It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

(Study Tips, Dealing With Stress, Maintaining a Social Life, Financial Aid, Internships, Bar Exam, Careers in Law . . . )
CanuckObserver
Posts: 45
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:19 am

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby CanuckObserver » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:53 pm

kalvano wrote:That will change about 30 seconds after they are actually exposed to the criminal justice system.


This. Studying the criminal law is a lot more fun than actual practice and most people realize this early on. Most of these students will not end up anywhere near criminal law, unless it is at the wrong end of a DUI.

There are always a couple who dream of being a DA or PD and stick with that through school, but they often are not even the ones you suspected were leaning that way in my experience.

User avatar
FeelTheHeat
Posts: 5203
Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2011 2:32 am

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby FeelTheHeat » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:57 pm

pinkcamellia wrote:My personal favorite so far was the guy who believed that because everyone enters a social contract, everyone starts off at the same point in life and gets the same benefits as everyone else.

Guy: Well, they (poor people) get the same protection as everyone else. They shouldn't be out committing crimes. It's their own fault they aren't receiving their benefits.
Prof: So, you think if you're an underprivileged individual, and you call the police in a poor neighborhood in the middle of the night, they're going to come right away?
Guy: Of course, they're the police.
Prof: *laughs and shakes head*
Guy sitting next to me: Hasn't he ever seen The Wire?


Now I wish I was in your section.

jkay
Posts: 399
Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 2:47 pm

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby jkay » Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:00 pm

If you think it's bad right now, wait until you take crim pro.

Oban
Posts: 717
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2009 12:09 pm

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby Oban » Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:32 pm

Criminal law is lulzy

Midway through the semester the class will break into 3 camps

Camp 1(bleeding heart libruls): OMG Felony murder rule and 3 strikes is harsh, and lets not get started on the death penalty!
Camp 2(Prosecutor/DA gunners): Poor people just didn't work hard enough, lock em up/execute them!
Camp 3(Everyone else): (To themselves) Yep the system sucks, but i'm going to be a corporate/etc lawyer so...

Then half to two thirds of camp 2 will go observe criminal court or work in a DA/AG office over the summer and realize how depressing it is and decide they "really wanted to go into private practice all along"

Then those in camp 2 that remain will realize it's hard to get hired as a DA/AG/PD because of hiring freezes/budget cuts

User avatar
Naked Dude
Posts: 746
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2011 3:09 pm

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby Naked Dude » Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:41 pm

Oban wrote:Criminal law is lulzy

Midway through the semester the class will break into 3 camps

Camp 1(bleeding heart libruls): OMG Felony murder rule and 3 strikes is harsh, and lets not get started on the death penalty!
Camp 2(Prosecutor/DA gunners): Poor people just didn't work hard enough, lock em up/execute them!
Camp 3(Everyone else): (To themselves) Yep the system sucks, but i'm going to be a corporate/etc lawyer so...

Then half to two thirds of camp 2 will go observe criminal court or work in a DA/AG office over the summer and realize how depressing it is and decide they "really wanted to go into private practice all along"

Then those in camp 2 that remain will realize it's hard to get hired as a DA/AG/PD because of hiring freezes/budget cuts


I'm a hybrid 1/3: only against 3 strikes for nonviolent felonies, otherwise I'm in Camp 3.

ETA: Mostly for practical economic reasons, tiny bit librul
Last edited by Naked Dude on Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
spleenworship
Posts: 4421
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby spleenworship » Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:42 pm

Oban wrote:Criminal law is lulzy

Midway through the semester the class will break into 3 camps



Camp 2(Prosecutor/DA gunners): Poor people just didn't work hard enough, lock em up/execute them!


I think that might be a little overly simplistic.

