Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

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sethc
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Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby sethc » Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:41 pm

Apologies if the title comes off as being frivolous, idealistic, hyperbolic, or exaggeration. I fully intend this to be a serious question for any of you that could offer thoughts and opinions.

FWIW: 1L-2nd termer @ a lower-tiered school & no grades posted yet

Prior to and going through 1L-first term all of the teachers/faculty always alludes to the fact that law school "changes the way you think" by making people "think like a lawyer" or something along those lines.
For those that prefer a short, concise question: Do you agree? Why/why not/elaborate?

To go a bit further: Within the past week I've reflected on what I've learned from my 1st-term both in terms of specific, law-related stuff as well as in a broad/general sense. One day it just sort of clicked that I totally think differently and, by virtue of that, I now speak/write or type/read in a very new and very different way or, at the least least, with greater attention to detail. This post might be, in and of itself, evidence of the change for me, but does anyone else feel that way? One very big example is that I am now MUCH more articulate AND conscious about being articulate. I've always been rather good at using the right words to say what I need/want to say.. and always felt pretty educated I guess.. but after my first term I feel like I scrutinize my words much, much more. It's almost like I feel the need to explain EVERYTHING in great detail whether it's to myself or to someone else. So, I think about EVERYTHING longer and to a much greater degree than in the past. Admittedly, there are a number of other personal variables I won't go into that could cause or contribute to this kind of change.. but I feel like it's law school, at least in large part. Should this be a concern or do any of you feel the same way? If so, what are your thoughts?

Note I'm not saying that it's particularly bothersome or causes me any problems currently, I just felt the need to get it off my chest and see if anyone else has had the same experience.

Thanks all! Let me know if I need to clarify or elaborate on anything - I didn't have a whole lot of time when posting this.

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Adjudicator
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby Adjudicator » Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:43 pm

Is it weird now, going back and talking to your family and your old friends with their non-lawyerly minds? Will you ever be able to relate to anyone from your "old life" again?

theantiscalia
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby theantiscalia » Tue Jan 11, 2011 4:44 pm

sethc wrote:Apologies if the title comes off as being frivolous, idealistic, hyperbolic, or exaggeration. I fully intend this to be a serious question for any of you that could offer thoughts and opinions.

FWIW: 1L-2nd termer @ a lower-tiered school & no grades posted yet

Prior to and going through 1L-first term all of the teachers/faculty always alludes to the fact that law school "changes the way you think" by making people "think like a lawyer" or something along those lines.
For those that prefer a short, concise question: Do you agree? Why/why not/elaborate?

To go a bit further: Within the past week I've reflected on what I've learned from my 1st-term both in terms of specific, law-related stuff as well as in a broad/general sense. One day it just sort of clicked that I totally think differently and, by virtue of that, I now speak/write or type/read in a very new and very different way or, at the least least, with greater attention to detail. This post might be, in and of itself, evidence of the change for me, but does anyone else feel that way? One very big example is that I am now MUCH more articulate AND conscious about being articulate. I've always been rather good at using the right words to say what I need/want to say.. and always felt pretty educated I guess.. but after my first term I feel like I scrutinize my words much, much more. It's almost like I feel the need to explain EVERYTHING in great detail whether it's to myself or to someone else. So, I think about EVERYTHING longer and to a much greater degree than in the past. Admittedly, there are a number of other personal variables I won't go into that could cause or contribute to this kind of change.. but I feel like it's law school, at least in large part. Should this be a concern or do any of you feel the same way? If so, what are your thoughts?

Note I'm not saying that it's particularly bothersome or causes me any problems currently, I just felt the need to get it off my chest and see if anyone else has had the same experience.

Thanks all! Let me know if I need to clarify or elaborate on anything - I didn't have a whole lot of time when posting this.


Part of that is growing up. I didn't get that from law school... I got it working for a few years. But I do think you're onto something.

If nothing else, I tend to put conclusions at the start of paragraphs now, whereas I used to let the suspense build. Stupid legal writing class.

sethc
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby sethc » Tue Jan 11, 2011 6:17 pm

Adjudicator wrote:Is it weird now, going back and talking to your family and your old friends with their non-lawyerly minds? Will you ever be able to relate to anyone from your "old life" again?


I like that you put it that way, but that's spot-on. It's not that I can't "relate" to them now as much as it is that I relate to them in a much, much different way or "approach" it differently, perhaps. I really hope that makes sense, but that's kind of how I feel.

theantiscalia wrote: Part of that is growing up. I didn't get that from law school... I got it working for a few years. But I do think you're onto something. If nothing else, I tend to put conclusions at the start of paragraphs now, whereas I used to let the suspense build. Stupid legal writing class.


