No Laptops in Class!

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prezidentv8
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby prezidentv8 » Sat Aug 28, 2010 12:23 pm

jne381 wrote:
thorntll wrote:At Chicago, they blocked the internet in the classrooms. I actually think it's a good idea. I am forced to pay attention, but can still use my laptop.


I hand wrote for my first semester, then I started using my laptop the second semester. The laptop is much more efficient IMHO.

Banning the internet, in my case, would stink because I type my notes directly into a Google Doc, but it is probably a good idea in general.


My two worst grades = two classes where I could not use my laptop. Slow and crappy handwriting and ADD and narcoleptic tendencies for the loss.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Sat Aug 28, 2010 7:00 pm

If a prof banned laptops in any class I was in, I would immediately proceed to get a letter from a doctor verifying that I experience significant pain in my hand if I have to write for any significant period of time. Then, I would proceed to use my laptop in the class anyway.

Stupid rules are stupid.

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ResolutePear
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby ResolutePear » Sat Aug 28, 2010 7:06 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:If a prof banned laptops in any class I was in, I would immediately proceed to get a letter from a doctor verifying that I experience significant pain in my hand if I have to write for any significant period of time. Then, I would proceed to use my laptop in the class anyway.

Stupid rules are stupid.


I thought about that, but from what I was told by multiple medical professionals was: Typing is far more demanding on the hands than writing. If there is a writing disability associated with pain, it could be fixed by getting a pen fitted for you(See which pen works for you, i.e. Zebra F-series, Pentech Exec-Tech, etc.

I think it'd be more prudent to tape record lectures and transcribe them after class on your computer... and at your own leisure!

Baylan
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby Baylan » Sat Aug 28, 2010 7:31 pm

My Torts prof not only banned laptops in class, he is also having a closed book, hand written final.

Needless to say, I am not excited for Torts. (My classes start on Monday)

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angiej
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby angiej » Sat Aug 28, 2010 7:34 pm

I have always taken notes using Onenote and am a faster typer than writer. I wonder if any of you already admitted students could comment on which specific schools have laptop bans. This would help contribute to my reasoning in chosing a specific school (and may be helpful to other TLSers. Perhaps such a list could be added to this thread, or another, or perhaps you could PM me and I could make a list. Thanks!

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kalvano
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby kalvano » Sat Aug 28, 2010 7:35 pm

I can see banning laptops in class, but banning them on the final is ridiculous, with the advent of Examsoft.

Baylan
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby Baylan » Sat Aug 28, 2010 7:49 pm

kalvano wrote:I can see banning laptops in class, but banning them on the final is ridiculous, with the advent of Examsoft.


Can I bring a typewriter to the final is my only question...

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kalvano
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby kalvano » Sat Aug 28, 2010 7:56 pm

How about word processors?

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ResolutePear
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby ResolutePear » Sat Aug 28, 2010 8:18 pm

Baylan wrote:
kalvano wrote:I can see banning laptops in class, but banning them on the final is ridiculous, with the advent of Examsoft.


Can I bring a typewriter to the final is my only question...


Talk about a distrac...

--ImageRemoved--
hey! A bunny!

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Bildungsroman
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby Bildungsroman » Sat Aug 28, 2010 8:22 pm

Just use your fountain pens on the mimeographed exams and write fast to save candlelight. This is simple stuff, people!

Seriously, though, a rule against laptops seems increasingly difficult to justify since the legal field, as every other field in the world it seems, is becoming increasingly digitized.

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ResolutePear
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby ResolutePear » Sat Aug 28, 2010 8:49 pm

Bildungsroman wrote:Just use your fountain pens on the mimeographed exams and write fast to save candlelight. This is simple stuff, people!

Seriously, though, a rule against laptops seems increasingly difficult to justify since the legal field, as every other field in the world it seems, is becoming increasingly digitized.


Well, one could argue that having a laptop in law school would be like having a TI-89(very, very powerful calculator) or matlab in a mathematics major. Only way you can level the playing field is to do away with said electronics in the classroom.

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Bildungsroman
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby Bildungsroman » Sat Aug 28, 2010 8:51 pm

ResolutePear wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:Just use your fountain pens on the mimeographed exams and write fast to save candlelight. This is simple stuff, people!

Seriously, though, a rule against laptops seems increasingly difficult to justify since the legal field, as every other field in the world it seems, is becoming increasingly digitized.


Well, one could argue that having a laptop in law school would be like having a TI-89(very, very powerful calculator) or matlab in a mathematics major. Only way you can level the playing field is to do away with said electronics in the classroom.


Specious analogy is specious.

Also, in what way does having a computer unlevel the playing field? And for whom?

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MrKappus
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby MrKappus » Sat Aug 28, 2010 8:57 pm

Bildungsroman wrote:Just use your fountain pens on the mimeographed exams and write fast to save candlelight. This is simple stuff, people!

