If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

(Study Tips, Dealing With Stress, Maintaining a Social Life, Financial Aid, Internships, Bar Exam, Careers in Law . . . )

Would you still go to law school?

Yes
73
65%
No
17
15%
Maybe
22
20%
 
Total votes: 112

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dood
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby dood » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:27 pm

...
Last edited by dood on Sat Dec 25, 2010 6:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:29 pm

I do have to say that if I could really go back to end-of-high-school, I may have been happier just waiting tables/tending bar than I am having gone through college, etc. I loved waiting tables and tending bar, the pay was fine (without student loans of any kind weighing you down,) it keeps you in shape, etc.

But, so it goes. That boat sailed a long time ago - though my retirement plan is to buy and run a neighborhood pub.

Melkaba
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby Melkaba » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:36 pm

Maybe. I don't hate law school (although, that will probably change the moment I get my grades back), but I would definitely tell my younger self a few important factors.

1. Actually take the damn LSAT seriously and don't just half-ass prepare for it.
2. You know that Navy/Air Force Clinical Psychology PhD program you were always interested in? Seriously, seriously, seriously weigh that against law school and don't merely chalk it up as an automatic "eh, I already got rejected from the military once for BS reasons so this is just a waste of time."
3. Probably stay in Mock Trial a lot longer than I did.

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JCougar
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby JCougar » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:41 pm

If I could go back to the beginning of undergrad, I'd have stuck with physics and gone right on to get my PhD. I switched my major to psychology, which I don't think was the worst decision in the world, because I learned a lot of good stuff about myself and about how other people behave -- which comes in handy no matter what you do. Still, I think Physics would be a field that would be constantly interesting and challenging to me -- even if I'd be making shit money in a post-doc job right now. Instead, I got a MS and went into corporate office work, which was a huge waste of some of the best years of my life.

Provided I stuck with psychology, I wish I would have taken undergrad more seriously. It would have required such a small amount of effort on my part to get a GPA closer to 4.0. But I literally put in next to no effort, almost never went to class unless there was an exam. I always thought "who cares, undergrad GPA doesn't matter...it's not like most jobs even ask for it." But it would have helped me pay much less for law school and/or break into the T14.

And if you would have talked to me 2-3 years ago, I would have told myself to go to law school sooner -- that there's no light at the end of the tunnel in a miserable, phony corporate bureaucracy.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:44 pm

JCougar wrote:If I could go back to the beginning of undergrad, I'd have stuck with physics and gone right on to get my PhD. I switched my major to psychology, which I don't think was the worst decision in the world, because I learned a lot of good stuff about myself and about how other people behave -- which comes in handy no matter what you do. Still, I think Physics would be a field that would be constantly interesting and challenging to me -- even if I'd be making shit money in a post-doc job right now. Instead, I got a MS and went into corporate office work, which was a huge waste of some of the best years of my life.

Provided I stuck with psychology, I wish I would have taken undergrad more seriously. It would have required such a small amount of effort on my part to get a GPA closer to 4.0. But I literally put in next to no effort, almost never went to class unless there was an exam. I always thought "who cares, undergrad GPA doesn't matter...it's not like most jobs even ask for it." But it would have helped me pay much less for law school and/or break into the T14.

And if you would have talked to me 2-3 years ago, I would have told myself to go to law school sooner -- that there's no light at the end of the tunnel in a miserable, phony corporate bureaucracy.


I think you from 3 years from now may be trying to come back to tell you that there's no light at the end of the tunnel in a miserable, phony corporate law firm bureaucracy :wink:

ogurty
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby ogurty » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:49 pm

I love law school too. Wouldn't change it.

But if I could talk to myself, even 1 year or 18 months ago, I'd tell myself to talk to google about law school a lot sooner. I had no idea until my plans were already set that you could negotiate scholarships, and I probably didn't max out on my possible LSAT. I could be right where I'm at for a lot less money if I'd prepared better and applied to wider range of schools.

