1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

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Extension_Cord
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby Extension_Cord » Thu Dec 01, 2011 2:42 pm

On a torts exam, if there are two classes of people who are seeking to recover for the negligence of the actor and the negligent act is the same for both. Do I need to do the whole duty, breach, causation thing again if the only difference is in damage? Would saying something like, "Just as in the A v. B analaysis, B owes a duty to C for the same reasoning. However... (just get into damage where the difference arises).

Exam is tomorrow, :(

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dabomb75
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby dabomb75 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 2:59 pm

Extension_Cord wrote:On a torts exam, if there are two classes of people who are seeking to recover for the negligence of the actor and the negligent act is the same for both. Do I need to do the whole duty, breach, causation thing again if the only difference is in damage? Would saying something like, "Just as in the A v. B analaysis, B owes a duty to C for the same reasoning. However... (just get into damage where the difference arises).

Exam is tomorrow, :(


You could probably either do that or just do A + B vs. C. Do the duty, breach, and causation analyses together for both, then just say damages for A v. C, then do damages for B v. C

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kalvano
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby kalvano » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:02 pm

Extension_Cord wrote:On a torts exam, if there are two classes of people who are seeking to recover for the negligence of the actor and the negligent act is the same for both. Do I need to do the whole duty, breach, causation thing again if the only difference is in damage? Would saying something like, "Just as in the A v. B analaysis, B owes a duty to C for the same reasoning. However... (just get into damage where the difference arises).

Exam is tomorrow, :(



Ask your professor if you need to do it. Some want an analysis every time, others only want it when the facts are different. Your prof will probably be more than willing to tell you the preference, since it could mean the difference between a lot of reading and not so much reading.

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introversional
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby introversional » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:06 pm

dabomb75 wrote:
Extension_Cord wrote:On a torts exam, if there are two classes of people who are seeking to recover for the negligence of the actor and the negligent act is the same for both. Do I need to do the whole duty, breach, causation thing again if the only difference is in damage? Would saying something like, "Just as in the A v. B analaysis, B owes a duty to C for the same reasoning. However... (just get into damage where the difference arises).

Exam is tomorrow, :(


You could probably either do that or just do A + B vs. C. Do the duty, breach, and causation analyses together for both, then just say damages for A v. C, then do damages for B v. C



Not so fast... Causation (both direct and proximate) can be different for both.... I would definitely do individual causation analyses for both.

Think Palsgraf - with an extra Plaintiff, maybe another guard standing nearby (within the zone of danger) got hurt and wanted to recover. Clearly the same causation analysis wouldn't suffice for that lady standing way down the tracks. (if I remember the case correctly) If there's 2 plaintiffs, Causation + Damages can be different, even if there's only one negligent actor.
Last edited by introversional on Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Lasers
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby Lasers » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:11 pm

ilovesf wrote:
Lasers wrote:studying for the next final. :shock:

i'll grab a beer and a bite to eat with a couple of friends and chill out for most of tomorrow, but yeah, i'll probably fit in an hour or two to get started on civpro.

I think I'm going to put down the books tonight so I don't go crazy, but I'll wake up at 7 tomorrow and start studying for civpro. I actually had a dream last night about future estates. ugh. I'm going to take nyquil the next night before a final so I don't wake up freaking out about when something is subject to RAP.

last night was disastrous for me. the wind was forcefully pounding on my thin window pane all night; sounded like someone was trying to break in. i couldn't sleep until 6am.

oh well, i don't feel tired, and i never seem to get a good amount of sleep before any big test anyway. :lol:

Seminole_305
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby Seminole_305 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:46 pm

Property Exam was a complete curve ball. It was so easy but I am positive my professor had all kinds of crap hidden in there.

For one essay how many words is too much? I pumped out about 2200 words... too much?

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ilovesf
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby ilovesf » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:46 pm

Seminole_305 wrote:Property Exam was a complete curve ball. It was so easy but I am positive my professor had all kinds of crap hidden in there.

For one essay how many words is too much? I pumped out about 2200 words... too much?

totally depends on the length of the question and how many issues there are.

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kalvano
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby kalvano » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:47 pm

Seminole_305 wrote:For one essay how many words is too much? I pumped out about 2200 words... too much?



Next time try for double that.

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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby SwampRat88 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:55 pm

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Last edited by SwampRat88 on Sun Jan 01, 2012 6:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Lasers
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby Lasers » Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:03 pm

kalvano wrote:
Seminole_305 wrote:For one essay how many words is too much? I pumped out about 2200 words... too much?



Next time try for double that.

4000 words for one essay?

i don't know what your teacher wants, by my teacher would be appalled.

Seminole_305
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby Seminole_305 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:15 pm

ilovesf wrote:
Seminole_305 wrote:Property Exam was a complete curve ball. It was so easy but I am positive my professor had all kinds of crap hidden in there.

For one essay how many words is too much? I pumped out about 2200 words... too much?

totally depends on the length of the question and how many issues there are.


Wasn't that many issues from what I can tell (I might be a dummy and miss a bunch) at most 4 or 5.

Seminole_305
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby Seminole_305 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:16 pm

kalvano wrote:
Seminole_305 wrote:For one essay how many words is too much? I pumped out about 2200 words... too much?



Next time try for double that.


4000??? No fluff just pure analysis? Jebus Thrist.

Glad to know I didn't over do it because I walked thinking damn I just threw everything I had on there.

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kalvano
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby kalvano » Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:24 pm

Lasers wrote:
kalvano wrote:
Seminole_305 wrote:For one essay how many words is too much? I pumped out about 2200 words... too much?



