Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

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macaulian
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Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby macaulian » Mon Jul 05, 2010 6:09 pm

If one can get a hold of the books, is it a good idea to get started reading the textbooks over the summer?

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UFstudent
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby UFstudent » Mon Jul 05, 2010 6:10 pm

TLS forums overwhelming say no. Say the 0L won't understand, they will confuse you, waste your time.

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iagolives
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby iagolives » Mon Jul 05, 2010 6:14 pm

It's up to you, but as an upcoming 2L I wouldn't because 1) most people have a hard enough time fighting burn-out as it is without having spent an extra 3 months studying and 2) law school uses casebooks which are different that standard textbooks because they are mainly culled appellate court cases and, depending on the prof, can be read in very different ways. This is the thing about law school: it doesn't really matter knowing what the law is to do well. What matters is knowing what your professor thinks of the law and their approach to it which, unless your prof wrote the casebook (and even then, a person's ideas change) you won't get from a casebook. If I were you, I would just enjoy your last summer of freedom.

If you insist on getting started before the year, I would find your course title in the "Examples & Explanations" series (E&E is what they will be called in law school and on these boards). These are more standard-type textbooks which explain to you the law in paragraphs rather than insisting that you retrieve the info by osmosis like casebooks would have you do. Again, i wouldn't do this for the reasons above but, if you insist, this would be the way to go.

Good luck!

spondee
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby spondee » Mon Jul 05, 2010 6:15 pm

Don't try to read the casebooks over the summer. It'd be a huge waste of time. A typical casebook is 1500 pages long, but in class you'll read less than half of it - and from scattered sections throughout the book.

If you want to do 0L prep, which TLS generally advises against, I'd think you'd be much better off focusing on exam prep - things like Delaney's book, LEEWS, Getting to Maybe - and trying to understand what it means to "apply the law to the facts."

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steve_nash
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby steve_nash » Mon Jul 05, 2010 7:05 pm

no.

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Jarndyce
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby Jarndyce » Mon Jul 05, 2010 7:11 pm

I'll second (third, fourth, fifth...) the answer no.

I think that 0Ls should not do anything over summer. But I could see the merit of reading E&Es or something. Reading casebooks could not help you- I could actually see that hurting you. In any case, don't bother.

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mikeytwoshoes
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby mikeytwoshoes » Mon Jul 05, 2010 7:45 pm

0Ls=locusts

You can't kill the locust in yourself before law school. Just like every other locust, you need to spend a few months learning torts, contracts, and property (depending on your schools curriculum).

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Cavalier
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby Cavalier » Mon Jul 05, 2010 7:50 pm

Reading the casebooks would be even more idiotic than reading supplements. You shouldn't do either, of course, but if you've already decided that you're not going to listen because you know better than us law students, read a supplement instead of a casebook.

The only thing I would advise you to do is to spend an hour reading the "success in law school" threads on TLS. Fork: You can read Getting to Maybe if you want to as well, but it's not necessary. Anything beyond that will be a waste - just enjoy your summer.

macaulian
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby macaulian » Mon Jul 05, 2010 10:46 pm

What is the reasoning for why it would hurt? It seems like getting a handle on the cases beforehand would allow more time for briefing, analysis, and reading other things during the semester. Assume for a moment that the student doesn't find the casebooks boring...

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kalvano
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby kalvano » Mon Jul 05, 2010 10:52 pm

I would think you would be better served reading over the E&E's and getting a more broad overview of what you will be studying.

imchuckbass58
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby imchuckbass58 » Mon Jul 05, 2010 10:57 pm

macaulian wrote:What is the reasoning for why it would hurt? It seems like getting a handle on the cases beforehand would allow more time for briefing, analysis, and reading other things during the semester. Assume for a moment that the student doesn't find the casebooks boring...