If I could talk to myself 7 years ago, I'd say stop slacking off in undergrad because your grades matter! I remember thinking the exact opposite when I got to undergrad - now that high school's over, grades don't matter so much. Not true!

For all the pessimism and snarkiness of TLS, it's basic repetitive dogma of "get good grades, retake LSAT" is pretty solid, and I think it helps everyone applying to law school to hear it.

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JCougar
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby JCougar » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:51 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:
JCougar wrote:If I could go back to the beginning of undergrad, I'd have stuck with physics and gone right on to get my PhD. I switched my major to psychology, which I don't think was the worst decision in the world, because I learned a lot of good stuff about myself and about how other people behave -- which comes in handy no matter what you do. Still, I think Physics would be a field that would be constantly interesting and challenging to me -- even if I'd be making shit money in a post-doc job right now. Instead, I got a MS and went into corporate office work, which was a huge waste of some of the best years of my life.

Provided I stuck with psychology, I wish I would have taken undergrad more seriously. It would have required such a small amount of effort on my part to get a GPA closer to 4.0. But I literally put in next to no effort, almost never went to class unless there was an exam. I always thought "who cares, undergrad GPA doesn't matter...it's not like most jobs even ask for it." But it would have helped me pay much less for law school and/or break into the T14.

And if you would have talked to me 2-3 years ago, I would have told myself to go to law school sooner -- that there's no light at the end of the tunnel in a miserable, phony corporate bureaucracy.


I think you from 3 years from now may be trying to come back to tell you that there's no light at the end of the tunnel in a miserable, phony corporate law firm bureaucracy :wink:


Eh....at least I'll get a better paycheck and my manager won't be as blisteringly stupid. He/she might be arrogant and/or socially awkward, but the lady that used to manage me literally couldn't tell her ass from a hole in the wall. There's no way people like her could have made it through law school. She somehow managed to get a PhD, though...I have no idea how that happened.

Believe me, though, my expectations aren't that high. Compared to my old job, a law firm has a relatively low hurdle to leap. :wink:

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romothesavior
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby romothesavior » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:54 pm

JCougar wrote:Eh....at least I'll get a better paycheck and my manager won't be as blisteringly stupid.

I don't think either one of these is a guarantee. :lol:

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JCougar
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby JCougar » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:57 pm

romothesavior wrote:
JCougar wrote:Eh....at least I'll get a better paycheck and my manager won't be as blisteringly stupid.

I don't think either one of these is a guarantee. :lol:


If you only knew. :wink:

jblev2
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby jblev2 » Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:58 pm

Think of all the amazing things you can do for someone or our society after you pass the BAR or just graduate law school.

You could keep many people out of jail, makes tons of money working for a corporation, run for political office, work for the FBI or CIA, help people with divorces, help women get child support, help people in 1500 different ways...

I know PHd's who wish, wish they had gone to law school because they want to get in on all the amazing opportunities law brings. The only job better than law is as an immunologist curing diseases somewhere or researching senescence in medicine and there is no money in those things, not even in pharmacology, only in pharmaceuticals.

So, be very happy with your law degree! Go work for an affirmative action office, or tutor the LSAT for Powerseekrs and make $50 an hour...that can't be that stressful! Then donate some money to charity, because lots of charities need money more than they need manpower.

I have a counter question for you, if you already make 6 figures in real estate, is it worth going to law school? Because that is my situation, and going could lower the money I was making while in law school.

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northwood
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby northwood » Tue Dec 14, 2010 3:01 pm

I would have never gotten my master degree.

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stratocophic
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby stratocophic » Tue Dec 14, 2010 3:06 pm

jblev2 wrote:Think of all the amazing things you can do for someone or our society after you pass the BAR or just graduate law school.

You could keep many people out of jail, makes tons of money working for a corporation, run for political office, work for the FBI or CIA, help people with divorces, help women get child support, help people in 1500 different ways...