Next time try for double that.

4000 words for one essay?

i don't know what your teacher wants, by my teacher would be appalled.



Depends on the class. But yeah. The more the better, usually, as long as you aren't throwing in totally unrelated crap.

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kalvano
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby kalvano » Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:25 pm

Seminole_305 wrote:
kalvano wrote:
Seminole_305 wrote:For one essay how many words is too much? I pumped out about 2200 words... too much?



Next time try for double that.


4000??? No fluff just pure analysis? Jebus Thrist.

Glad to know I didn't over do it because I walked thinking damn I just threw everything I had on there.



Think about it. The rule, the analysis, the back and forth, the policy justifications for and against...I mean you're not going to hit 4,000 on a brief answer, but for a midsized or big issue spotter, yeah. I wrote a model answer for my Crim Pro class and I missed a couple of issues and still came in at 3000 words.

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gdane
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby gdane » Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:37 pm

Silly question, but I want to confirm the answer to this question.

For removal jurisdiction in regards to a federal question, do you need complete diversity? Example: P and D are both from Delaware. P sues D in DE state court for sexual harrassment under the civil rights act. 20 days later, D removes to DE Fed. Dist. Ct.

Is this removal appropriate even though D is a resident of DE? Im not sure if the "D cannot remove if he is a resident of the state where the action is brought" rule applies here. 1441(b) is confusing me.

Thanks!!!

Voltaire
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby Voltaire » Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:43 pm

gdane wrote:Silly question, but I want to confirm the answer to this question.

For removal jurisdiction in regards to a federal question, do you need complete diversity? Example: P and D are both from Delaware. P sues D in DE state court for sexual harrassment under the civil rights act. 20 days later, D removes to DE Fed. Dist. Ct.

Is this removal appropriate even though D is a resident of DE? Im not sure if the "D cannot remove if he is a resident of the state where the action is brought" rule applies here. 1441(b) is confusing me.

Thanks!!!

You can remove. The first part of 1441b says that if it comes out of the Constitution, it can be removed regardless of citizenship. The second part of 1441b is "any other such action shall be removable only if none of the parties in interest properly joined and served as defendants is a citizen of the State in which such action is brought" which is talking about diversity.

So the first sentence of 1441b is for 1331 and the second sentence is for 1332.

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gdane
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby gdane » Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:46 pm

Thank you!

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gdane
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby gdane » Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:15 pm

I have another question...


For supplemental jurisdiction, does the state claim being attached have to meet the amount in controversy requirement?

Example- P sues D in federal court for sexual harrasment under the civil rights act. P then uses supplemental jurisdiction to add another sexual harrasment claim against another person, but this claim is under state tort law.

Is this ok?

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ph14
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby ph14 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:18 pm

gdane wrote:I have another question...


For supplemental jurisdiction, does the state claim being attached have to meet the amount in controversy requirement?

Example- P sues D in federal court for sexual harrasment under the civil rights act. P then uses supplemental jurisdiction to add another sexual harrasment claim against another person, but this claim is under state tort law.

Is this ok?


No, it does not need to meet the amount in controversy requirement; if it arises out of the same case or controversy then it is a candidate. Next you have to look as to whether it is a diversity claim, if it is, 1367(b) applies, and you have to check to see if the exceptions apply and the court does not have supplemental jurisdiction. And remember that supplemental jurisdiction is discretionary, so look to 1367(c) to see if the court should decline to exercise supplemental jurisdiction.

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gdane
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby gdane » Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:21 pm

Got it! I thought so. I went with my gut and wrote out my answer under that assumption.

Im doing practice questions, but I keep questioning myself. Or I run into little caveats that I think I havent run into before and i force myself to overthink.

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ph14
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby ph14 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:22 pm

gdane wrote:Got it! I thought so. I went with my gut and wrote out my answer under that assumption.

Im doing practice questions, but I keep questioning myself. Or I run into little caveats that I think I havent run into before and i force myself to overthink.


The key to doing good on a law school exam is never think. Trust me.

071816
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby 071816 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 5:26 pm

gdane wrote:I have another question...


For supplemental jurisdiction, does the state claim being attached have to meet the amount in controversy requirement?

Example- P sues D in federal court for sexual harrasment under the civil rights act. P then uses supplemental jurisdiction to add another sexual harrasment claim against another person, but this claim is under state tort law.

Is this ok?


If P is suing D under the Civil Rights Act (a federal statute) then it's federal question jurisdiction (not diversity) in which case the amount in controversy requirement doesn't even apply. You would then go through the 1367 analysis (minus 1367(b), which doesn't apply here either because this is not a diversity case).

ETA: to answer your original question, in diversity, I don't think the supplemental claim needs to satisfy the amount in controversy requirement as long as there is proper original jurisdiction over the main claim and the main claim satisfies the requirement.

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dabomb75
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby dabomb75 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:02 pm

just found out my torts professor makes his tests really easy issue spotting-wise but expects tons of policy arguments on the exam. Crap.

Not sure how I'm going to approach it...

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istara
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby istara » Thu Dec 01, 2011 9:26 pm

Finished and bound my civ pro outline, civ pro cheat sheet is done, and the professor is posting the background facts for the exam tonight. It's all coming together.. I still suck at Erie hypos though.

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crossarmant
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Re: 1L Exam Prep and Motivation Thread

Postby crossarmant » Thu Dec 01, 2011 9:53 pm

Just did my first non-mid term practice exam... I feel pretty confident about my performance. I'm meeting with the prof tomorrow morning to be taken down a peg or 8.




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