What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

(Study Tips, Dealing With Stress, Maintaining a Social Life, Financial Aid, Internships, Bar Exam, Careers in Law . . . )
thewuzzles
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 8:47 pm

What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby thewuzzles » Sun May 23, 2010 8:59 pm

bar app?

If one answered all questions honestly on his/her law school app, what might be an issue later?

If one has quit many jobs within a short period, would that be a disqualifier? If one or two of those quits was a, "Hey, I don't need this! Sayonara, suckas!", would that be a DQ'ing factor? Can one be DQ'ed for having been a bit less than gracious upon exiting a position?

So, beyond the above concerns, what (beyond criminal/academic misconduct) might DQ an applicant to the bar?
Last edited by thewuzzles on Sun May 23, 2010 9:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.

blue5385
Posts: 895
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2009 3:23 am

Re: What Will DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby blue5385 » Sun May 23, 2010 9:05 pm

1) Standards vary from state to state, but you would probably need to have committed a serious felony to be dinged, provided you disclose everything in full & your out-of-control, felony-committing days are behind you. Also, one random thing that has caused someone to be DQ'ed in the past is excessive student debt.

2) I would be shocked if someone were to be dinged for only this.
Last edited by blue5385 on Sun May 23, 2010 9:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

thewuzzles
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 8:47 pm

Re: What Will DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby thewuzzles » Sun May 23, 2010 9:10 pm

blue5385 wrote:1) Standards vary from state to state, but you would probably need to have committed a serious felony to be dinged, provided you disclose everything in full & your out-of-control, felony-committing days are behind you. Also, one random thing that has caused someone to be DQ'ed in the past is excessive student debt.

2) I would be shocked if someone were to be dinged for only this.


Yeah, I think you're probably right. I guess being a whiney quitter (and maybe a bit of a bad ass with a punk rock spirit that just won't be crushed :wink: ) shouldn't DQ someone, but it was worth asking.

Regarding excessive student debt, what are we talking about here? Wouldn't it be ironic if one dropped 200K to attend a law school, only to find that one's law school debt might prohibit him/her from using the earned degree? Ouch. I'm guessing we're talking 300K-ish debt and a history of non payment?

blue5385
Posts: 895
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2009 3:23 am

Re: What Will DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby blue5385 » Sun May 23, 2010 9:15 pm

thewuzzles wrote:
blue5385 wrote:1) Standards vary from state to state, but you would probably need to have committed a serious felony to be dinged, provided you disclose everything in full & your out-of-control, felony-committing days are behind you. Also, one random thing that has caused someone to be DQ'ed in the past is excessive student debt.

2) I would be shocked if someone were to be dinged for only this.


Yeah, I think you're probably right. I guess being a whiney quitter (and maybe a bit of a bad ass with a punk rock spirit that just won't be crushed :wink: ) shouldn't DQ someone, but it was worth asking.

Regarding excessive student debt, what are we talking about here? Wouldn't it be ironic if one dropped 200K to attend a law school, only to find that one's law school debt might prohibit him/her from using the earned degree? Ouch. I'm guessing we're talking 300K-ish debt and a history of non payment?


I don't remember the exact amount, but I think the guy had over 400k in student debt, and I'm not sure if he defaulted or had a history of non-payment.

thewuzzles
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 8:47 pm

Re: What Will DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby thewuzzles » Sun May 23, 2010 9:17 pm

blue5385 wrote:
thewuzzles wrote:
blue5385 wrote:1) Standards vary from state to state, but you would probably need to have committed a serious felony to be dinged, provided you disclose everything in full & your out-of-control, felony-committing days are behind you. Also, one random thing that has caused someone to be DQ'ed in the past is excessive student debt.

2) I would be shocked if someone were to be dinged for only this.


Yeah, I think you're probably right. I guess being a whiney quitter (and maybe a bit of a bad ass with a punk rock spirit that just won't be crushed :wink: ) shouldn't DQ someone, but it was worth asking.

Regarding excessive student debt, what are we talking about here? Wouldn't it be ironic if one dropped 200K to attend a law school, only to find that one's law school debt might prohibit him/her from using the earned degree? Ouch. I'm guessing we're talking 300K-ish debt and a history of non payment?


