Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

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T_Easy
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Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby T_Easy » Tue Aug 10, 2010 7:09 pm

My brother and I are both starting law school this year, and we were discussing this earlier today:

He received notice in the mail that he qualifies for the extension of his unemployment benefits. He wants to apply, because the extra money would be extremely helpful, but one of the requirements to receive the benefits is that you have to be actively looking and able to work full-time. Since he's starting 1L in a couple days, we all know he doesn't meet that requirement. Is there a significant chance legal action could be brought against him if he says he's able to work and the government finds out he isn't? Or will they automatically deny his extension once they see he's receiving federal loans for school?

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California Babe
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby California Babe » Tue Aug 10, 2010 8:38 pm

The best way to start your new legal career is by defrauding the government. Go for it, baby.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby ResolutePear » Tue Aug 10, 2010 8:42 pm

T_Easy wrote:My brother and I are both starting law school this year, and we were discussing this earlier today:

He received notice in the mail that he qualifies for the extension of his unemployment benefits. He wants to apply, because the extra money would be extremely helpful, but one of the requirements to receive the benefits is that you have to be actively looking and able to work full-time. Since he's starting 1L in a couple days, we all know he doesn't meet that requirement. Is there a significant chance legal action could be brought against him if he says he's able to work and the government finds out he isn't? Or will they automatically deny his extension once they see he's receiving federal loans for school?


Shame on you for even thinking about defrauding the government!

If you get caught they'll make you pay it back! Shame!
Image

Now, if you're Bender... or if Bender is your kind of guy.. he'd totally be like: Naaaah! You'll never get caught!

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cinefile 17
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby cinefile 17 » Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:09 pm

Wow. There are people out there who can't afford their next meal and wont get help from the government + a national debt in the trillions and you, a law school student, want Bob Jones (hypothetical hard working father who supports a family of four on $30,000 a year) to take more money out of his paycheck so you can have some extra spending money. I'd /self if I ever asked such a shallow and selfish question.

I'm sorry for the harshness, but some of the questions on this board really make me wonder where people's ethics are.

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PKSebben
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby PKSebben » Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:11 pm

cinefile 17 wrote:Wow. There are people out there who can't afford their next meal and wont get help from the government + a national debt in the trillions and you, a law school student, want Bob Jones (hypothetical hard working father who supports a family of four on $30,000 a year) to take more money out of his paycheck so you can have some extra spending money. I'd /self if I ever asked such a shallow and selfish question.


More like Bob Jones making over 150k. But yeah, this is fraud. Character and fitness pwnd.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby ResolutePear » Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:20 pm

cinefile 17 wrote:Wow. There are people out there who can't afford their next meal and wont get help from the government + a national debt in the trillions and you, a law school student, want Bob Jones (hypothetical hard working father who supports a family of four on $30,000 a year) to take more money out of his paycheck so you can have some extra spending money. I'd /self if I ever asked such a shallow and selfish question.

I'm sorry for the harshness, but some of the questions on this board really make me wonder where people's ethics are.


Ethics? On a law school board?

And don't give me all that "Yeah but ethics class! BAR! etc.!" BS. Unethical people unsurprisingly lie on ethics tests.

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cinefile 17
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby cinefile 17 » Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:26 pm

I don't give a crap about the character and fitness test or any other kind of ethics test.

Why not be ethical for the sake of being a good person????? :shock:

And although it seems as though many people on this board aren't quite sure what ethics are or where to find them, there are also plenty of people on TLS who are very good people. :)

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ResolutePear
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby ResolutePear » Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:33 pm

cinefile 17 wrote:I don't give a crap about the character and fitness test or any other kind of ethics test.

Why not be ethical for the sake of being a good person????? :shock:

And although it seems as though many people on this board aren't quite sure what ethics are or where to find them, there are also plenty of people on TLS who are very good people. :)


Pffft... I'm becoming a lawyer to bankrupt people and make then consider suicide at least once.

