How many people actually do 0L Prep?

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lisjjen
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How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby lisjjen » Mon Jul 25, 2011 2:50 pm

And does it help?

kaiser
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby kaiser » Mon Jul 25, 2011 2:51 pm

Do a search. There are a million threads on this. The overwhelming consensus is that 0L prep is a waste of time.

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BruceWayne
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby BruceWayne » Mon Jul 25, 2011 2:54 pm

Far more people than this website would have you believe. And looking back on it, the whole thing about it being "hurtful" etc. is BS. Frankly, as much as people on here like to make law school classes out to be this ivory tower intellectual exercise that can't be prepared for...it's basically memorization of an enormous amount of rules, followed by applying those rules in a really short time frame at a really rapid rate (the exam--assuming we're talking about an issue spotter, which most exams are). If you can get those rules memorized early and get a grasp on them early, then you might as well do it.

071816
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby 071816 » Mon Jul 25, 2011 2:55 pm

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JamMasterJ
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby JamMasterJ » Mon Jul 25, 2011 2:56 pm

Like working hard at Stanford, if you do it, don't tell anyone :wink:

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Kilpatrick
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby Kilpatrick » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:17 pm

The problem with OL prep on specific subjects is that every law school professor will teach the subject differently. (IMO prep on how to take an exam is OK). Before actually taking the class you will have no idea what the prof will cover, what you should focus on for the exam and what you should ignore. It might not hurt you to read an entire CivPro supplement but it would definitely be a huge waste of time. My CivPro professor for example covered only about half of what was in the E&E. And of the half that was covered, there were things that were covered only briefly and clearly weren't going to be the focus of the exam. Some Contracts classes at my school spent a lot of time with the UCC, but my class hardly mentioned it at all and there was only like one thing from it that was on the exam. So how would you know as a 0l what to read? Read the entire UCC and memorize it just to be safe? Sounds miserable and totally counterproductive to me.

kaiser
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby kaiser » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:21 pm

Kilpatrick wrote:The problem with OL prep on specific subjects is that every law school professor will teach the subject differently. (IMO prep on how to take an exam is OK). Before actually taking the class you will have no idea what the prof will cover, what you should focus on for the exam and what you should ignore. It might not hurt you to read an entire CivPro supplement but it would definitely be a huge waste of time. My CivPro professor for example covered only about half of what was in the E&E. And of the half that was covered, there were things that were covered only briefly and clearly weren't going to be the focus of the exam. Some Contracts classes at my school spent a lot of time with the UCC, but my class hardly mentioned it at all and there was only like one thing from it that was on the exam. So how would you know as a 0l what to read? Read the entire UCC and memorize it just to be safe? Sounds miserable and totally counterproductive to me.


Good point. My contracts professor hardly ever mentioned the UCC, while another section had to buy a copy and they referred to it almost every single day. My professor also shunned any black letter rules and always managed to think of an exception, while the other section's professor loved black letter outlines.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby JamMasterJ » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:24 pm

kaiser wrote:
Kilpatrick wrote:The problem with OL prep on specific subjects is that every law school professor will teach the subject differently. (IMO prep on how to take an exam is OK). Before actually taking the class you will have no idea what the prof will cover, what you should focus on for the exam and what you should ignore. It might not hurt you to read an entire CivPro supplement but it would definitely be a huge waste of time. My CivPro professor for example covered only about half of what was in the E&E. And of the half that was covered, there were things that were covered only briefly and clearly weren't going to be the focus of the exam. Some Contracts classes at my school spent a lot of time with the UCC, but my class hardly mentioned it at all and there was only like one thing from it that was on the exam. So how would you know as a 0l what to read? Read the entire UCC and memorize it just to be safe? Sounds miserable and totally counterproductive to me.


Good point. My contracts professor hardly ever mentioned the UCC, while another section had to buy a copy and they referred to it almost every single day. My professor also shunned any black letter rules and always managed to think of an exception, while the other section's professor loved black letter outlines.

This is why reading GTM is seen as the most substantive 0L prep one should do?

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lisjjen
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby lisjjen » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:26 pm

I guess I'm not asking how to prep so much as I'm just wondering how many of my classmates will have prepped.

kaiser
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby kaiser » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:28 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:
kaiser wrote:
Kilpatrick wrote:The problem with OL prep on specific subjects is that every law school professor will teach the subject differently. (IMO prep on how to take an exam is OK). Before actually taking the class you will have no idea what the prof will cover, what you should focus on for the exam and what you should ignore. It might not hurt you to read an entire CivPro supplement but it would definitely be a huge waste of time. My CivPro professor for example covered only about half of what was in the E&E. And of the half that was covered, there were things that were covered only briefly and clearly weren't going to be the focus of the exam. Some Contracts classes at my school spent a lot of time with the UCC, but my class hardly mentioned it at all and there was only like one thing from it that was on the exam. So how would you know as a 0l what to read? Read the entire UCC and memorize it just to be safe? Sounds miserable and totally counterproductive to me.


Good point. My contracts professor hardly ever mentioned the UCC, while another section had to buy a copy and they referred to it almost every single day. My professor also shunned any black letter rules and always managed to think of an exception, while the other section's professor loved black letter outlines.

This is why reading GTM is seen as the most substantive 0L prep one should do?


Yes, since exam preparation and exam understanding is something that applies across the board. Sure, you will have some professors who have relatively unique exam structures, but the vast majority follow a certain approach that can be learned. I'm not saying that 0L prep can't possibly be helpful. If you get lucky, it can. But certain professors cover certain things in particular and unique ways. Knowing Glannon's approach to a concept won't help you if your professor has a differing opinion. An important thing to remember throughout the semester is that you aren't learning torts/contracts/etc. in general. Rather, you are learning Professor so and so's approach to torts/contracts, etc.

kaiser
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby kaiser » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:29 pm

lisjjen wrote:I guess I'm not asking how to prep so much as I'm just wondering how many of my classmates will have prepped.


