What could this guy be charged with?

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badfish
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby badfish » Sun May 30, 2010 7:47 pm

mistergoft wrote:
Cavalier wrote:Felony murder might be a possibility depending on the jurisdiction, if I recall crim correctly.

I doubt stealing qualifies as in inherently dangerous felony.


doesn't have to be inherently dangerous. it can be dangerous as applied (of course this all depends on the j/x). in this circumstance a prosecutor could argue that stealing from a 91 year old is a dangerous as applied felony (assuming the stealing is a felony -- which i'm pretty sure it isn't so this whole thing might be moot anyways). sort of a stretch and i doubt any reasonable jury would actually convict the guy, but it is a colorable argument.

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thesealocust
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby thesealocust » Sun May 30, 2010 7:50 pm

tl;dr
Last edited by thesealocust on Sun Jun 27, 2010 11:13 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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badfish
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby badfish » Sun May 30, 2010 7:50 pm

thesealocust wrote:
badfish wrote:
mistergoft wrote:
Cavalier wrote:Felony murder might be a possibility depending on the jurisdiction, if I recall crim correctly.

I doubt stealing qualifies as in inherently dangerous felony.


doesn't have to be inherently dangerous. it can be dangerous as applied. in this circumstance a prosecutor could argue that stealing from a 91 year old is a dangerous as applied felony. sort of a stretch and i doubt any reasonable jury would actually convict the guy, but it is a colorable argument.


This all depends on jurisdiction (which is secret code for: this all depends on how your professor taught the FMR). As I understand it, only a tiny minority of jurisdictions will allow an 'as applied' inherently dangerous application of the FMR.


ya i edited to include that.

alas, i was too slow. :D

06132010
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby 06132010 » Sun May 30, 2010 8:00 pm

thesealocust wrote:
TheBigMediocre wrote:
Esc wrote: But as a 0L you really shouldn't be worried about this stuff. If you really want to gun go read the Glannon CivPro E&E, and then chillax.


Oh I wasn't too worried, just curious after reading the news story and also I wanted to generate a little discussion. Which succeeded! And I'm also reading the E&Es :oops:


I think I might start putting every 0L who is reading E&Es on my ignore list, it would save a lot of my sanity over the summer.

For the record (now that I know your situation, I grant myself permission to speak freely) your completely retarded legal analysis at the beginning of the thread, which consisted of throwing around terms that you clearly didn't understand, is the perfect example of why 0L prep both fails as prep and breeds insufferable douchetrucks. May God have mercy on your soul and/or those who have to put up with you in law school.


this.

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98234872348
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby 98234872348 » Sun May 30, 2010 8:18 pm

badfish wrote:
mistergoft wrote:
Cavalier wrote:Felony murder might be a possibility depending on the jurisdiction, if I recall crim correctly.

I doubt stealing qualifies as in inherently dangerous felony.


doesn't have to be inherently dangerous. it can be dangerous as applied (of course this all depends on the j/x). in this circumstance a prosecutor could argue that stealing from a 91 year old is a dangerous as applied felony (assuming the stealing is a felony -- which i'm pretty sure it isn't so this whole thing might be moot anyways). sort of a stretch and i doubt any reasonable jury would actually convict the guy, but it is a colorable argument.


I was making a general statement, which encompassed both the "as applied" jurisdictions and the "objectively dangerous" standard, which, I believe, is more pervasive (maybe?). In any event, I don't think a) that there could be established, concretely, that the guy who stole knew of the person's age, so, if anything it would be "stealing from an old person is dangerous as applied" (which I don't believe would garner support) and b) that the manner in which the felony was committed was actually dangerous. Now, maybe if he had thrown the person on the ground or something he might be convicted, but, simple larceny, without more, likely would not be construed as inherently dangerous regardless of the standard employed by the jurisdiction. Although, I would certainly make the argument if I was trying to convict the guy.

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apper123
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby apper123 » Mon May 31, 2010 5:12 am

villain in OP will be charged with being a douche in the 2nd degree

end of thread

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mbw
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby mbw » Mon May 31, 2010 7:48 am

CanadianWolf wrote:Misdemeanor level theft crimes against a person above the age of 65 can be reclassified as a felony offense if at least $300 in value in the state of Florida according to a Goggle search.
But what if this was a casino on tribal land? Tribal law would probably control.


Wrong - only if both parties are NDNs. Tribes only have jurisdiction over NDNs and non-major crimes. If this is covered under the Major Crimes Act, then it's definitely a federal issue. If it's not considered a major crime, and if Florida tribes follow PL280, then state police have jurisdiction.

/FIL lecture

Edited to add: Florida tribes apparently do not follow PL280, so if the ticket is over $1000 and the perpetrator is NDN, then it's covered under the Major Crimes Act. If the perpetrator is non-NDN, regardless of the amount, then it would be covered under the General Crimes Act. Both acts allow for felony-murder prosecutions.
Last edited by mbw on Mon May 31, 2010 10:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

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profs<3mycomments
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby profs<3mycomments » Mon May 31, 2010 9:31 am

See king, but see stamp.

awesomepossum
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby awesomepossum » Mon May 31, 2010 9:35 am

misdemeanor - manslaughter? (the smaller, less popular brother of felony - murder)

Bankhead
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby Bankhead » Mon May 31, 2010 12:34 pm

Battery > eggshell plaintiff (assuming the ticket was on 91 yr old's person).

px/c would be a huge issue, as mentioned.

solidsnake
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby solidsnake » Mon May 31, 2010 7:31 pm

Did anyone mention conversion as a c/a for the OldMan's estate to get the ticket back (winnings, etc)? Won't have any causation problems there (as with the battery >direct damages tack -- besides, he's 91 yrs old anyway, probably long retired and no wages to lose; probably no loss of consortium either because he prob couldn't get it up at that point), assuming jury believes guy intended to "swipe" the ticket from OldMan's hand, which shouldn't be hard to infer given tortfeasor first "overhearing" and then acting immediately thereafter.

GZL
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby GZL » Mon May 31, 2010 9:25 pm

I think Esc has this one right. Heart attack is a foreseeable consequence of the robbery. The chase doesn't change the analysis too much: a) it's foreseeable that such a chase would happen, b) even if it's an intervening cause, it's a dependent intervening cause.

Also, if the case is made for robbery, robbery is an enumerated felony in most f/m statutes, and it can be argued that it's inherently dangerous in any case. The value of the personal property is irrelevant if you go after robbery here and not simple larceny.

helfer snooterbagon
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Re: What could this guy be charged with?

Postby helfer snooterbagon » Tue Jun 01, 2010 7:49 am

It's pronounced "thermometer."




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