Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

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jaydizzle
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Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby jaydizzle » Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:49 pm

So, my professor told us to read Rule 12 out of the civil rules supplement. I just cannot wrap my head around the rule to interpret it in the various scenarios I have to do. I have no idea where to start. I feel as if I need a good grasp on the terms there such as answer, pleading, motion, and etc. I seem to be grasping these better, but I just can't read the damn rule. Is there someplace that explains rules really well, so I can wrap my head around them?

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kalvano
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby kalvano » Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:57 pm

Don't worry, it's completely normal.

Pick up the Civ Pro E&E, 6th edition. It will be extenely helpful.

jaydizzle
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby jaydizzle » Wed Aug 31, 2011 7:04 pm

kalvano wrote:Don't worry, it's completely normal.

Pick up the Civ Pro E&E, 6th edition. It will be extenely helpful.


Thanks. Do you have an ISBN or anything? I might want to get this asap heh. I feel like I will need supplements in all my other classes and doing some forum searches seems to show all you need is the E&E for each class.

WilliamMary123
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby WilliamMary123 » Wed Aug 31, 2011 7:18 pm

What is E&E?

Thanks!

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Magnolia
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby Magnolia » Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:03 pm

WilliamMary123 wrote:What is E&E?

Thanks!

Examples and Explanations series

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sundance95
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby sundance95 » Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:03 pm

CivPro E&E by Glannon. Should be in your law school bookstore, but here's the ISBN anyway:

9780735570337

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Holly Golightly
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby Holly Golightly » Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:17 am

The Glannon Guide is also amazingly helpful for civpro. I didn't understand that class at all until 2 days before my exam, and the only reasons I ever understood it at all are the E&E and Glannon Guide.

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kalvano
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby kalvano » Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:20 am

Holly Golightly wrote:The Glannon Guide is also amazingly helpful for civpro. I didn't understand that class at all until 2 days before my exam, and the only reasons I ever understood it at all are the E&E and Glannon Guide.


Yep. I liked the Guide for exam review and the E&E for class prep / understanding.

But the Guide has different topics, too.

shoeshine
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby shoeshine » Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:25 am

Hang in there man. I think we all feel that way. I am understanding the concepts and the rules but I am not seeing the big picture here.

I am hoping that will change in a month or two.

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fathergoose
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby fathergoose » Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:53 am

Glannon Guide is TCR. Soooo money and doesn't even know it

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AVBucks4239
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby AVBucks4239 » Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:32 am

I've only been in class for all of three weeks, but I can tell you that it's important to clarify anything you're confused about when you are confronted by it. The class is going to move on regardless of whether you understand the material or not. The next topics are more likely to build upon what you have learned rather than to clarify it. Making sense of something now will probably save you time in the long run.

Take a deep breath, relax and remember that most of your classmates are probably as lost as you. I felt like an idiot walking out of a property lecture this week, only to be comforted by one of my smarter classmates asking me after class, "Was our professor speaking English?"

Go to your library tomorrow morning to take a look at the Glannon E&E on CivPro. It should be available and will clear up a lot of things for you.

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king3780
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby king3780 » Thu Sep 01, 2011 3:36 am

AVBucks4239 wrote:I've only been in class for all of three weeks, but I can tell you that it's important to clarify anything you're confused about when you are confronted by it. The class is going to move on regardless of whether you understand the material or not. The next topics are more likely to build upon what you have learned rather than to clarify it. Making sense of something now will probably save you time in the long run.

Take a deep breath, relax and remember that most of your classmates are probably as lost as you. I felt like an idiot walking out of a property lecture this week, only to be comforted by one of my smarter classmates asking me after class, "Was our professor speaking English?"

Go to your library tomorrow morning to take a look at the Glannon E&E on CivPro. It should be available and will clear up a lot of things for you.


I have a 30-45 minute commute each way and had to take a couple weekend trips which were a couple hours each way. I listened to this http://www.amazon.com/Substance-Audio-C ... 483&sr=8-2 and it all suddenly made sense near the end of the semester.

TooOld4This
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby TooOld4This » Thu Sep 01, 2011 7:49 am

It is such a shame the way professors tend to teach CivPro. It is an immensely practical course, yet many of the profs really wanted to be ConLaw professors, so they teach the theory before giving you the nuts and bolts. Figuring out the nuts and bolts, at least at a high level, will go a long way in making the course make more sense. Here are some tips to supplement the Glannon Guide and the E&E (which are both excellent resources and should be part of your study regime).

