Memo Woes

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AVBucks4239
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby AVBucks4239 » Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:41 pm

shoeshine wrote:30 hours on a 12 page memo including research (used about 7 cases in the actual memo).

I suck at citations though. I literally spent 1/4 of the time looking shit up in the blue book

If you use Westlaw Next, pull the PDF of the case instead of the electronic version. It will tell you how to cite the case at the top of each page. The only thing you may need to look up is if something needs to be abbreviated, like "Enterprises."

VA Politco
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby VA Politco » Sat Oct 15, 2011 1:40 pm

AVBucks4239 wrote:
shoeshine wrote:30 hours on a 12 page memo including research (used about 7 cases in the actual memo).

I suck at citations though. I literally spent 1/4 of the time looking shit up in the blue book

If you use Westlaw Next, pull the PDF of the case instead of the electronic version. It will tell you how to cite the case at the top of each page. The only thing you may need to look up is if something needs to be abbreviated, like "Enterprises."


Awful idea. Both West and Lexis get cites wrong ALL the time. Learn how to do it yourself and thank me later.

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SilverE2
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby SilverE2 » Sat Oct 15, 2011 1:42 pm

VA Politco wrote:
AVBucks4239 wrote:
shoeshine wrote:30 hours on a 12 page memo including research (used about 7 cases in the actual memo).

I suck at citations though. I literally spent 1/4 of the time looking shit up in the blue book

If you use Westlaw Next, pull the PDF of the case instead of the electronic version. It will tell you how to cite the case at the top of each page. The only thing you may need to look up is if something needs to be abbreviated, like "Enterprises."


Awful idea. Both West and Lexis get cites wrong ALL the time. Learn how to do it yourself and thank me later.


Yep, HOWEVER you can save a lot of time, once you've learned it the right way, by pulling the cites from lexis or westlaw and just editing them.

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ph14
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby ph14 » Sat Oct 15, 2011 6:46 pm

Open memo now...much worse than closed memo.

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Naked Dude
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby Naked Dude » Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:18 pm

ph14 wrote:Open memo now...much worse than closed memo.


ph14 speaks the truth...

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gdane
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby gdane » Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:44 pm

Doing the research on my memo is taking me way too long. When I find a good case, it has some kind of negative treatment. The good thing is that I know what I want to write.

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TheFutureLawyer
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby TheFutureLawyer » Sat Oct 15, 2011 8:00 pm

I thought the memo went slow. Today I've been outlining for the midterm. FML. I'll finish outlining tonight with a little luck (luck in that I don't fall asleep / jump out the window first).

shock259
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby shock259 » Sat Oct 15, 2011 8:14 pm

Open memo is a lot less fun, I agree. My issue is so narrow that there are only a handful of cases on it. Some aren't even published. I guess this is nice because I don't have to worry too much about later treatment, but finding authoritative sources is really difficult. not to mention all of the analysis I am finding is ridiculously shallow and conclusory, probably in part because it is from lower courts.

Blah.

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TheFutureLawyer
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby TheFutureLawyer » Sat Oct 15, 2011 10:51 pm

shock259 wrote:conclusory


Upon seeing this word, am I the only one that immediately thinks about Iqbal? Is Civ Pro studying leaking out of me?

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ilovesf
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby ilovesf » Sun Oct 16, 2011 12:57 am

doing research for my final memo now, this shit is annoying. it's fun because it's about the sf giants, but the issues are super vague so there is tons of info out there. good thing my prof is cool and i can e-mail her the cases I plan on using and she'll tell me if I've got it down or should do more work. We have to use about 10 cases for out 10 page memo, but she wants us to string cite and try parenthetical citations so we need a lot of cases.

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queenlizzie13
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby queenlizzie13 » Sun Oct 16, 2011 1:12 am

Does anyone else feel as if the scope wasn't as narrow as it was intended to be for the gw memo? E.g. there wasn't sufficient enough research to realize how complex each issue could be, and we weren't given enough information?

I am finding in a couple of places I have to make assumptions based on the fact pattern.

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ilovesf
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby ilovesf » Sun Oct 16, 2011 1:15 am

queenlizzie13 wrote:Does anyone else feel as if the scope wasn't as narrow as it was intended to be for the gw memo? E.g. there wasn't sufficient enough research to realize how complex each issue could be, and we weren't given enough information?

I am finding in a couple of places I have to make assumptions based on the fact pattern.

does your whole year or section get the same memo? almost all of our 12 person groups get different memos, and for this one every single professor writes their own for their 12 student class

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ph14
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby ph14 » Sun Oct 16, 2011 9:54 am

ilovesf wrote:
queenlizzie13 wrote:Does anyone else feel as if the scope wasn't as narrow as it was intended to be for the gw memo? E.g. there wasn't sufficient enough research to realize how complex each issue could be, and we weren't given enough information?

I am finding in a couple of places I have to make assumptions based on the fact pattern.

does your whole year or section get the same memo? almost all of our 12 person groups get different memos, and for this one every single professor writes their own for their 12 student class


That seems a bit unfair if the class is curved and graded.

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Naked Dude
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby Naked Dude » Sun Oct 16, 2011 12:54 pm

queenlizzie13 wrote:Does anyone else feel as if the scope wasn't as narrow as it was intended to be for the gw memo? E.g. there wasn't sufficient enough research to realize how complex each issue could be, and we weren't given enough information?

I am finding in a couple of places I have to make assumptions based on the fact pattern.


Yeah. I realized that if I didn't make assumptions (mostly about the assigning memo authors' intent) in areas that did not seem to be the meat of the assignment, I'd end up with a 20+ page memo. Figuring out what's important and what's not is an integral part of any writing assignment, but I feel like that aspect of this particular memo was more of a pain than usual.