I know PHd's who wish, wish they had gone to law school because they want to get in on all the amazing opportunities law brings. The only job better than law is as an immunologist curing diseases somewhere or researching senescence in medicine and there is no money in those things, not even in pharmacology, only in pharmaceuticals.

So, be very happy with your law degree! Go work for an affirmative action office, or tutor the LSAT for Powerseekrs and make $50 an hour...that can't be that stressful! Then donate some money to charity, because lots of charities need money more than they need manpower.

I have a counter question for you, if you already make 6 figures in real estate, is it worth going to law school? Because that is my situation, and going could lower the money I was making while in law school.
Image

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Lawl Shcool
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby Lawl Shcool » Tue Dec 14, 2010 3:06 pm

Yes, 1000 times over.

Law school has been the best thing to happen in my life yet. I have found out things about myself I never would have otherwise, got to live in a different state for 3 years, and I should, hopefully, have a job at the end of all of it. The only thing I would possibly do different is MAYBE waited a year or two to save money / work on getting a better LSAT score so I could have saved a little cash re: loans. That being said, with how its gone so far I'm extremely happy with my decision to attend.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Tue Dec 14, 2010 3:20 pm

jblev2 wrote:Think of all the amazing things you can do for someone or our society after you pass the BAR or just graduate law school.

You could keep many people out of jail, makes tons of money working for a corporation, run for political office, work for the FBI or CIA, help people with divorces, help women get child support, help people in 1500 different ways...

I know PHd's who wish, wish they had gone to law school because they want to get in on all the amazing opportunities law brings. The only job better than law is as an immunologist curing diseases somewhere or researching senescence in medicine and there is no money in those things, not even in pharmacology, only in pharmaceuticals.

So, be very happy with your law degree! Go work for an affirmative action office, or tutor the LSAT for Powerseekrs and make $50 an hour...that can't be that stressful! Then donate some money to charity, because lots of charities need money more than they need manpower.

I have a counter question for you, if you already make 6 figures in real estate, is it worth going to law school? Because that is my situation, and going could lower the money I was making while in law school.


FLAME.

keg411
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby keg411 » Tue Dec 14, 2010 4:24 pm

JCougar wrote:I wish I would have taken undergrad more seriously. It would have required such a small amount of effort on my part to get a GPA closer to 4.0. But I literally put in next to no effort, almost never went to class unless there was an exam. I always thought "who cares, undergrad GPA doesn't matter...it's not like most jobs even ask for it." But it would have helped me pay much less for law school and/or break into the T14.


Agree w/this part 100% - I was the worst slacker ever in college (and in high school). But not the part about going to school sooner. Really, really happy with my decision to work for all of these years (not that law school was really on my radar before then, but still).

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JCougar
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby JCougar » Tue Dec 14, 2010 4:30 pm

keg411 wrote:
JCougar wrote:I wish I would have taken undergrad more seriously. It would have required such a small amount of effort on my part to get a GPA closer to 4.0. But I literally put in next to no effort, almost never went to class unless there was an exam. I always thought "who cares, undergrad GPA doesn't matter...it's not like most jobs even ask for it." But it would have helped me pay much less for law school and/or break into the T14.


Agree w/this part 100% - I was the worst slacker ever in college (and in high school). But not the part about going to school sooner. Really, really happy with my decision to work for all of these years (not that law school was really on my radar before then, but still).


I put in more effort this semester than I did my entire 5 years of undergrad.

UCLAtransfer
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby UCLAtransfer » Tue Dec 14, 2010 4:36 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:This is a tough question.

I mean, I have very good things lined up, and 3 years ago, I had no other prospects (it was entirely clear that teaching was not going to work out). So, law school ended up being a gamble for me. But jesus fucking christ, was it ever a gamble.


I agree completely.

Everything seems to have worked out well, but if I had known how much of a gamble it was going to be, and how much more than hard work it takes to make law school worth it, I don't think I could have rationally made the decision to attend.