I'm not sure if they still have it, but Barbri used to have an excellent lecture on CivPro that you got access to if you signed up as a 1L.

Here is a flow chart that walks you through a civil case. It doesn't give all the intricacies, and completely skips things like third-parties, but should give you a good birds eye view. If you Google, I'm sure you can come up with more. --LinkRemoved--

Legal dictionaries are your friend. Sometimes half the battle is defining the terms. You should have online access to Black's, but this one is also an easy one to access. http://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx

Don't forget Wikipedia. This goes for any class. The site is very good for most legal issues. It will very often paint the big picture for you, which will make getting down into the details easier.

Geist13
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby Geist13 » Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:22 pm

I actually don't think Glannon's two books are very good. I would have done horribly in civ pro had I used them; they did not go nearly deep enough into civ pro issues. I recommend the Freer book, Introduction to Civil Procedure.

To the above poster lamenting that that civ pro is not "nuts and bolts" oriented enough, that's a load of bull. I can't think of something more "nuts and bolts" than questions such as "where can I file this suit" (jurisdiction) or "which law will the court apply in this case." (Erie and choice of law) Like it or not, these are constitutional concerns regarding the scope of a court's power. They are also incredibly practical. Moreover, many of the less theoretical issues, like the joinder rules, can't be accurately understood without first understanding jurisdiction.

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AVBucks4239
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby AVBucks4239 » Thu Sep 01, 2011 6:26 pm

Geist13 wrote:I actually don't think Glannon's two books are very good. I would have done horribly in civ pro had I used them; they did not go nearly deep enough into civ pro issues. I recommend the Freer book, Introduction to Civil Procedure.

To the above poster lamenting that that civ pro is not "nuts and bolts" oriented enough, that's a load of bull. I can't think of something more "nuts and bolts" than questions such as "where can I file this suit" (jurisdiction) or "which law will the court apply in this case." (Erie and choice of law) Like it or not, these are constitutional concerns regarding the scope of a court's power. They are also incredibly practical. Moreover, many of the less theoretical issues, like the joinder rules, can't be accurately understood without first understanding jurisdiction.

Go back and read what the above poster wrote.

TooOld4This wrote:It is such a shame the way professors tend to teach CivPro. It is an immensely practical course, yet many of the profs really wanted to be ConLaw professors, so they teach the theory before giving you the nuts and bolts. Figuring out the nuts and bolts, at least at a high level, will go a long way in making the course make more sense. Here are some tips to supplement the Glannon Guide and the E&E (which are both excellent resources and should be part of your study regime).

I'm not sure if they still have it, but Barbri used to have an excellent lecture on CivPro that you got access to if you signed up as a 1L.

Here is a flow chart that walks you through a civil case. It doesn't give all the intricacies, and completely skips things like third-parties, but should give you a good birds eye view. If you Google, I'm sure you can come up with more. --LinkRemoved--

Legal dictionaries are your friend. Sometimes half the battle is defining the terms. You should have online access to Black's, but this one is also an easy one to access. http://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx

Don't forget Wikipedia. This goes for any class. The site is very good for most legal issues. It will very often paint the big picture for you, which will make getting down into the details easier.

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Wholigan
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby Wholigan » Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:31 am

Relax. I didn't understand anything in Civ Pro until at least October, and I ended up with the highest grade in the class. I also didn't use an E&E for Civ Pro, but I do think they can be helpful, do I'm not discouraging that. By all means, watch the Barbri video during the second half of the semester, and watch it again before finals. By the end, almost everyone will understand the concepts, and if you have a knack for taking law school exams, you will do well, and if you are average at taking law school exams, you will probably do average.

minnabi
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby minnabi » Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:26 am

Seriously - best supplement EVER is either the Civ Pro Examples and Explanations for a more thorough discussion OR the Glannon's Guide for a less thorough discussion. I'd go with the EE bc it is written by Glannon too but is more in depth. It SAVED my grade in Civ Pro.

http://www.spam.com

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SilverE2
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby SilverE2 » Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:34 am

minnabi wrote:Seriously - best supplement EVER is either the Civ Pro Examples and Explanations for a more thorough discussion OR the Glannon's Guide for a less thorough discussion. I'd go with the EE bc it is written by Glannon too but is more in depth. It SAVED my grade in Civ Pro.

