How are your outlines looking?

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beach_terror
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby beach_terror » Mon Nov 08, 2010 12:01 pm

Veyron wrote:
And yet, when I bash on TTTs, you criticise me why?


Why not?

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RVP11
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby RVP11 » Mon Nov 08, 2010 12:02 pm

beach_terror wrote:
gwuorbust wrote:
beach_terror wrote:
Personal jurisdiction, federal subject matter, removal, supplemental and venue don't seem to have the rules as their basis. Most of my class has trouble understanding the material as it is, I would be lulzing hard if they incorporated any more material. 3 different classmates, on 3 different days, raised their hand and got where corporations reside under 1391 wrong.


hahaha, have fun trying to take the bar.


Thanks! Your concern is very important to me :D


Now now. Y'all both probably have your fair share of dumb classmates, given this is a TTT vs. TTTT battle.

I'd spend a lot less time on TLS and a lot more time gunning for top 5%, guyz.

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Veyron
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby Veyron » Mon Nov 08, 2010 12:03 pm

beach_terror wrote:
Veyron wrote:
And yet, when I bash on TTTs, you criticise me why?


Why not?


Touche

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gwuorbust
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby gwuorbust » Mon Nov 08, 2010 12:14 pm

RVP11 wrote:Now now. Y'all both probably have your fair share of dumb classmates, given this is a TTT vs. TTTT battle.

I'd spend a lot less time on TLS and a lot more time gunning for top 5%, guyz.


its possible to do both at same time. I type this with only my left hand while the other is constantly raised here in Crim Law.

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nygrrrl
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby nygrrrl » Mon Nov 08, 2010 12:29 pm

kalvano wrote:I set up my charts as a separate section in OneNote, not as part of the page. So if I have a section on Future Interests, I just have a link to the chart.

Thank you - perfect!

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kalvano
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby kalvano » Mon Nov 08, 2010 1:21 pm

traehekat wrote:screen shot of a portion of the chart would be pretty sweet...... just saying. :mrgreen:

i feel like i am not making use of all the cool shit onenote can do. the fanciest thing i do is link to other sections.



Your wish is my command.

I don't make use of a lot of the fancy stuff because I don't want to get bogged down in it. I really enjoy the organizational system of notebooks and sections as opposed to a new Word document for each class. It's much easier to organize things by what we are studying...you can see it in the screenshot. Be warned, it's nothing pretty. It's just useful to me.




Image

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traehekat
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby traehekat » Mon Nov 08, 2010 1:32 pm

Thanks man I appreciate it!

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BunkMoreland
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby BunkMoreland » Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:39 pm

RVP11 wrote:
BunkMoreland wrote:2L here. haven't even started outlining XD



For reference, if you are a 1L, I WOULDNT recommend this approach. I'm just too busy with other stuff/too lazy to care about my grades now that I have a summer offer.

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romothesavior
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby romothesavior » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:07 pm

gwuorbust wrote:
swc65 wrote:Should we have outlines almost done already?


considering that there is about a month left of school I think that is kindof impossible. but they should be complete up to the material that you have covered up to this point.

Says who?

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kalvano
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby kalvano » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:11 pm

romothesavior wrote:
gwuorbust wrote:
swc65 wrote:Should we have outlines almost done already?


considering that there is about a month left of school I think that is kindof impossible. but they should be complete up to the material that you have covered up to this point.

Says who?



Teh Interwebz gods.

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gwuorbust
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby gwuorbust » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:20 pm

romothesavior wrote:
gwuorbust wrote:
swc65 wrote:Should we have outlines almost done already?


considering that there is about a month left of school I think that is kindof impossible. but they should be complete up to the material that you have covered up to this point.

Says who?


says me :lol:

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romothesavior
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby romothesavior » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:23 pm

gwuorbust wrote:says me :lol:

Haha well thank you for your words of wisdom.

