CivPro Exam

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brickman
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CivPro Exam

Postby brickman » Fri Nov 18, 2011 7:38 pm

So I'm fine with learning all the complex ass rules, it's just the nuance that the professor throws at me that I can't even begin to comprehend. I feel like I can understand when nuance is coming my way in torts and crim law, but I dunno what the fuck to do with it here.


As an example, here is a 2010 exam w/ answers:

--LinkRemoved--

comments appreciated.

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Extension_Cord
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby Extension_Cord » Fri Nov 18, 2011 7:49 pm

brickman wrote:So I'm fine with learning all the complex ass rules, it's just the nuance that the professor throws at me that I can't even begin to comprehend. I feel like I can understand when nuance is coming my way in torts and crim law, but I dunno what the fuck to do with it here.


As an example, here is a 2010 exam w/ answers:

--LinkRemoved--

comments appreciated.


Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu E, makes getting lucky that much more difficult.

hurldes
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby hurldes » Fri Nov 18, 2011 7:51 pm

I'm in the same boat as you... but thanks for the practice final with answers! I'll definitely use this to prepare.

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skw
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby skw » Fri Nov 18, 2011 8:02 pm

Ditto.

acrossthelake
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby acrossthelake » Fri Nov 18, 2011 8:15 pm

brickman wrote:So I'm fine with learning all the complex ass rules, it's just the nuance that the professor throws at me that I can't even begin to comprehend. I feel like I can understand when nuance is coming my way in torts and crim law, but I dunno what the fuck to do with it here.


As an example, here is a 2010 exam w/ answers:

--LinkRemoved--

comments appreciated.


What sorts of comments are you looking for?

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brickman
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby brickman » Fri Nov 18, 2011 8:37 pm

acrossthelake wrote:
brickman wrote:So I'm fine with learning all the complex ass rules, it's just the nuance that the professor throws at me that I can't even begin to comprehend. I feel like I can understand when nuance is coming my way in torts and crim law, but I dunno what the fuck to do with it here.


As an example, here is a 2010 exam w/ answers:

--LinkRemoved--

comments appreciated.


What sorts of comments are you looking for?


Extrapolation and variation of concepts in torts and crim is easy. but for this course, I just don't see all the areas where things can get interesting.

I don't see how the hell you can even conceptualize this type of stuff. I just work to make sure i have a super good understanding of how everything works together and then he throws random shit at me and i'm all like "wut"

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brickman
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby brickman » Fri Nov 18, 2011 8:37 pm

skw wrote:Ditto.



here are several of his:

http://msgre2.people.wm.edu/Old%20Final ... cedure.htm

got any to share?

acrossthelake
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby acrossthelake » Fri Nov 18, 2011 8:49 pm

brickman wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:
brickman wrote:So I'm fine with learning all the complex ass rules, it's just the nuance that the professor throws at me that I can't even begin to comprehend. I feel like I can understand when nuance is coming my way in torts and crim law, but I dunno what the fuck to do with it here.


As an example, here is a 2010 exam w/ answers:

--LinkRemoved--

comments appreciated.


What sorts of comments are you looking for?


Extrapolation and variation of concepts in torts and crim is easy. but for this course, I just don't see all the areas where things can get interesting.

I don't see how the hell you can even conceptualize this type of stuff. I just work to make sure i have a super good understanding of how everything works together and then he throws random shit at me and i'm all like "wut"



There's not a lot of extrapolation going on in Civ Pro. It's basically a series of a lot of rules and you have to know when they apply and how to apply it and in what order. Civ Pro is like one very large logic game. Just go step by step.

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brickman
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby brickman » Fri Nov 18, 2011 8:52 pm

acrossthelake wrote:
brickman wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:
brickman wrote:So I'm fine with learning all the complex ass rules, it's just the nuance that the professor throws at me that I can't even begin to comprehend. I feel like I can understand when nuance is coming my way in torts and crim law, but I dunno what the fuck to do with it here.


As an example, here is a 2010 exam w/ answers:

--LinkRemoved--

comments appreciated.


What sorts of comments are you looking for?


Extrapolation and variation of concepts in torts and crim is easy. but for this course, I just don't see all the areas where things can get interesting.

I don't see how the hell you can even conceptualize this type of stuff. I just work to make sure i have a super good understanding of how everything works together and then he throws random shit at me and i'm all like "wut"



There's not a lot of extrapolation going on in Civ Pro. It's basically a series of a lot of rules and you have to know when they apply and how to apply it and in what order. Civ Pro is like one very large logic game. Just go step by step.



If you look at the essays for this professor and you still believe that, then i'll feel much better.

acrossthelake
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby acrossthelake » Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:05 pm

brickman wrote:

If you look at the essays for this professor and you still believe that, then i'll feel much better.


Yes, I still believe that.