Seriously, though, a rule against laptops seems increasingly difficult to justify since the legal field, as every other field in the world it seems, is becoming increasingly digitized.


It's a stupid rule b/c it handicaps the pedagogical process, not b/c the field is "increasingly digitized." Surgery's "increasingly robotized," but med students still learn how to use a scalpel.

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GoodToBeTheKing
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby GoodToBeTheKing » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:01 pm

my LAWR prof bans laptops. she said that there are studies from Stanford that say having a laptop or other electronic device on or around you while you study or try and absorb information diminishes the amount of information you retain. even the thought of expecting an email, not even checking your email, can diminish your ability to pay attention.

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ResolutePear
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby ResolutePear » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:07 pm

Bildungsroman wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:Just use your fountain pens on the mimeographed exams and write fast to save candlelight. This is simple stuff, people!

Seriously, though, a rule against laptops seems increasingly difficult to justify since the legal field, as every other field in the world it seems, is becoming increasingly digitized.


Well, one could argue that having a laptop in law school would be like having a TI-89(very, very powerful calculator) or matlab in a mathematics major. Only way you can level the playing field is to do away with said electronics in the classroom.


Specious analogy is specious.

Also, in what way does having a computer unlevel the playing field? And for whom?


Just playing the devil's advocate with that one on their logic behind it.

Although I'm not in LS, I have profs who do law school classes and they do not allow any material that is not in the syllabus in the classroom or any part of the class. You can easily disguise where you get your information on with a laptop vs. actually having a book in front of the prof.

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JazzOne
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby JazzOne » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:09 pm

ResolutePear wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:Just use your fountain pens on the mimeographed exams and write fast to save candlelight. This is simple stuff, people!

Seriously, though, a rule against laptops seems increasingly difficult to justify since the legal field, as every other field in the world it seems, is becoming increasingly digitized.


Well, one could argue that having a laptop in law school would be like having a TI-89(very, very powerful calculator) or matlab in a mathematics major. Only way you can level the playing field is to do away with said electronics in the classroom.


Specious analogy is specious.

Also, in what way does having a computer unlevel the playing field? And for whom?


Just playing the devil's advocate with that one on their logic behind it.

Although I'm not in LS, I have profs who do law school classes and they do not allow any material that is not in the syllabus in the classroom or any part of the class. You can easily disguise where you get your information on with a laptop vs. actually having a book in front of the prof.

Actually, no, you can't.

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ResolutePear
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby ResolutePear » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:14 pm

JazzOne wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:
Well, one could argue that having a laptop in law school would be like having a TI-89(very, very powerful calculator) or matlab in a mathematics major. Only way you can level the playing field is to do away with said electronics in the classroom.


Specious analogy is specious.

Also, in what way does having a computer unlevel the playing field? And for whom?


Just playing the devil's advocate with that one on their logic behind it.

Although I'm not in LS, I have profs who do law school classes and they do not allow any material that is not in the syllabus in the classroom or any part of the class. You can easily disguise where you get your information on with a laptop vs. actually having a book in front of the prof.

Actually, no, you can't.


Sorry, I wasn't aware that law professors at your school had mirrors positioned at the back of your class.

I submit.

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JazzOne
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby JazzOne » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:17 pm

ResolutePear wrote:Sorry, I wasn't aware that law professors at your school had mirrors positioned at the back of your class.

I submit.

The exam software does not permit you to access anything on your computer except the exam. Happy now? Freakin' smart ass 0Ls.

elliej
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby elliej » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:18 pm

honestly my boring no laptop classes have had WAY better student participation/general engagement than my boring with laptop classes. it helps eliminate some of that really painful "no one is talking when students are supposed to be talking" thing that happens when a professor isn't particularly good and the subject isn't particularly interesting.

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Bildungsroman
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby Bildungsroman » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:23 pm

MrKappus wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:Just use your fountain pens on the mimeographed exams and write fast to save candlelight. This is simple stuff, people!

Seriously, though, a rule against laptops seems increasingly difficult to justify since the legal field, as every other field in the world it seems, is becoming increasingly digitized.


It's a stupid rule b/c it handicaps the pedagogical process, not b/c the field is "increasingly digitized." Surgery's "increasingly robotized," but med students still learn how to use a scalpel.