I don't think I know anyone who is completely up to date with their outlines in my section. Maybe my roommate (but he's not in my section). Most people are making gradual progress and have worked on all of their outlines, but they aren't polished and up to date by any means.

09042014
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby 09042014 » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:24 pm

OneNote rocks for linking and for searching.

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beach_terror
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby beach_terror » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:29 pm

For those who haven't started outlining, how are you still sane?

After cataloging the amount of shit I have to do before finals, and with my outlines up to date in each class up to the last full section, I almost shat my pants today.

09042014
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby 09042014 » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:33 pm

beach_terror wrote:For those who haven't started outlining, how are you still sane?

After cataloging the amount of shit I have to do before finals, and with my outlines up to date in each class up to the last full section, I almost shat my pants today.


It must be a function of what the culture at the school is. Nobody in my section hasn't done any.

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traehekat
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby traehekat » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:53 pm

beach_terror wrote:For those who haven't started outlining, how are you still sane?

After cataloging the amount of shit I have to do before finals, and with my outlines up to date in each class up to the last full section, I almost shat my pants today.


What stuff do you have to do if your outlines are up to date? Condense outlines, hypos, practice exams... anything else? Seems like a few weeks of doing nothing but application and outline editing is plenty.

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kalvano
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby kalvano » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:55 pm

beach_terror wrote:For those who haven't started outlining, how are you still sane?

After cataloging the amount of shit I have to do before finals, and with my outlines up to date in each class up to the last full section, I almost shat my pants today.


I haven't really. I've condensed my notes and such, but no official outlines. I take really good notes though, and I don't think outlining anything (other than Civ Pro) will take more than 3-4 hours apiece.

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JazzOne
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby JazzOne » Wed Nov 10, 2010 12:24 am

beach_terror wrote:For those who haven't started outlining, how are you still sane?

After cataloging the amount of shit I have to do before finals, and with my outlines up to date in each class up to the last full section, I almost shat my pants today.

I haven't even starting reading yet for a couple of my classes.

Edit: OK, most of them.

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GeePee
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby GeePee » Wed Nov 10, 2010 1:49 am

Veyron wrote:
BarbellDreams wrote:
beach_terror wrote:My CivPro outline is only 15 pages right now. We've gone through personal jurisdiction, federal subject matter, removal, supplemental, and venue. We're not focusing on the FRCP though. Pretty sure this coming week is choice of law and Erie :(


You guys need to buy your prof a cake or something, if it wasnt for the FRCP and we did just cases alone I would feel confident for the final. The FRCP is a little ridiculous at times.


How the FUCK do you learn civ pro without learning the rules?

Because most lawyers just look them up. Who cares if the rule says removal is legitimate only if a party removes 15 or 30 or 60 days after the case becomes removable, or whether appeal on double discretion is under rule 52(b) or 54(a) or 60(b), as long as you know such rules exist and that you should be cognizant of them while you practice?

Memorizing which rules tell you what is not necessary to understanding civil procedure.

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gwuorbust
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby gwuorbust » Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:01 am

GeePee wrote:Because most lawyers just look them up. Who cares if the rule says removal is legitimate only if a party removes 15 or 30 or 60 days after the case becomes removable, or whether appeal on double discretion is under rule 52(b) or 54(a) or 60(b), as long as you know such rules exist and that you should be cognizant of them while you practice?

Memorizing which rules tell you what is not necessary to understanding civil procedure.


Its not about memorizing the rules, its about how to interpret said rules. therein lies the key difference.

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beach_terror
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby beach_terror » Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:04 am

gwuorbust wrote:
GeePee wrote:Because most lawyers just look them up. Who cares if the rule says removal is legitimate only if a party removes 15 or 30 or 60 days after the case becomes removable, or whether appeal on double discretion is under rule 52(b) or 54(a) or 60(b), as long as you know such rules exist and that you should be cognizant of them while you practice?

Memorizing which rules tell you what is not necessary to understanding civil procedure.