Thats impossible to know, nor is it particularly important. I know tons of people who did 0L prep and didn't do all that well. Don't ever think that, by virtue of them reading some E&E books over the summer, that they have an advantage over you. As with much of law school, people will try and mentally psyche you out with statements such as "Oh, I spent all summer reading supplements, so I already know the elements of negligence". Trust me, by the time you reach exams, everyone is on equal footing, and the big talker has no advantage.

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dailygrind
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby dailygrind » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:32 pm

kaiser wrote:Yes, since exam preparation and exam understanding is something that applies across the board. Sure, you will have some professors who have relatively unique exam structures, but the vast majority follow a certain approach that can be learned. I'm not saying that 0L prep can't possibly be helpful. If you get lucky, it can. But certain professors cover certain things in particular and unique ways. Knowing Glannon's approach to a concept won't help you if your professor has a differing opinion. An important thing to remember throughout the semester is that you aren't learning torts/contracts/etc. in general. Rather, you are learning Professor so and so's approach to torts/contracts, etc.


Hugely credited. 0L prep beyond GTM might be helpful, but it's a low expected value investment.

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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby 071816 » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:34 pm

kaiser wrote:Thats impossible to know, nor is it particularly important. I know tons of people who did 0L prep and didn't do all that well. Don't ever think that, by virtue of them reading some E&E books over the summer, that they have an advantage over you. As with much of law school, people will try and mentally psyche you out with statements such as "Oh, I spent all summer reading supplements, so I already know the elements of negligence". Trust me, by the time you reach exams, everyone is on equal footing, and the big talker has no advantage.


Exactly this.

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ndirish2010
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby ndirish2010 » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:34 pm

I hadn't heard of Getting to Maybe until midway through second semester of 1L and have still never seen an actual copy of it. Didn't seem to hurt me. Enjoy your last summer before law school, stop with the 0L prep please.

clone22
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby clone22 » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:48 pm

Yea, for those of us who are too lazy to read GTM, can someone summarize it please? kthx

071816
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby 071816 » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:52 pm

clone22 wrote:Yea, for those of us who are too lazy to read GTM, can someone summarize it please? kthx


If this is your mentality, you probably should not attend law school. GTM is actually a pretty easy and interesting read IMO.

taxguy
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby taxguy » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:54 pm

Most will tell you that doing any prep during the summer before law school is a waste of time. However, Not only do I not agree with that,but some of the top people in law schools wouldn't agree either. See Arrow's excellent posting found in TLS's "Forum for Law Students."

I would strongly recommend that you get the Examples and Explanations books for each suject that you will have in the first semester. Read them over during the summer. You don't need to study them, outline them, or underline them. Just read them. This is particularly true for contracts and for Civil Procedure and Con Law.

Secondly, get the excellent LEEWS course and listen to it twice.

Third, if time permits, read the book, " Getting to Maybe."

That's it. You will find that all this will put you far ahead of most other students.
Last edited by taxguy on Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:58 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby JamMasterJ » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:56 pm

taxguy wrote:Most will tell you that doing any prep during the summer before law school is a waste of time. However, Not only do I not agree with that,but some of the top people in law schools wouldn't agree either. See Arrow's excellent posting found in TLS's Law Student Forem.

I would strongly recommend that you get the Examples and Explanations books for each suject that you will have in the first semester. Read them over during the summer. You don't need to study them, outline them, underline them. Just read them.

Secondly, get the excellent LEEWS course and listen to it twice.

Third, if time permits, read the book, " Getting to Maybe."

That's it. You will find that all this will put you far ahead of most other students.

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paulinaporizkova
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby paulinaporizkova » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:56 pm

clone22 wrote:Yea, for those of us who are too lazy to read GTM, can someone summarize it please? kthx


i hope you're going to my school

clone22
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby clone22 » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:57 pm

paulinaporizkova wrote:
clone22 wrote:Yea, for those of us who are too lazy to read GTM, can someone summarize it please? kthx


i hope you're going to my school

Are you going to siberia soon? If so, yes.

071816
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby 071816 » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:59 pm

taxguy wrote:Taxguy's advice


This is the first thing that came to mind when I read this:

WSJ_Law wrote:Taxguy is a fuckin moron

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FeelTheHeat
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby FeelTheHeat » Mon Jul 25, 2011 3:59 pm

paulinaporizkova wrote:
clone22 wrote:Yea, for those of us who are too lazy to read GTM, can someone summarize it please? kthx


i hope you're going to my school in my section

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Kilpatrick
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby Kilpatrick » Mon Jul 25, 2011 4:03 pm

chimp wrote:
taxguy wrote:Taxguy's advice


This is the first thing that came to mind when I read this:

WSJ_Law wrote:Taxguy is a fuckin moron


The first thing I thought of was him forcing his son to read all the E&Es

clone22
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby clone22 » Mon Jul 25, 2011 4:03 pm

FeelTheHeat wrote:
paulinaporizkova wrote:
clone22 wrote:Yea, for those of us who are too lazy to read GTM, can someone summarize it please? kthx


i hope you're going to my school in my section

sorry broski, not legit enough to go to UF :(

paulinaporizkova
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Re: How many people actually do 0L Prep?

Postby paulinaporizkova » Mon Jul 25, 2011 4:04 pm

clone22 wrote:
paulinaporizkova wrote:
clone22 wrote:Yea, for those of us who are too lazy to read GTM, can someone summarize it please? kthx


i hope you're going to my school

Are you going to siberia soon? If so, yes.


is this a metaphor?




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