The reasoning is if you read the E&Es (or casebooks) cold - without context, without direction, without actually knowing any law, you will focus on the wrong things. Not only will you not pick up very much, you will actually pick up stuff that is unhelpful, counterproductive, and distracting from what actually matters.

If you get a prof that teaches the subject differently from the E&E, and you just parrot back the E&E, not only will you waste time, you will likely actually get docked for focusing on stuff the professor thinks is irrelevant rather than what he taught (which may or may not be in the E&E). There's a reason they're called supplements, and that's because they are meant to reinforce and contextualize what you are actually taught by the professor and directed to read in the casebook.

macaulian
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby macaulian » Mon Jul 05, 2010 11:46 pm

imchuckbass58 wrote:
macaulian wrote:What is the reasoning for why it would hurt? It seems like getting a handle on the cases beforehand would allow more time for briefing, analysis, and reading other things during the semester. Assume for a moment that the student doesn't find the casebooks boring...


The reasoning is if you read the E&Es (or casebooks) cold - without context, without direction, without actually knowing any law, you will focus on the wrong things. Not only will you not pick up very much, you will actually pick up stuff that is unhelpful, counterproductive, and distracting from what actually matters.

If you get a prof that teaches the subject differently from the E&E, and you just parrot back the E&E, not only will you waste time, you will likely actually get docked for focusing on stuff the professor thinks is irrelevant rather than what he taught (which may or may not be in the E&E). There's a reason they're called supplements, and that's because they are meant to reinforce and contextualize what you are actually taught by the professor and directed to read in the casebook.


The question here is about casebooks, not E&E's, and ostensibly the professors choose the casebooks. What I find most confusing is the notion that reading the casebooks might harm the student. At some point, I have to read these cases. Am I really not to be trusted to do so unless within one week I have a professor show me the inevitable errors of my ways?

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iagolives
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby iagolives » Mon Jul 05, 2010 11:59 pm

macaulian wrote:
imchuckbass58 wrote:
macaulian wrote:What is the reasoning for why it would hurt? It seems like getting a handle on the cases beforehand would allow more time for briefing, analysis, and reading other things during the semester. Assume for a moment that the student doesn't find the casebooks boring...


The reasoning is if you read the E&Es (or casebooks) cold - without context, without direction, without actually knowing any law, you will focus on the wrong things. Not only will you not pick up very much, you will actually pick up stuff that is unhelpful, counterproductive, and distracting from what actually matters.

If you get a prof that teaches the subject differently from the E&E, and you just parrot back the E&E, not only will you waste time, you will likely actually get docked for focusing on stuff the professor thinks is irrelevant rather than what he taught (which may or may not be in the E&E). There's a reason they're called supplements, and that's because they are meant to reinforce and contextualize what you are actually taught by the professor and directed to read in the casebook.


The question here is about casebooks, not E&E's, and ostensibly the professors choose the casebooks. What I find most confusing is the notion that reading the casebooks might harm the student. At some point, I have to read these cases. Am I really not to be trusted to do so unless within one week I have a professor show me the inevitable errors of my ways?


I mean, you seem pretty intent on doing this and, if you really do enjoy it, go ahead but anecdotally, I have heard of people both in class and on exams getting torn down because "they are not thinking about the cases correctly." And correctly is according to their own pet method of interpreting the law (Critical Legal Studies, Law and Econ, etc.) I would hate for you to read the casebooks, all the notes, think you know what's going on and then the prof pulls the rug out from uder you b/c, while she likes the cases, she reads them completely different than the casebook author does.

I really can't emphasize this enough. Besides the Universal Commerical Code and similar documents (and even then), law is not about a code to follow and deducing what the law is. It's all about what your professor interprets it to be. Its very risky to have original thoughts 1L year b/c in the end, they hold all the cards. I guess that's all I'm saying.

imchuckbass58
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby imchuckbass58 » Tue Jul 06, 2010 7:53 am

iagolives wrote:
macaulian wrote:The question here is about casebooks, not E&E's, and ostensibly the professors choose the casebooks. What I find most confusing is the notion that reading the casebooks might harm the student. At some point, I have to read these cases. Am I really not to be trusted to do so unless within one week I have a professor show me the inevitable errors of my ways?