Its not about memorizing the rules, its about how to interpret said rules. therein lies the key difference.


FRCP just govern procedure, there's nothing particularly substantive about them (by law, they can't be, eh?) ... so how are you going to have trouble interpreting rules that should be more or less straightforward?

$$$$$$
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby $$$$$$ » Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:07 am

Desert Fox wrote:
beach_terror wrote:For those who haven't started outlining, how are you still sane?

After cataloging the amount of shit I have to do before finals, and with my outlines up to date in each class up to the last full section, I almost shat my pants today.


It must be a function of what the culture at the school is. Nobody in my section hasn't done any.



I haven't really started yet and i have like 25 days till my first final. I have some random "outlines" that ive made for different classes (pretty much synthesized class notes on random topics in the class) and I have a ton of old outlines to look at. I think people make too big of a deal about the actual outline instead of caring that they just understand the material the best they can on test day.

$$$$$$
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby $$$$$$ » Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:16 am

beach_terror wrote:
gwuorbust wrote:
GeePee wrote:Because most lawyers just look them up. Who cares if the rule says removal is legitimate only if a party removes 15 or 30 or 60 days after the case becomes removable, or whether appeal on double discretion is under rule 52(b) or 54(a) or 60(b), as long as you know such rules exist and that you should be cognizant of them while you practice?

Memorizing which rules tell you what is not necessary to understanding civil procedure.


Its not about memorizing the rules, its about how to interpret said rules. therein lies the key difference.


FRCP just govern procedure, there's nothing particularly substantive about them (by law, they can't be, eh?) ... so how are you going to have trouble interpreting rules that should be more or less straightforward?



That depends how you define substantive. And the rules are definitely interpreted differently and analyzed situation by situation. The FRCP are not used in every federal case, the court must decide if the rule actually applies to the situation at hand. This takes interpretation. The context of the case, where the case is being tried, etc can affect whether the rule is even used instead of a state law. Also, you don't think that the FRCP are ambiguous? There are terms that are applied differently by different courts because some rules are vague and some are ambiguous. You should learn which ones have these qualities in case it shows up (and it probably will) on your exam, it can only help you.

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beach_terror
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby beach_terror » Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:18 am

$$$$$$ wrote:
beach_terror wrote:
gwuorbust wrote:
GeePee wrote:Because most lawyers just look them up. Who cares if the rule says removal is legitimate only if a party removes 15 or 30 or 60 days after the case becomes removable, or whether appeal on double discretion is under rule 52(b) or 54(a) or 60(b), as long as you know such rules exist and that you should be cognizant of them while you practice?

Memorizing which rules tell you what is not necessary to understanding civil procedure.


Its not about memorizing the rules, its about how to interpret said rules. therein lies the key difference.


FRCP just govern procedure, there's nothing particularly substantive about them (by law, they can't be, eh?) ... so how are you going to have trouble interpreting rules that should be more or less straightforward?



That depends how you define substantive. And the rules are definitely interpreted differently and analyzed situation by situation. The FRCP are not used in every federal case, the court must decide if the rule actually applies to the situation at hand. This takes interpretation. The context of the case, where the case is being tried, etc can affect whether the rule is even used instead of a state law. Also, you don't think that the FRCP are ambiguous? There are terms that are applied differently by different courts because some rules are vague and some are ambiguous. You should learn which ones have these qualities in case it shows up (and it probably will) on your exam, it can only help you.


The bolded was part of GeePee's point, that's choice of law and the Erie aftermath - which you can teach without the use of the FRCP. To decide if you use FRCP or state procedure, if there is a FRCP is on point - you use the rule because thats what the Supremacy Clause dictates. If there isn't, you look at outcome-determinative tests and decide if apply federal law will change the outcome of the case and if it does, then you should apply state law to discourage forum shopping.

09042014
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Re: How are your outlines looking?

Postby 09042014 » Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:22 am

My prof teaches the history of the rules. The rules have a huge impact on what kinds of litigation get to trial.




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