Danteshek
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby Danteshek » Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:45 pm

OP and his brother should reconsider law school. They are clearly unfit to practice law. I hope they try this and get caught.

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bilbobaggins
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby bilbobaggins » Tue Aug 10, 2010 9:52 pm

This is a horrible plan. Disregarding the ethical implications for a moment, you are also probably not eligible in your state if you are going to school full time. One of the simplest things for your state's EDD (or the equivalent) to do is look at who is enrolled in schools in the state and compare to the unemployment benefits database. I would guess that you could do it for a certain amount of time and not get caught, but the the punishment, if you are caught, is extremely severe and not worth the risk. Every form you send in that contains untrue information is a separate fraud count, which, if you are in CA, can result in up to 5 years in jail. Probably not worth the small amount of extra money. That and it's really not how you want to spend your time worrying during law school.

concurrent fork
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby concurrent fork » Tue Aug 10, 2010 10:21 pm

Why ask us? Your brother will have access to his new profs in a couple of days. He can go to office hours and kill two birds with one stone: (1) seek advice on this challenging scenario and (2) start building relationships for clerkship recommendations.

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T_Easy
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby T_Easy » Tue Aug 10, 2010 10:55 pm

Let me clear some things up:



I'm 110% against this plan, this is what my BROTHER, certainly not me, wants to do. He's always been one to try and game the system, but like all of you agree this is a terrible plan. I just read him all the replies you guys posted to see how dumb it would be to try this, thank you for your help.

He applied for the claim today, but tomorrow he's going straight to the labor department when they open to cancel it.

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cinefile 17
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby cinefile 17 » Tue Aug 10, 2010 10:58 pm

Then good thing you're the more sensible of the two of you :wink: :)

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California Babe
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby California Babe » Tue Aug 10, 2010 11:19 pm

T_Easy wrote:Let me clear some things up:



I'm 110% against this plan, this is what my BROTHER, certainly not me, wants to do. He's always been one to try and game the system, but like all of you agree this is a terrible plan. I just read him all the replies you guys posted to see how dumb it would be to try this, thank you for your help.

He applied for the claim today, but tomorrow he's going straight to the labor department when they open to cancel it.


Ah. Our mistake. Please let your "brother" ( :wink: ) know how happy we all are to have helped him decide not to defraud the government.

bogart
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby bogart » Wed Aug 11, 2010 9:52 am

I received unemployment throughout my 1L year and will continue to do so. If you don't take the money, then you're a sucka. As for ethics, while you worked you put money into the account, now you are taking that out so no biggie. This issue is small potatoes.

d34d9823
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby d34d9823 » Wed Aug 11, 2010 9:58 am

cinefile 17 wrote:I don't give a crap about the character and fitness test or any other kind of ethics test.

Why not be ethical for the sake of being a good person????? :shock:

And although it seems as though many people on this board aren't quite sure what ethics are or where to find them, there are also plenty of people on TLS who are very good people. :)

Would you like a saddle for that high horse?

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bilbobaggins
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby bilbobaggins » Wed Aug 11, 2010 10:01 am

bogart wrote:I received unemployment throughout my 1L year and will continue to do so. If you don't take the money, then you're a sucka. As for ethics, while you worked you put money into the account, now you are taking that out so no biggie. This issue is small potatoes.


I've helped defend people like you. Have fun when the other shoe drops.

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jennylynn
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby jennylynn » Wed Aug 11, 2010 10:56 am

:roll:
Threads like this make me realize why people hate lawyers.

d34d9823
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby d34d9823 » Wed Aug 11, 2010 11:12 am

jennylynn wrote::roll:
Threads like this make me realize why people hate lawyers.

Because lawyers are the only people who scheme to receive benefits they're not entitled to :roll:

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cinefile 17
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby cinefile 17 » Wed Aug 11, 2010 11:21 am

d34dluk3 wrote:
cinefile 17 wrote:I don't give a crap about the character and fitness test or any other kind of ethics test.