I am saying that there is no reasonable justification for restricting the use of laptops in class that can be based on the requirements of the profession after graduation. Actually, because lawyers are almost entirely dependent now on computers in their work (for research, for word processing, for organization, etc) removing this competency training from the classroom by banning these important tools of the trade actually works to the detriment of the law student. It not only handicaps the pedagogical process, it also holds students back from adapting their methods in class to the methods they will use in the profession. Do lawyers typically write up documents by hand, or do they type them? Do lawyers typically rely on notes taken by hand, or do they transcribe them with a computer? The fact that lawyers are increasingly reliant on computers means that the restriction on their use is not just hurting their ability to take notes, it's also hurting their ability to be lawyers. One major complaint I hear from law school graduates is that law school teaches the law, but it does a poor job of teaching a student how to be a lawyer. A laptop ban in class only contributes to that problem,

The reason your analogy is so stupid is that it compares apples and oranges. A surgeon learns to use a scalpel because they still need to use a scalpel frequently in their profession. Robotization of surgery is happening, but learning the core competency of scalpel work is still absolutely necessary to be a surgeon. A lawyer, however, does not need to learn how to take notes by hand beyond the basic competency that somebody already brings in that skill from their 12+ years of education up to that point. A lawyer is better served by being encouraged to use the technology that will define their career.

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ResolutePear
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby ResolutePear » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:23 pm

JazzOne wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:Sorry, I wasn't aware that law professors at your school had mirrors positioned at the back of your class.

I submit.

The exam software does not permit you to access anything on your computer except the exam. Happy now? Freakin' smart ass 0Ls.


For a LS, you're horrible at deciphering the details sir.

I'll reiterate, with emphasis to help you out, smart ass:

Although I'm not in LS, I have profs who do law school classes and they do not allow any material that is not in the syllabus in the classroom or any part of the class. You can easily disguise where you get your information on with a laptop vs. actually having a book in front of the prof.

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JazzOne
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby JazzOne » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:27 pm

ResolutePear wrote:
JazzOne wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:Sorry, I wasn't aware that law professors at your school had mirrors positioned at the back of your class.

I submit.

The exam software does not permit you to access anything on your computer except the exam. Happy now? Freakin' smart ass 0Ls.


For a LS, you're horrible at deciphering the details sir.

I'll reiterate, with emphasis to help you out, smart ass:

Although I'm not in LS, I have profs who do law school classes and they do not allow any material that is not in the syllabus in the classroom or any part of the class. You can easily disguise where you get your information on with a laptop vs. actually having a book in front of the prof.

Ah, I thought we were talking about exams. You are correct. Carry on.

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ResolutePear
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby ResolutePear » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:27 pm

Bildungsroman wrote:
MrKappus wrote:
Bildungsroman wrote:Just use your fountain pens on the mimeographed exams and write fast to save candlelight. This is simple stuff, people!

Seriously, though, a rule against laptops seems increasingly difficult to justify since the legal field, as every other field in the world it seems, is becoming increasingly digitized.


It's a stupid rule b/c it handicaps the pedagogical process, not b/c the field is "increasingly digitized." Surgery's "increasingly robotized," but med students still learn how to use a scalpel.


I am saying that there is no reasonable justification for restricting the use of laptops in class that can be based on the requirements of the profession after graduation. Actually, because lawyers are almost entirely dependent now on computers in their work (for research, for word processing, for organization, etc) removing this competency training from the classroom by banning these important tools of the trade actually works to the detriment of the law student. It not only handicaps the pedagogical process, it also holds students back from adapting their methods in class to the methods they will use in the profession. Do lawyers typically write up documents by hand, or do they type them? Do lawyers typically rely on notes taken by hand, or do they transcribe them with a computer? The fact that lawyers are increasingly reliant on computers means that the restriction on their use is not just hurting their ability to take notes, it's also hurting their ability to be lawyers. One major complaint I hear from law school graduates is that law school teaches the law, but it does a poor job of teaching a student how to be a lawyer. A laptop ban in class only contributes to that problem,

The reason your analogy is so stupid is that it compares apples and oranges. A surgeon learns to use a scalpel because they still need to use a scalpel frequently in their profession. Robotization of surgery is happening, but learning the core competency of scalpel work is still absolutely necessary to be a surgeon. A lawyer, however, does not need to learn how to take notes by hand beyond the basic competency that somebody already brings in that skill from their 12+ years of education up to that point. A lawyer is better served by being encouraged to use the technology that will define their career.


I agree with this 100%

Consequently, there are professors which don't.

No lie, I had a *Computer* Science teacher who banned laptops in her lecture and did not want smartphones visible.

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MrKappus
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby MrKappus » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:28 pm

@B-Roman: Law students will, when they become lawyers, lack proficiency with technology b/c one of their profs banned laptops? If that were true, I wish your prof would ban laptops. It'd keep you from posting ITT.

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Bildungsroman
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Re: No Laptops in Class!

Postby Bildungsroman » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:31 pm

MrKappus wrote:@B-Roman: Law students will, when they become lawyers, lack proficiency with technology b/c one of their profs banned laptops? If that were true, I wish your prof would ban laptops. It'd keep you from posting ITT.


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