I mean, you seem pretty intent on doing this and, if you really do enjoy it, go ahead but anecdotally, I have heard of people both in class and on exams getting torn down because "they are not thinking about the cases correctly." And correctly is according to their own pet method of interpreting the law (Critical Legal Studies, Law and Econ, etc.) I would hate for you to read the casebooks, all the notes, think you know what's going on and then the prof pulls the rug out from uder you b/c, while she likes the cases, she reads them completely different than the casebook author does.

I really can't emphasize this enough. Besides the Universal Commerical Code and similar documents (and even then), law is not about a code to follow and deducing what the law is. It's all about what your professor interprets it to be. Its very risky to have original thoughts 1L year b/c in the end, they hold all the cards. I guess that's all I'm saying.


This is exactly right. Plus, keep in mind you may not read half the casebook in some/most classes.

pehaigllleises
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby pehaigllleises » Tue Jul 06, 2010 10:36 am

If you really want something to do, go read Getting to Maybe. If you want something else to do, maybe read the FRCP through once or twice, so long as you do so at the pool with a margarita in hand. Seriously, relax. A lot of people do no prep whatsoever and do well. Your biggest enemy is burn out.

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romothesavior
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby romothesavior » Tue Jul 06, 2010 10:37 am

mikeytwoshoes wrote:0Ls=locusts

You can't kill the locust in yourself before law school. Just like every other locust, you need to spend a few months learning torts, contracts, and property (depending on your schools curriculum).


Enlightening...

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mallard
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby mallard » Tue Jul 06, 2010 10:38 am

LOL. Nobody should even read the casebook during law school and you want to read it this summer? Holy fucking hell.

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Bosque
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby Bosque » Tue Jul 06, 2010 3:48 pm

iagolives wrote:Besides the Universal Commerical Code and similar documents (and even then), law is not about a code to follow and deducing what the law is. It's all about what your professor interprets it to be.


Don't multiply 45 by 2 to get 90!

Prez knows what I am saying.


mallard wrote:LOL. Nobody should even read the casebook during law school and you want to read it this summer? Holy fucking hell.


Also, THIS.

Renzo
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby Renzo » Tue Jul 06, 2010 8:04 pm

There are no textbooks in law school. There are casebooks, hornbooks, and supplements.

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dbt
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby dbt » Tue Jul 06, 2010 8:05 pm

E&E if you're really that dead-set on reading something to feel better.

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prezidentv8
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby prezidentv8 » Tue Jul 06, 2010 8:06 pm

Chill out broski. There's plenty of time for studying and working in your future.

Have a beer.

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UFstudent
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby UFstudent » Tue Jul 06, 2010 8:07 pm

Renzo wrote:There are no textbooks in law school. There are casebooks, hornbooks, and supplements.


ahhhh :lol:

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traehekat
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby traehekat » Tue Jul 06, 2010 8:13 pm

Even I, a proponent of 0L prep, thinks this is silly. You will have no idea what to take from the cases you read, or even which cases you will actually be going over in class. Plus, have you ever actually READ a casebook? I took a Constitutional Law class in undergrad which had a casebook and it was pretty painful. I stopped reading after a couple weeks.

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chicagolaw2013
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby chicagolaw2013 » Tue Jul 06, 2010 9:44 pm

I just clicked on this to see OP get ripped a new one.

Satisfied.

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romothesavior
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Re: Reading the textbooks 0L summer...

Postby romothesavior » Wed Jul 07, 2010 12:07 am

Wait, what? OP, you haven't started reading the casebook yet?

You're fucked. I already read all of Con Law and Torts and outlined every case. You are way behind.




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