http://www.spam.com


I love the Wolters Kluwers advertisement spam strategy:

Step 1: Insert "advice"
Step 2: Insert spam

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fathergoose
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby fathergoose » Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:39 am

SilverE2 wrote:
minnabi wrote:Seriously - best supplement EVER is either the Civ Pro Examples and Explanations for a more thorough discussion OR the Glannon's Guide for a less thorough discussion. I'd go with the EE bc it is written by Glannon too but is more in depth. It SAVED my grade in Civ Pro.

http://www.spam.com


I love the Wolters Kluwers advertisement spam strategy:

Step 1: Insert "advice"
Step 2: Insert spam

Not spam. Anybody whose taken civ pro can tell you glannon guide is the best thing out there (or damn near close to it). Minnabi is just trying to be helpful. Chill out and stop being so cynical.

Edit: I stand partially corrected. The user may be spamming but the advice is not. Glannon Guide is the shit. Saved my ass in civ pro both semesters. Please feel free to continue at a slightly reduced level of cynicism

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shepdawg
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby shepdawg » Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:49 am

jaydizzle wrote:
kalvano wrote:Don't worry, it's completely normal.

Pick up the Civ Pro E&E, 6th edition. It will be extenely helpful.


Thanks. Do you have an ISBN or anything? I might want to get this asap heh. I feel like I will need supplements in all my other classes and doing some forum searches seems to show all you need is the E&E for each class.

Asking for the ISBN cleared up the reason you're not understanding statutes. Reading and interpreting statutes takes work. Those unwilling to put forth the effort will not understand them unless they're extra intelligent.

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SilverE2
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby SilverE2 » Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:50 am

fathergoose wrote:
SilverE2 wrote:
minnabi wrote:Seriously - best supplement EVER is either the Civ Pro Examples and Explanations for a more thorough discussion OR the Glannon's Guide for a less thorough discussion. I'd go with the EE bc it is written by Glannon too but is more in depth. It SAVED my grade in Civ Pro.

http://www.spam.com


I love the Wolters Kluwers advertisement spam strategy:

Step 1: Insert "advice"
Step 2: Insert spam

Not spam. Anybody whose taken civ pro can tell you glannon guide is the best thing out there (or damn near close to it). Minnabi is just trying to be helpful. Chill out and stop being so cynical.

Edit: I stand partially corrected. The user may be spamming but the advice is not. Glannon Guide is the shit. Saved my ass in civ pro both semesters. Please feel free to continue at a slightly reduced level of cynicism


See here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=164619

Regardless of the quality of the advice, this seems to be a Wolters Kluwers spamming strategy.

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fathergoose
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby fathergoose » Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:56 am

SilverE2 wrote:See here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=164619

Regardless of the quality of the advice, this seems to be a Wolters Kluwers spamming strategy.

Wow that's really too bad. They actually have some really good supplements. It's a shame to see them stoop to this. I wonder if this is a concerted corporate effort or just some very ill informed rep.

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Redzo
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby Redzo » Sat Sep 03, 2011 1:01 am

fathergoose wrote:
SilverE2 wrote:See here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=164619

Regardless of the quality of the advice, this seems to be a Wolters Kluwers spamming strategy.

Wow that's really too bad. They actually have some really good supplements. It's a shame to see them stoop to this. I wonder if this is a concerted corporate effort or just some very ill informed rep.


I can picture this... well-dressed men sitting around a boardroom while one unveils their new marketing campaign... "Gentlemen, we are going to spam TLS."

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fathergoose
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Re: Week 2, and I feel lost in Civ pro already!

Postby fathergoose » Sat Sep 03, 2011 1:23 am

Redzo wrote:
fathergoose wrote:
SilverE2 wrote:See here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=164619

Regardless of the quality of the advice, this seems to be a Wolters Kluwers spamming strategy.

Wow that's really too bad. They actually have some really good supplements. It's a shame to see them stoop to this. I wonder if this is a concerted corporate effort or just some very ill informed rep.


I can picture this... well-dressed men sitting around a boardroom while one unveils their new marketing campaign... "Gentlemen, we are going to spam TLS."

I would be curious the amount of money spent on supplements by registered TLS users. I have to imagine it's a massive number. If a company could build a grass roots consensus on TLS that a certain supplement was incredible, I bet they would see a spike in sales. They would have to be extremely subtle to pull it off though.




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