Agreed - part of I think is definitely growing up.. it's just hard to isolate "how much" when you're in law school at the same time, you know? The fact alone that it just now clicked, right after 1st-term finals makes me feel like law school is the primary culprit. I haven't taken LRW yet, but I already have a tendency to do the same thing with conclusions. Thanks for the input so far, man.

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bk1
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby bk1 » Tue Jan 11, 2011 6:20 pm

sethc wrote:
Adjudicator wrote:Is it weird now, going back and talking to your family and your old friends with their non-lawyerly minds? Will you ever be able to relate to anyone from your "old life" again?


I like that you put it that way, but that's spot-on. It's not that I can't "relate" to them now as much as it is that I relate to them in a much, much different way or "approach" it differently, perhaps. I really hope that makes sense, but that's kind of how I feel.


:lol:

sethc
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby sethc » Tue Jan 11, 2011 6:43 pm

bk1 wrote: :lol:


I hope that response is indicative of me reading my response to you and saying "god, I'm doing it again" haha

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prezidentv8
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby prezidentv8 » Tue Jan 11, 2011 6:59 pm

I think I get bored a lot easier now.

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BunkMoreland
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby BunkMoreland » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:18 pm

No, other than perhaps being more lazy 2L year and having a greater vocabulary/ability to speak coherently. That might just come with age though. The only noticeable difference is I use pretentious legal-ish words way too often in everyday speak ("notwithstanding/"irrespective"/etc)

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A'nold
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby A'nold » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:20 pm

Actually, I agree w/ the "not being able to relate" thing. One of my professor likened it to the Matrix and we've taken the purple pill. As an example, it's almost like anything anybody says is stock full of errors in reasoning and you have to hold your tongue constantly.

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MrKappus
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby MrKappus » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:22 pm

I no longer know who I am and I feel like the ghost of a total stranger.

lawschooliseasy
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby lawschooliseasy » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:29 pm

prezidentv8 wrote:I think I get bored a lot easier now.


You get bored easier? After reading about 1,000 pages of property I think I'm immune to boredom.

sethc
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby sethc » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:36 pm

A'nold wrote:Actually, I agree w/ the "not being able to relate" thing. One of my professor likened it to the Matrix and we've taken the purple pill. As an example, it's almost like anything anybody says is stock full of errors in reasoning and you have to hold your tongue constantly.

BunkMoreland wrote:The only noticeable difference is I use pretentious legal-ish words way too often in everyday speak ("notwithstanding/"irrespective"/etc)


Wow both of these are are spot-on and also things I CONSTANTLY do -- especially with respect to holding my tongue when I spot reasoning errors & using legalese when I shouldn't. If I'm speaking, it's not nearly as bad as when I'm writing because I can go back and correct whatever I type before submitting/presenting it for public consumption. Yeah, with writing/typing it's WAY worse. I also have had an INCREDIBLY bad habit lately (i.e. past 3mo) of using parentheses, quotes, and / -- clearly seen by reading this post alone. Well, now that I've morphed into this new person my only question is if it gets worse or if I just grow tolerant/immune to it lol

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dood
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby dood » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:37 pm

im more of an elitist.

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RUQRU
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby RUQRU » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:38 pm

I'm just wondering why I feel so all alone
Why I'm a stranger in my own life


Sheryl Crow - Everyday Is A Winding Road

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Veyron
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby Veyron » Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:49 pm

I always thought like a lawyer. Even before I went to law school I ran with a bad crowd (lawyers, judges, law students - basically any two-timing player with an "in" to the system). I was a pretty messed up kid really and now, I guess, its come to this. As we speak, I'm staring at my casebook, a bottle of diet coke on the desk. I woke up with a pounding headache feeling like shit this morning -eyestrain- and promised myself that last night was the last time I'd go on an a 24 hour bender. I used to try to be a good person you know, that whole deal. Now I'm not even sure whether right and wrong exist, much less what they are. My mama would've balled her eyes out if she had seen the way that I impleaded a couple of little girls just to score some cheap points on a Torts exam. I don't even give a fuck at this point - the client is the only thing that matters. Law is one hell of a drug.

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prezidentv8
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby prezidentv8 » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:19 pm

lawschooliseasy wrote:
prezidentv8 wrote:I think I get bored a lot easier now.


You get bored easier? After reading about 1,000 pages of property I think I'm immune to boredom.


