T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

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DiscoveryDeadline
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T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:38 pm

With classes starting to kick into gear at most places and the initial shock over with, figured I might make myself of service to those still getting adjusted.

Fire away, and I will try to answer to the best of my ability.

09042014
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby 09042014 » Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:41 pm

What do you think distinguished you from everyone else.

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Adjudicator
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby Adjudicator » Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:48 pm

If you were a tree, what kind of tree would you be?

lawstudent8685
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby lawstudent8685 » Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:49 pm

if your school has a midterm worth 10 to 20 percent of your grade and you did poorly is it still possible to get a high grade in the course?

DiscoveryDeadline
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:49 pm

Desert Fox wrote:What do you think distinguished you from everyone else.


A few things.

For one thing, I don't g-chat or surf the Web during class or when studying. I don't Facebook during class or when studying. When it's time to get down to business, I'm all business. Now, you'll see a lot of posts around here about how you shouldn't underestimate the people g-chatting during class or skipping class all together. And I agree with that. But, for me, and I think this is true of the average person, I think you need to be present in class mentally and physically, and the same goes for studying.

I stayed on top of things. I never entered a class - not one time - unprepared to discuss that day's reading. You'll read a lot on here about how the cases and the reading don't matter. I don't buy that whatsoever. You should be reading everything, and thinking through it until you internalize it and figure it out.

I used supplements sparingly, but they can be effective if they are the right ones.

I took practice tests under real test conditions. In other words, no 20-minute issue spot and be done with it. I wrote the practice tests the same way I'd write the real deal Holyfield.

I didn't socialize a whole lot. Don't get me wrong. I'm not socially awkward. People like me, and I like people. But f$&$& this stuff you hear about needing "balance" in your life. It is one stinking year of your life, and a ton rides on it, especially ITE. Get your ass in the library, even on Friday and Saturday nights. Even early in the semester. You have one shot at 1L, and you have the rest of your life to achieve "balance." Undergrad is over. Deal with it.

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98234872348
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby 98234872348 » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:04 pm

DiscoveryDeadline wrote:You have one shot at 1L, and you have the rest of your life to achieve "balance." Undergrad is over. Deal with it.

So I am assuming you're not interested in Biglaw, then?

DiscoveryDeadline
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:13 pm

mistergoft wrote:
DiscoveryDeadline wrote:You have one shot at 1L, and you have the rest of your life to achieve "balance." Undergrad is over. Deal with it.

So I am assuming you're not interested in Biglaw, then?


Interested indeed, and offer already accepted for next summer.

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vanwinkle
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby vanwinkle » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:17 pm

DiscoveryDeadline wrote:Interested indeed, and offer already accepted for next summer.

You do realize there's going to be no balance there at all, right?

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bk1
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby bk1 » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:19 pm

DiscoveryDeadline wrote:
mistergoft wrote:
DiscoveryDeadline wrote:You have one shot at 1L, and you have the rest of your life to achieve "balance." Undergrad is over. Deal with it.

So I am assuming you're not interested in Biglaw, then?


Interested indeed, and offer already accepted for next summer.


Whoosh.

DiscoveryDeadline
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:21 pm

vanwinkle wrote:
DiscoveryDeadline wrote:Interested indeed, and offer already accepted for next summer.

You do realize there's going to be no balance there at all, right?


I'm not sure what you're getting at. I don't understand the relevance. Are you saying that 1L's should have a school-life "balance" because they have the rest of their lives to work hard?

I guess that's an alternative way to look at it, but potentially self-sabotage.

The way I look at it, I don't want to look back at age 30 and think, "Damn, I wish I'd have worked harder at age 23."

I'm saying that you should treat 1L year like biglaw on steroids.

It is the single most important year of your legal career. Nothing else comes close. Except maybe your LSAT study year.

DiscoveryDeadline
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:22 pm

bk1 wrote:
DiscoveryDeadline wrote:
mistergoft wrote:
DiscoveryDeadline wrote:You have one shot at 1L, and you have the rest of your life to achieve "balance." Undergrad is over. Deal with it.

So I am assuming you're not interested in Biglaw, then?


Interested indeed, and offer already accepted for next summer.


Whoosh.


Uh, no.

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bk1
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby bk1 » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:22 pm

You seriously studied for the LSAT for a year?

DiscoveryDeadline
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:25 pm

bk1 wrote:You seriously studied for the LSAT for a year?


God, no.

I used "year" in a general sense as the year you take the LSAT, not as in 12 months.

But I do think it's another one of those important career steps that you should spend an almost irrational amount of time preparing for.

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bk1
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby bk1 » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:26 pm

^Fair enough.

DiscoveryDeadline wrote:
bk1 wrote:Whoosh.


Uh, no.


Either you completely missed his point or you just chose to ignore it.

DankoM
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DankoM » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:28 pm

You do realize that top 5% also involves a lot of luck, right? Not that you wouldn't have done well in a different set of circumstances, but which professors you have, what's on the test, how you feel on test day, all play a huge role.