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seespotrun
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby seespotrun » Tue Dec 14, 2010 5:30 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:But, so it goes. That boat sailed a long time ago - though my retirement plan is to buy and run a neighborhood pub.


Talk about taking a gamble. The restaurant and bar business is so shitty.

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quadsixm
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby quadsixm » Tue Dec 14, 2010 5:42 pm

I quit an engineering job in Los Angeles w/ a $70k+ starting salary to come and study law in the midwest.

Ask me again in a year or two how I feel about it, but as of right now.... I'm leaning towards no.

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dood
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby dood » Tue Dec 14, 2010 5:51 pm

...
Last edited by dood on Sat Dec 25, 2010 6:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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quadsixm
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby quadsixm » Tue Dec 14, 2010 6:08 pm

I'm at WUSTL, planning on doing IP, maybe trademark/copyright, but probably patent. I have no idea what the job prospects are like as far as IP here, but in general, not great.

I was working at a dot com (computer science), so most of my coworkers were young, 20's and 30's. But the old guys there were slow, outdated with their programming languages/design patterns/skills and hated their jobs, and often ended up getting fired... so I kind of came to the realization that it's just not a very good job once you get old. Not to mention that although starting salary is decent out of college, it doesn't get a lot better from there without a PhD.

And yeah, everybody who owned a house had to buy in the inland empire because they can't afford anything near the city, which means 1 hour + commutes in each direction.

dood wrote:
quadsixm wrote:I quit an engineering job in Los Angeles w/ a $70k+ starting salary to come and study law in the midwest.

Ask me again in a year or two how I feel about it, but as of right now.... I'm leaning towards no.


ME TOO BRO. cept my salary was moar than urs. and i came to DC to study tha law. explain: wat school u going to and wat r u joerb prospects? PATENT?

EDIT: another Q - did u find ur engineering job to be super depressing, seeing all the 30-50 year old fuckers who were basically dead inside, working a shitty 9-5 with no passion, just collecting a paycheck week to week to pay off their over-mortgaged home in the inland empire?

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iagolives
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby iagolives » Tue Dec 14, 2010 6:16 pm

ogurty wrote:I love law school too. Wouldn't change it.

But if I could talk to myself, even 1 year or 18 months ago, I'd tell myself to talk to google about law school a lot sooner.


I may just be bad at reading, but did you say you work(ed) for Google? That's awesome! How did you make yourself leave?

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moandersen
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby moandersen » Tue Dec 14, 2010 6:32 pm

JCougar wrote:I put in more effort this semester than I did my entire 5 years of undergrad.


+ my 4 years of high school. Ive been motivating myself by saying that I saved up all my studying time for my 1L year

we shall see if I made the right choice leaving a stress-free, decent paying job to go back to school on whether I have a job on graduation day.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Tue Dec 14, 2010 6:39 pm

seespotrun wrote:
ToTransferOrNot wrote:But, so it goes. That boat sailed a long time ago - though my retirement plan is to buy and run a neighborhood pub.


Talk about taking a gamble. The restaurant and bar business is so shitty.


By the time I retire, I'll have enough money that it won't matter. This isn't a plan for the short term, and it wouldn't be a money-making plan either. I've just never been happier in life than when I was tending bar, and I would go nuts with "idle" retirement.

redgreenpaper
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Re: If you could talk to you 2-3 years ago...

Postby redgreenpaper » Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:43 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:
seespotrun wrote:
ToTransferOrNot wrote:But, so it goes. That boat sailed a long time ago - though my retirement plan is to buy and run a neighborhood pub.


Talk about taking a gamble. The restaurant and bar business is so shitty.


By the time I retire, I'll have enough money that it won't matter. This isn't a plan for the short term, and it wouldn't be a money-making plan either. I've just never been happier in life than when I was tending bar, and I would go nuts with "idle" retirement.


ya my mentality is almost working until i die. but as i get older and older i would work less and less. just need something to occupy myself with. i personally wanted to do probono cases when i retire.




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