Meh, it's more like boredom is my default state these days.

sethc
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby sethc » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:25 pm

Veyron wrote:I always thought like a lawyer. Even before I went to law school I ran with a bad crowd (lawyers, judges, law students - basically any two-timing player with an "in" to the system). I was a pretty messed up kid really and now, I guess, its come to this. As we speak, I'm staring at my casebook, a bottle of diet coke on the desk. I woke up with a pounding headache feeling like shit this morning -eyestrain- and promised myself that last night was the last time I'd go on an a 24 hour bender. I used to try to be a good person you know, that whole deal. Now I'm not even sure whether right and wrong exist, much less what they are. My mama would've balled her eyes out if she had seen the way that I impleaded a couple of little girls just to score some cheap points on a Torts exam. I don't even give a fuck at this point - the client is the only thing that matters. Law is one hell of a drug.



Are you being serious or did a pop-culture reference just whoosh over my head? I feel like it's the latter, but I feel compelled to ask.

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snowpeach06
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby snowpeach06 » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:31 pm

I don't think anything has really changed for me except that I'll see something on tv and go "that girl would totally get off, it was defense of others," or "that contract wouldn't be valid... there was no consideration!"

sethc
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby sethc » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:54 pm

snowpeach06 wrote:I don't think anything has really changed for me except that I'll see something on tv and go "that girl would totally get off, it was defense of others," or "that contract wouldn't be valid... there was no consideration!"



Yeah, I catch myself doing that too but I'm pretty good about not doing it out loud if I'm not at least around other law students at the time haha

missinglink
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby missinglink » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:03 pm

dood wrote:im more of an elitist.

+1

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solotee
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby solotee » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:08 pm

I feel more respected, but I don't feel like I changed.

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Veyron
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby Veyron » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:12 pm

solotee wrote:I feel more respected, but I don't feel like I changed.


More respected? Everyone I know knows the legal market is in the gutter right now. I get looks of pity.

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Veyron
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby Veyron » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:13 pm

sethc wrote:
Veyron wrote:I always thought like a lawyer. Even before I went to law school I ran with a bad crowd (lawyers, judges, law students - basically any two-timing player with an "in" to the system). I was a pretty messed up kid really and now, I guess, its come to this. As we speak, I'm staring at my casebook, a bottle of diet coke on the desk. I woke up with a pounding headache feeling like shit this morning -eyestrain- and promised myself that last night was the last time I'd go on an a 24 hour bender. I used to try to be a good person you know, that whole deal. Now I'm not even sure whether right and wrong exist, much less what they are. My mama would've balled her eyes out if she had seen the way that I impleaded a couple of little girls just to score some cheap points on a Torts exam. I don't even give a fuck at this point - the client is the only thing that matters. Law is one hell of a drug.



Are you being serious or did a pop-culture reference just whoosh over my head? I feel like it's the latter, but I feel compelled to ask.


Pop-culture? No. I'm being half serious - truth makes the best fiction.

sethc
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby sethc » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:26 pm

Veyron wrote:
sethc wrote:
Veyron wrote:I always thought like a lawyer. Even before I went to law school I ran with a bad crowd (lawyers, judges, law students - basically any two-timing player with an "in" to the system). I was a pretty messed up kid really and now, I guess, its come to this. As we speak, I'm staring at my casebook, a bottle of diet coke on the desk. I woke up with a pounding headache feeling like shit this morning -eyestrain- and promised myself that last night was the last time I'd go on an a 24 hour bender. I used to try to be a good person you know, that whole deal. Now I'm not even sure whether right and wrong exist, much less what they are. My mama would've balled her eyes out if she had seen the way that I impleaded a couple of little girls just to score some cheap points on a Torts exam. I don't even give a fuck at this point - the client is the only thing that matters. Law is one hell of a drug.



Are you being serious or did a pop-culture reference just whoosh over my head? I feel like it's the latter, but I feel compelled to ask.


Pop-culture? No. I'm being half serious - truth makes the best fiction.



Well, at any rate - if any or all of that is true then talking about it/venting can be a big, big, BIG help. I don't mean to come off sounding like a shrink or a doctor, but that seriously helps. I'm speaking from experience and I'm also one that HATED the thought of doing this and was very skeptical of any kind of "therapy" in general. It honestly sounds like you and I have a lot in common, whether or not that's immediately apparent. Feel free to message me if you feel comfortable & want to.. talking about some of that stuff probably wouldn't be a bad thing for either of us.

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MrKappus
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Re: Did/does anyone else feel like they "changed" after 1L?

Postby MrKappus » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:30 pm

Veyron wrote:My mama would've balled her eyes out


This particular turn of phrase + spelling creates some seriously disturbing imagery.




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