FWIW, I'm around top 10% at CCN at didn't work nearly this hard (though I did work harder than the average person, I think). I'm not about to pretend that given different exams or professors (some I clicked with, some I didn't) I couldn't have ended up top 5% or only top 30% or so.
Last edited by DankoM on Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:28 pm

Would you review class notes at all during the week?

When did you start outlining?

When did you start taking practice tests?

Graded LR&W? If so, how much time did you spend on your final memo. If Pass/fail, did you sacrifice this class to make more time for other classes?

DiscoveryDeadline
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:29 pm

bk1 wrote:^Fair enough.

DiscoveryDeadline wrote:
bk1 wrote:Whoosh.


Uh, no.


Either you completely missed his point or you just chose to ignore it.


I chose to ignore it and then addressed it in a subsequent post.

All I'm saying is you do NOT want to be one of those people on the Employment forum a year from now wondering why you aren't getting any CBs or offers. Trust me. No night out on the town is worth being on that side of the fence.

And there is more than just biglaw at stake. Maybe you want academia. Maybe you want to work in the U.S. Attorney's Office. Those places don't take mediocre students, either. Maybe you want midlaw. So get the best grades you can and be the best candidate midlaw firms will look at in your cycle.

And even if you go biglaw, most people leave it anyway after a few years.

Again, you have the rest of your life to achieve "balance." Your 1L year is not the time. Undergrad is over.

DiscoveryDeadline
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:31 pm

DankoM wrote:You do realize that top 5% also involves a lot of luck, right? Not that you wouldn't have done well in a different set of circumstances, but which professors you have, what's on the test, how you feel on test day, all play a huge role.

FWIW, I'm around top 10% at CCN at didn't work nearly this hard (though I did work harder than the average person, I think). I'm not about to pretend that given different exams or professors (some I clicked with, some I didn't) I couldn't have ended up top 5% or only top 30% or so.


I agree. It's not like I had all A's in every single class.

But I think that you should do your best to mitigate that luck, rather than leaving it to the fates.

DiscoveryDeadline
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:35 pm

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:Would you review class notes at all during the week?


Not until exam time started. There just isn't enough time during the week if you are reading. Save review for the weekends. During exam time, however, or maybe about a month before, you really have to start allocating your time a little differently.

Richie Tenenbaum wrote: When did you start outlining?


It varied wildly by class, to tell the truth. Some classes I outlined as I went along, even during class itself. Some classes I never did put together a very good outline. Generally, however, started on this about a month before the exam in each class. Then continued to pare it down and down and down.

Richie Tenenbaum wrote: When did you start taking practice tests?
Anywhere from 4-6 weeks prior to the exam. Some of this depends how many exams your professor has available. You don't want to run out of them too early. And you don't want to start them before you have learned a lot of the material in the class that will be tested.

Richie Tenenbaum wrote: Graded LR&W? If so, how much time did you spend on your final memo. If Pass/fail, did you sacrifice this class to make more time for other classes?


P/F and I unquestionably sacrificed this class to make more time for other classes. Part of me regrets it because I think that getting honors in there would have been very good for the resume and OCI, but there are only so many hours in the day.

And that brings me to another point. You will realize that you do not have all the time in the world. This was something that really floored me in LS, because in the past I just figured I could procrastinate and catch up later. In LS, you WILL run out of time if you take this approach.

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Helmholtz
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby Helmholtz » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:36 pm

DiscoveryDeadline wrote:"f$&$& this stuff you hear about needing "balance" in your life."


this made me laugh

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Kohinoor
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby Kohinoor » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:38 pm

I enjoyed this thread.

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nealric
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby nealric » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:38 pm

P/F and I unquestionably sacrificed this class to make more time for other classes. Part of me regrets it because I think that getting honors in there would have been very good for the resume and OCI, but there are only so many hours in the day.


Lol. You don't need honors in LRW to help you if you are top 5%.

uvauvauva
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby uvauvauva » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:38 pm

how did you approach your exams differently from other people?

what do you think really made you stand out?

DiscoveryDeadline
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:39 pm

nealric wrote:
P/F and I unquestionably sacrificed this class to make more time for other classes. Part of me regrets it because I think that getting honors in there would have been very good for the resume and OCI, but there are only so many hours in the day.


Lol. You don't need honors in LRW to help you if you are top 5%.


ITE you need all the help you can get. Seriously. I've been through OCI and been rejected by plenty of firms. Grades are necessary, but not sufficient for biglaw.

DiscoveryDeadline
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Re: T14, top 5 percent, answering questions

Postby DiscoveryDeadline » Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:41 pm

uvauvauva wrote:how did you approach your exams differently from other people?

what do you think really made you stand out?


Tons and tons and tons of practice exams. And like I said above, I spent time actually writing the practice exams instead of just issue-spotting.

Also, I think checklists are very important on exams. Your outline should be topped by a checklist of issues that might show up somewhere that you aren't entirely comfortable you will spot. This was a life saver on several occasions.




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