Why not be ethical for the sake of being a good person????? :shock:

And although it seems as though many people on this board aren't quite sure what ethics are or where to find them, there are also plenty of people on TLS who are very good people. :)

Would you like a saddle for that high horse?



It's actually a llama, and I prefer bareback :wink:

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kaydish21
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby kaydish21 » Wed Aug 11, 2010 11:24 am

d34dluk3 wrote:
jennylynn wrote::roll:
Threads like this make me realize why people hate lawyers.

Because lawyers are the only people who scheme to receive benefits they're not entitled to :roll:


This could be a motto for the way many consider welfare.

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TommyK
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby TommyK » Wed Aug 11, 2010 11:36 am

cinefile 17 wrote:Wow. There are people out there who can't afford their next meal and wont get help from the government + a national debt in the trillions and you, a law school student, want Bob Jones (hypothetical hard working father who supports a family of four on $30,000 a year) to take more money out of his paycheck so you can have some extra spending money. I'd /self if I ever asked such a shallow and selfish question.

I'm sorry for the harshness, but some of the questions on this board really make me wonder where people's ethics are.


Bob Jones making $30k a yr with a family of four pays no money into the federal tax system, and a miniscule amount in city and state taxes. In fact, he probably collects more money overall from tax refunds, than he pays in.

I wouldn't worry too much about Bob.... except that he has a crazy backasswards college.

sibley
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby sibley » Wed Aug 11, 2010 11:45 am

He could apply and look for work. Just get benefits for the week, and any retroactive benefits that your state allows. Then call and cancel. There's also a program where you can keep your unemployment benefits while you're in school, but I'm pretty sure you need to be on unemployment before you start school as the purpose of the program is to get people off of unemployment by making them more desirable to employers.

Possible retributions: Your brother's previous employer may appeal in which case he will have to meet with the judge and try to make his case. If he loses, your brother will have to pay the money back.

As for the ethics issue: possible but not always valid. Maybe the poster's brother has been out of work for 2 months because his company didn't have anything left for him to do and was too busy doing odd jobs to try to make ends meet to look into unemployment.

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rdcws000
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby rdcws000 » Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:46 pm

TommyK wrote:
cinefile 17 wrote:Wow. There are people out there who can't afford their next meal and wont get help from the government + a national debt in the trillions and you, a law school student, want Bob Jones (hypothetical hard working father who supports a family of four on $30,000 a year) to take more money out of his paycheck so you can have some extra spending money. I'd /self if I ever asked such a shallow and selfish question.

I'm sorry for the harshness, but some of the questions on this board really make me wonder where people's ethics are.


Bob Jones making $30k a yr with a family of four pays no money into the federal tax system, and a miniscule amount in city and state taxes. In fact, he probably collects more money overall from tax refunds, than he pays in.

I wouldn't worry too much about Bob.... except that he has a crazy backasswards college.


You're exactly right. Bob Jones is fine. John Smith however, makes 66,000 a year. His wife stays home to take care of their 2 kids because if she went to work the childcare would cost more than she brings home. John and his wife are taxed with the richest 25% of Americans, who provide over 86% of Federal Income. John will be forced to take loans out to pay for his children's education because with his income they will never qualify for anything need-based. The Smith family pays full admission to go to the Public Zoo, while the Jones family walks in for free with their Texas Lone-Star (low income) ID card. The good news is, John's hard earned cash is not going to waste because bogart gladly milked it out of the bloated government machine for a bi weekly paycheck while he went to law school. This is fair though, because before he went to law school he worked at Circuit City for 2 years and paid his share of taxes.

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paratactical
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Re: Applying for unemployment benefits right before 1L?

Postby paratactical » Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:55 pm

.
Last edited by paratactical on Wed Feb 13, 2013 10:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.




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