Do people usually pay attention in class?

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cornellbeez
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby cornellbeez » Sun Mar 13, 2011 7:43 pm

gothamm wrote:wtf is gchat?!??!

I mean, I know what it is...but did not know it was that popular.


That's all 2Ls and 3Ls do during class...By then you realize that lectures are primarily worthless.

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gothamm
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby gothamm » Sun Mar 13, 2011 7:54 pm

cornellbeez wrote:
gothamm wrote:wtf is gchat?!??!

I mean, I know what it is...but did not know it was that popular.


That's all 2Ls and 3Ls do during class...By then you realize that lectures are primarily worthless.



really?

I thought the lectures were important, and the books were mostly useless. TLS is full of advice on 0L law prep kinda stuff and the consensus is that its mostly useless because you don't know what professors expect

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BarbellDreams
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby BarbellDreams » Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:38 pm

Idk, I think you evaluate the professor. I doubt I ever pay attention in Crim Pro but am rarely not paying attention in Con Law. Once you learn to weed out what will and wont be on the test during the lecture you can get better at deciding when you actually need to pay attention.

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danquayle
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby danquayle » Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:45 pm

Sean1269 wrote:It seems like a lot of 0Ls have answered this, and I remember as a 0L wondering the same thing...so here is my answer as a 1L.

There are of course gunners in law school, they take copious notes, answer every question, and like to hijack the class with their own hypotheticals. They will have 50 pg. outlines etc. They usually sit front and center. Professors often make fun of gunners, but most gunners don't think they're actually gunners. Other students don't like them, often making betting pools to see who will answer the most questions, or ask the most questions for the day. In my experience, they don't do substantially better than anyone else, maybe even worse.

They are the normal students. You see them playing on facebook, reading the news, etc, and then switching back to their notes when something important is said or repeated. They often have their book open which reveals highlighting, and thus the fact that they read before class. They do just fine switching between messing around and paying attention. This group is the vast majority.

The last group is the opposite of the gunners. There is a rebuttable presumption gunners will do poorly. With the quiet kids in the back, who often do not pay attention, there is a rebuttable presumption they do well. They're sleepers. Trying to fool you into thinking they are dumb. In reality, they study hours on end at home and are prepared for class. They usually have the belief that they only need to come to class to fulfill the ABA attendance requirement.


There you have it. The three groups. The middle is the largest. Don't be a gunner.

I forgot to mention, sometimes the people in the last two groups intentionally try and mimic gunners by asking ridiculous hypos, or contesting the facts of a case.


This. I saw absolutely no correlation between class participation/paying attention and exam success. Some people actually did better once they stopped paying attention. I had one friend who missed the entire semester because he found the professor long winded and confusing. He got the A star.

For my part, I used to watch a lot of MLB TV. I just made sure I read the case so I could answer if/when cold called upon. I've said this time and time again, just figure out what a professor wants. Most professors only care how you do on the exam, so your time is best spend studying old exams or previously perfected outlines. In the rare classes where professors credited participation, I was hyper involved and usually got an A for my effort. But if it isn't really required, then I was zoned out and/or absent for a good portion of my classes.

Oh, and build a good network of other law students. Study groups are great for filling in knowledge gaps.
Last edited by danquayle on Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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fltanglab
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby fltanglab » Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:47 pm

When I was sitting in at Chicago in a 1L torts class, every single person was taking notes, minus the part when the professor was giving scenarios/asking for discussion. There may have been one person who was playing a game. At Northwestern, in a business associations course, I observed nearly everyone not paying attention and the discussion was non-existent. I decided I wouldn't apply to Northwestern after that...

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yngblkgifted
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby yngblkgifted » Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:53 pm

fltanglab wrote:When I was sitting in at Chicago in a 1L torts class, every single person was taking notes, minus the part when the professor was giving scenarios/asking for discussion. There may have been one person who was playing a game. At Northwestern, in a business associations course, I observed nearly everyone not paying attention and the discussion was non-existent. I decided I wouldn't apply to Northwestern after that...


I would apply to Northwestern after that

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Helmholtz
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby Helmholtz » Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:54 pm

fltanglab wrote:When I was sitting in at Chicago in a 1L torts class, every single person was taking notes, minus the part when the professor was giving scenarios/asking for discussion. There may have been one person who was playing a game.


Internet's blocked at Chicago, right?

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FalafelWaffle
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby FalafelWaffle » Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:00 pm

There's some sort of race-to-the-bottom of inanity shit going on here lately.

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XxSpyKEx
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby XxSpyKEx » Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:01 pm

nealric wrote:
Also, you're paying a fuckton to go to these classes.


You paid for classes? I paid my money for some OCI bidding slots and a piece of paper that said I could take the bar.
I'm only half joking.


TCR. I used to think I paid to take the 3 exams each semester. So roughly $7,500 per law school exam * 6 exams per year. Oh those law school profs work so hard to earn their $200k yearly salaries.

FiveSermon
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby FiveSermon » Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:16 pm

Why don't you play it safe and study. After all it is your entire future at stake.

