to see a quitter. I just think that most people on tls went into law school knowing the risks.

nStiver
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby nStiver » Wed Jan 25, 2012 12:10 am

And Mtal, why do you hang around law school forums if you are not in the field. Weird.

HeavenWood
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Re: Maybe you should drop out of law school.

Postby HeavenWood » Wed Jan 25, 2012 12:12 am

thesealocust wrote:It's that wonderful time of year, and I thought I'd make a friendly PSA that the best thing a 1L could do right now may well be to drop out of law school.

First, there aren't jobs for any of you. Sad times. Every year about 50,000 begin law school and the BLS estimates there might be 30,000 entry level legal jobs. In the entire country. And I hope you aren't in debt, because estimates suggest there are only on the order of 5,000 biglaw openings every year.

Second, it doesn't get any better. Your classmates are still going to be law students when you wake up tomorrow. Lawyer is still going to be the most hated profession. We're still going to be #1 in the U.S. News & World Report substance abuse, alcoholism, and depression rankings. Professors are still going to be asshats. Class will still be insufferable. The only thing that wears off after the first year is the naive hope that there might be a brighter future.

Third, sunk cost fallacy economics bla bla bla. The only thing worse than voluntarily giving up money in exchange for a semester of law school is doing so 6 times in a row and then becoming a lawyer. Remember kids: If at first you don't succeed, quit and don't admit to trying.

But thesealocust - aren't you still in law school? - I'm sure you are asking. The answer is yes, but I'm still in law school for the same reason I went to law school. Because I hate myself. Not for love of the law, career prospects, ambition, or because I want to be a lawyer. No no no, thesealocust went to law school because of thesealocust's off-the-charts self-loathing. It brought me to law school and it keeps me here.

But for the rest of you, there may yet be hope.

It's not too late.

Just one question. Do you actually go to Penn?




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