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ilovesf
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby ilovesf » Sun Oct 16, 2011 1:03 pm

ph14 wrote:
ilovesf wrote:
queenlizzie13 wrote:Does anyone else feel as if the scope wasn't as narrow as it was intended to be for the gw memo? E.g. there wasn't sufficient enough research to realize how complex each issue could be, and we weren't given enough information?

I am finding in a couple of places I have to make assumptions based on the fact pattern.

does your whole year or section get the same memo? almost all of our 12 person groups get different memos, and for this one every single professor writes their own for their 12 student class


That seems a bit unfair if the class is curved and graded.

it's graded but it doesn't go into our gpa, it is listed separately. they set a b+ median but can distribute grades how they want as long as they keep the b+

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FeelTheHeat
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby FeelTheHeat » Sun Oct 16, 2011 1:33 pm

Tagging this because I have a memo due Friday and haven't come close to starting it

shock259
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby shock259 » Sun Oct 16, 2011 4:34 pm

Graded but not factored into GPA? That's even weirder than a grade LRW.

Sandro
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby Sandro » Sun Oct 16, 2011 4:48 pm

Our graded LRW professor told us he really doesnt care about the blue book and wont really care if we get it right, as he made multiple mistakes trying to show us how to sample cite things on the board.

Does anyone know of a good guide to help with the bluebook/LRW ? I know the blue book isnt that hard to use, but our class has literally had zero instruction other than aimless classes about nothing.

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ph14
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby ph14 » Sun Oct 16, 2011 4:51 pm

Sandro wrote:Our graded LRW professor told us he really doesnt care about the blue book and wont really care if we get it right, as he made multiple mistakes trying to show us how to sample cite things on the board.

Does anyone know of a good guide to help with the bluebook/LRW ? I know the blue book isnt that hard to use, but our class has literally had zero instruction other than aimless classes about nothing.


Bluebook guide:

Party v. (Check Abbreviations T6)Other Party, Volume# Reporter[check T1] 1stpage, Pincite (court[T1] year)

Shortforms: Party, Volume# Reporter at Pincite
Volume# Reporter at Pincite
Id. at Pincite
Id. (Id. when it starts a sentence, otherwise .id)

That's about it.
Last edited by ph14 on Sun Oct 16, 2011 4:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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ilovesf
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby ilovesf » Sun Oct 16, 2011 4:52 pm

shock259 wrote:Graded but not factored into GPA? That's even weirder than a grade LRW.

it's weird, i guess it is so that down the line when we just have to tell people our GPAs our shitty memos won't come back and haunt us

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Naked Dude
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby Naked Dude » Sun Oct 16, 2011 6:41 pm

Sandro wrote:Our graded LRW professor told us he really doesnt care about the blue book


G. Lous.

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Naked Dude
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby Naked Dude » Sun Oct 16, 2011 6:42 pm

ph14 wrote:
Sandro wrote:Our graded LRW professor told us he really doesnt care about the blue book and wont really care if we get it right, as he made multiple mistakes trying to show us how to sample cite things on the board.

Does anyone know of a good guide to help with the bluebook/LRW ? I know the blue book isnt that hard to use, but our class has literally had zero instruction other than aimless classes about nothing.


Bluebook guide:

Party v. (Check Abbreviations T6)Other Party, Volume# Reporter[check T1] 1stpage, Pincite (court[T1] year)

Shortforms: Party, Volume# Reporter at Pincite
Volume# Reporter at Pincite
Id. at Pincite
Id. (Id. when it starts a sentence, otherwise .id)

That's about it.


Yeah, I think I've managed to avoid the more complex citations.

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alicrimson
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby alicrimson » Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:40 am

Oh, memo woes...Am currently taking a memo break by attempting to drown my preliminary-memo-due-Thursday woes in Diet Dr. Pepper. Already researched and am currently drafting. I've been at it for the past seven hours. (I, like probably all of you, hate citations with a passion. Also, I like to proof paragraphs multiple times prior to moving to the next one.) Hopefully the combination of Dr. Pepper and second daily helping of vyvanse will get me through sun up and an estimated six-seven more pages. (double spaced, times new roman, size 14 font no less :roll: ) This is the turned in rough draft to the final memo. Hoping it will be of decent quality and the prof's comments will result in a spiffy final memo that does not result in an unacceptable grade in what is allegedly the biggest blow off class of the semester.
/End procrastination-break-rant. Good luck to all with upcoming memos! May your citations follow all proper blue book citation rules.

Edit: half way done with the can of pop. still waiting for Pitbull to show up at my apartment with a party.

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ilovesf
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby ilovesf » Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:28 pm

I got a B+ on my first graded memo, and it counts for like 30% of my grade. I'm not totally unhappy with that grade, but it sucks because on my first draft she wrote great job on some sections and offered no criticism for those areas, and then marked it up a lot on my final draft and wrote a bunch of things she didn't like about it. I specifically asked her if I should change some of those areas during our meeting, and she told me no and that it was good the way it was, then wrote on my final draft I should change it. wtf is up with that? tl;dr, memos suck and memo grading is stupid.

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ph14
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Re: Memo Woes

Postby ph14 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:30 pm

ilovesf wrote:I got a B+ on my first graded memo, and it counts for like 30% of my grade. I'm not totally unhappy with that grade, but it sucks because on my first draft she wrote great job on some sections and offered no criticism for those areas, and then marked it up a lot on my final draft and wrote a bunch of things she didn't like about it. I specifically asked her if I should change some of those areas during our meeting, and she told me no and that it was good the way it was, then wrote on my final draft I should change it. wtf is up with that? tl;dr, memos suck and memo grading is stupid.


That's kind of what I feel is going to happen to me, but I haven't gotten my grade back yet




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