I am only a 1L, but I am a 1L with two ADA friends. Neither one fell into camp two. Both believe there are social causes for crime that should be solved- by the legislature- (and vote Democrat, BTW) and yet both believe that people who, for instance, drive drunk and kill a family of five should be punished, regardless of their motive. Retributive theory of punishment doesn't get enough play, IMO. I also believe, though I don't know, that they use their discretion as prosecutors more wisely because they are aware of the socioeconomic causes of crime.

Oban
Posts: 717
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2009 12:09 pm

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby Oban » Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:49 pm

spleenworship wrote:
Oban wrote:Criminal law is lulzy

Midway through the semester the class will break into 3 camps



Camp 2(Prosecutor/DA gunners): Poor people just didn't work hard enough, lock em up/execute them!


I think that might be a little overly simplistic.

I am only a 1L, but I am a 1L with two ADA friends. Neither one fell into camp two. Both believe there are social causes for crime that should be solved- by the legislature- (and vote Democrat, BTW) and yet both believe that people who, for instance, drive drunk and kill a family of five should be punished, regardless of their motive. Retributive theory of punishment doesn't get enough play, IMO. I also believe, though I don't know, that they use their discretion as prosecutors more wisely because they are aware of the socioeconomic causes of crime.



Its sad/funny when you learn that a drunk driver who kills someone or a family can "get off" with a manslaughter charge and a few years in prison while someone who pulls a knife on someone to get their wallet ends up with felony murder and LWOP because the victim died of a heart attack.

Yes, what I've said is peppered with some hyperbole. Haters gonna hate.

User avatar
spleenworship
Posts: 4421
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby spleenworship » Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:54 pm

Oban wrote:Yes, what I've said is peppered with some hyperbole. Haters gonna hate.


My bad, I was just standing up for my liberal ADA peeps, whom I <3, and hope to someday join.

User avatar
Adjudicator
Posts: 1108
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 4:18 am

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby Adjudicator » Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:01 pm

Oban wrote:Criminal law is lulzy

Midway through the semester the class will break into 3 camps

Camp 1(bleeding heart libruls): OMG Felony murder rule and 3 strikes is harsh, and lets not get started on the death penalty!
Camp 2(Prosecutor/DA gunners): Poor people just didn't work hard enough, lock em up/execute them!
Camp 3(Everyone else): (To themselves) Yep the system sucks, but i'm going to be a corporate/etc lawyer so...

Then half to two thirds of camp 2 will go observe criminal court or work in a DA/AG office over the summer and realize how depressing it is and decide they "really wanted to go into private practice all along"

Then those in camp 2 that remain will realize it's hard to get hired as a DA/AG/PD because of hiring freezes/budget cuts


:) Nice description. I guess I'm in Camp 3 already.

User avatar
kalvano
Posts: 11725
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 2:24 am

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby kalvano » Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:33 pm

I interned for a criminal judge this summer. Most defendants aren't awful people, just incredibly stupid.

Still doesn't mean they shouldn't go to jail, but the hardline "let God sort them out" philosophy is tough to take against a lot of them. Even a lot of prosecutors don't necessarily believe that every single defendant deserves the max and is an awful human being. But there are people who are just born broken, and they should be locked away for life.

Hell, it's mostly drug offenses anyway, which shouldn't exist.

User avatar
Adjudicator
Posts: 1108
Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 4:18 am

Re: It's only the second week of Crim Law, but...

Postby Adjudicator » Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:37 pm

kalvano wrote:I interned for a criminal judge this summer. Most defendants aren't awful people, just incredibly stupid.

Still doesn't mean they shouldn't go to jail, but the hardline "let God sort them out" philosophy is tough to take against a lot of them. Even a lot of prosecutors don't necessarily believe that every single defendant deserves the max and is an awful human being. But there are people who are just born broken, and they should be locked away for life.

Hell, it's mostly drug offenses anyway, which shouldn't exist.


+1

People who see the law in black and white terms have some rude awakenings coming...

I'm dreading the sound of that many minds simultaneously seizing up with cognitive dissonance.




Return to “Forum for Law School Students”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: unsweetened and 15 guests