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Julio_El_Chavo
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby Julio_El_Chavo » Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:17 pm

everyone in my Fed Courts class pays attn.

FiveSermon
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby FiveSermon » Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:22 pm

ITT: A bunch of gunners try to convince other students that paying attention in class is useless.

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Helmholtz
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby Helmholtz » Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:23 pm

FiveSermon wrote:Why don't you play it safe and study. After all it is your entire future at stake.


Studying /=/ paying attention in class. The best time to play it safe would be first semester. After finals, you see how much of class was completely irrelevant. It just requires much less mental energy when you know what to pay attention to and what things you don't really need to pay attention to. And mental energy really starts to feel like a limited resource after a while. You'll also probably have a good idea of what classes you need to pay more attention in and which ones you don't need to. There are some classes where you can be absent more than show up and still get an A if you know the out-of-class material. There are some classes where you absolutely need to be there as much as you can.

fwiw, I would have said the exact same thing that you did when I was a 0L

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danquayle
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby danquayle » Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:23 pm

FiveSermon wrote:Why don't you play it safe and study. After all it is your entire future at stake.


You're conflating "paying attention" with "studying."

dihydrogenmonoxide
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby dihydrogenmonoxide » Sun Mar 13, 2011 10:41 pm

I bet a lot of people exaggerate how little they pay attention to seem cool and nonchalant about things, or to cope with their discomfort at no longer being one of the best students in class like they were in UG.

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kalvano
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby kalvano » Sun Mar 13, 2011 10:54 pm

dihydrogenmonoxide wrote:I bet a lot of people exaggerate how little they pay attention to seem cool and nonchalant about things, or to cope with their discomfort at no longer being one of the best students in class like they were in UG.



No.

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yngblkgifted
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby yngblkgifted » Sun Mar 13, 2011 11:02 pm

kalvano wrote:
dihydrogenmonoxide wrote:I bet a lot of people exaggerate how little they pay attention to seem cool and nonchalant about things, or to cope with their discomfort at no longer being one of the best students in class like they were in UG.



No More than likely.

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danquayle
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby danquayle » Sun Mar 13, 2011 11:05 pm

yngblkgifted wrote:
kalvano wrote:
dihydrogenmonoxide wrote:I bet a lot of people exaggerate how little they pay attention to seem cool and nonchalant about things, or to cope with their discomfort at no longer being one of the best students in class like they were in UG.



No More than likely.


I'm long since graduated, and removed from the process - I can tell you this is not the case. The people that over did it sometimes in fact did worse because they studied the wrong things. What the professor says is irrelevant. Only what is on the exam matters. To the extent those two align, then you should pay attention. A lot of times, you can learn the same stuff through much more direct means (outlines, old exams, etc). A lot of people don't seem to understand that, and a lot of people wasted their time and were confused as to why they didn't do better on their exams. Maybe a lot of you will end of being those people. But you're all super smart and dedicated 0Ls, so by all means... don't take my advice.

I studied my fair share, but I'd be lying if I said I paid attention during most class periods. For most classes, it simply wasn't that important to doing well on the exam.
Last edited by danquayle on Sun Mar 13, 2011 11:10 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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kalvano
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby kalvano » Sun Mar 13, 2011 11:05 pm

yngblkgifted wrote:
kalvano wrote:
dihydrogenmonoxide wrote:I bet a lot of people exaggerate how little they pay attention to seem cool and nonchalant about things, or to cope with their discomfort at no longer being one of the best students in class like they were in UG.



No More than likely.



Still no.


Edit - yeah, what the other guy said. I know about where a lot of people in my class ranked, and I ranked better than some who listened to every word the professor said, and worse than some who did nothing but fuck off.

Sandro
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby Sandro » Mon Mar 14, 2011 12:05 am

On a recent visit to a a t30 one rather large gentleman was playing some tower defense game the entire class inbetween chugging off brand soda.

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blerg
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby blerg » Mon Mar 14, 2011 12:08 am

I do, except in Ks, but my profs are all engaging and I'm not the best book-learner.

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goosey
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby goosey » Mon Mar 14, 2011 12:14 am

i paid much more attention in class last semester when laptops were not banned by all our professors. This semester, I feel like no matter what I do my notes will suck so I wind up messing with my phone a lot more. irony huh...

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FalafelWaffle
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby FalafelWaffle » Mon Mar 14, 2011 12:30 am

danquayle wrote:I'm long since graduated, and removed from the process


Then why argue about it on the internet?

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beachbum
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby beachbum » Mon Mar 14, 2011 12:37 am

FalafelWaffle wrote:
danquayle wrote:I'm long since graduated, and removed from the process


Then why argue about it on the internet?


Because he has something relevant to add to the discussion?

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FalafelWaffle
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Re: Do people usually pay attention in class?

Postby FalafelWaffle » Mon Mar 14, 2011 12:38 am

beachbum wrote:
FalafelWaffle wrote:
danquayle wrote:I'm long since graduated, and removed from the process


Then why argue about it on the internet?


Because he has something relative to add to the discussion?


I was referring more to his general presence in the forum for law students.




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