Sometimes the rules are most standard like, so you need to puzzle with them more. Personal jurisdiction has a lot of this. Esp. if you're applying the fair play & substantial justice analysis, or if you're trying to determine if the contacts were sufficient enough for personal jurisdiction, or if you're applying the Calder Effects test, etc. So there are judgment calls, but that's where you'll earn the meat of your points--discussing why one might go one way, or the other, and then choosing which you think is stronger.

ETA: And sometimes, when the rules don't quite make sense how they play out in terms of fairness and the extent to which it's transubstantive, it's likely there's a debate going on there, which is ripe for policy questions, some of which he seems to have throw at you.

ETA: I'm also a 1L, but CivPro is my favorite class, and I've done well on practice exams, hypos, etc.

bdubs
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby bdubs » Fri Nov 18, 2011 10:59 pm

Your professor seems like kind of a jerk in his answer key. This does look like a pretty standard civ pro exam though. The thing about PJ and Erie questions are that the standard is not entirely clear, hence all of the divided opinions from the Supreme Court. Just know the cases well and analogize the heck out of the facts. It's a subject where you need to be a little more creative than the typical BLL of torts or property.

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brickman
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby brickman » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:04 am

For some reason CivPro has just seemed alien to me the entire semester. I've been keeping up on doing the E&Es and everything, but I just don't have any comfort level with it.

and I'm still struggling to figure out how to get comfortable with talking about difficult factual situations with just about every element of CivPro.

STRESS

shock259
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby shock259 » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:15 am

Cool - thanks for the practice tests! ^_^

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ph14
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby ph14 » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:23 am

shock259 wrote:Cool - thanks for the practice tests! ^_^


+1. Thanks a lot man.

bdubs
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby bdubs » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:36 am

brickman wrote:For some reason CivPro has just seemed alien to me the entire semester. I've been keeping up on doing the E&Es and everything, but I just don't have any comfort level with it.

and I'm still struggling to figure out how to get comfortable with talking about difficult factual situations with just about every element of CivPro.

STRESS


Try making a flowchart/decision tree.

PJ looks something like this:

Fair play and substantial justice -> Minimum contacts or Personal Service or [creative argument, i.e. International Defendant, etc...]
Minimum contacts -> Purposeful direction, or Purposeful availment, or Stream of Commerce, or Effects (these can overlap quite a bit, but they can be distinguished too)
Underlying forms of contact -> Intentional torts, or Negligence/unintentional torts, or non-commercial actor, etc.....

You could probably go a few levels deeper, but you get the basic idea. Graphical form sometimes help in applying complex standards.

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brickman
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby brickman » Sat Nov 19, 2011 8:22 pm

so the E&E is pretty shitty on the PJ section, any good suggestions for practice?

acrossthelake
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby acrossthelake » Sat Nov 19, 2011 9:56 pm

brickman wrote:so the E&E is pretty shitty on the PJ section, any good suggestions for practice?


My prof has hypos he made up. I'll PM you them.

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ph14
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby ph14 » Sat Nov 19, 2011 9:59 pm

acrossthelake wrote:
brickman wrote:so the E&E is pretty shitty on the PJ section, any good suggestions for practice?


My prof has hypos he made up. I'll PM you them.


Pm to me as well please!

merc280
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby merc280 » Sat Nov 19, 2011 10:00 pm

..
Last edited by merc280 on Sat Nov 19, 2011 10:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

merc280
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby merc280 » Sat Nov 19, 2011 10:00 pm

ph14 wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:
brickman wrote:so the E&E is pretty shitty on the PJ section, any good suggestions for practice?


My prof has hypos he made up. I'll PM you them.


Pm to me as well please!



me too please. thank you

Breezin
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby Breezin » Sat Nov 19, 2011 10:20 pm

PM me too please!

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dabomb75
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby dabomb75 » Sat Nov 19, 2011 11:46 pm

can I get these magical hypos as well?


Also, I've heard the acing civil procedure book has decent practice Qs in it general. Not sure how it is specifically for PJ but you might want to take a look at the book

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PinkCow
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby PinkCow » Sat Nov 19, 2011 11:56 pm

Add me to the magic hypo list?

Also, OP your prof does sound a little...tense...Is he a jerk in class?

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johansantana21
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby johansantana21 » Sun Nov 20, 2011 12:02 am

Could I get these hypos too? Thanks!

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brickman
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Re: CivPro Exam

Postby brickman » Sun Nov 20, 2011 12:19 am

PinkCow wrote:Add me to the magic hypo list?

Also, OP your prof does sound a little...tense...Is he a jerk in class?



haha, no he is an excellent professor, brilliant guy. but he is certainly enthusiastic.

he uses this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Point-bise ... oefficient

to determine when to drop out a multiple choice question. Yaleies...go figure.




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