I don't remember the exact amount, but I think the guy had over 400k in student debt, and I'm not sure if he defaulted or had a history of non-payment.


How could lenders continue to extend someone credit beyond 230-ish K. Good dog. He should sue his lenders. Or, maybe not.

ToTransferOrNot
Posts: 1928
Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:45 am

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Sun May 23, 2010 11:22 pm

The guy had ~$230k of debt. It took him a few tries to pass the bar, during which time he wasn't able to make payments (nor would anyone else). The loan company dicked him around re: deferment. Then, the loan company shipped the debt off to a collection agency, which tacked nearly $200k worth of penalties on. Then, the New York bar, once the guy finally managed to pass the bar exam, dinged him because he had too much in debt.

It is an absolutely fucking ridiculous case. The guy even has something approaching a biglaw job lined up, for whenever he gets a license. You're essentially talking about debtor's prison here.

If I remember, the guy's last name is Bowman.

thewuzzles
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 8:47 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby thewuzzles » Sun May 23, 2010 11:24 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:The guy had ~$230k of debt. It took him a few tries to pass the bar, during which time he wasn't able to make payments (nor would anyone else). The loan company dicked him around re: deferment. Then, the loan company shipped the debt off to a collection agency, which tacked nearly $200k worth of penalties on. Then, the New York bar, once the guy finally managed to pass the bar exam, dinged him because he had too much in debt.

It is an absolutely fucking ridiculous case. The guy even has something approaching a biglaw job lined up, for whenever he gets a license. You're essentially talking about debtor's prison here.

If I remember, the guy's last name is Bowman.


That's when you apply for Australian citizenship and shirk all US debt forever. Or, if that doesn't work, apply for debtor's amnesty in Venezuela.

blue5385
Posts: 895
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2009 3:23 am

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby blue5385 » Mon May 24, 2010 10:32 am

ToTransferOrNot wrote:The guy had ~$230k of debt. It took him a few tries to pass the bar, during which time he wasn't able to make payments (nor would anyone else). The loan company dicked him around re: deferment. Then, the loan company shipped the debt off to a collection agency, which tacked nearly $200k worth of penalties on. Then, the New York bar, once the guy finally managed to pass the bar exam, dinged him because he had too much in debt.

It is an absolutely fucking ridiculous case. The guy even has something approaching a biglaw job lined up, for whenever he gets a license. You're essentially talking about debtor's prison here.

If I remember, the guy's last name is Bowman.


Wow, I was way off on the 400k amount. The story is actually a lot more unfair/ridiculous than I remember it.

FeuerFrei
Posts: 196
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 10:32 am

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby FeuerFrei » Mon May 24, 2010 11:01 am

.
Last edited by FeuerFrei on Fri Feb 04, 2011 2:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

BobSacamano
Posts: 224
Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2009 7:51 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby BobSacamano » Mon May 24, 2010 11:27 am

ToTransferOrNot wrote:The guy had ~$230k of debt. It took him a few tries to pass the bar, during which time he wasn't able to make payments (nor would anyone else). The loan company dicked him around re: deferment. Then, the loan company shipped the debt off to a collection agency, which tacked nearly $200k worth of penalties on. Then, the New York bar, once the guy finally managed to pass the bar exam, dinged him because he had too much in debt.

It is an absolutely fucking ridiculous case. The guy even has something approaching a biglaw job lined up, for whenever he gets a license. You're essentially talking about debtor's prison here.

If I remember, the guy's last name is Bowman.

Didn't he claim undue hardship to defer his payments several times (for 10 years, I believe) because of some super shady "accidents?" Maybe I'm not remembering correctly, but I remember a jet ski involved.

Hey, found the article. Maybe I was off about the shadiness of the accidents, but a jet ski was involved!
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/02/busin ... ml?_r=2&hp

thewuzzles
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 8:47 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby thewuzzles » Mon May 24, 2010 12:19 pm

FeuerFrei wrote:This thread makes me want Dairy Queen


It's interesting you should say that because in West Virginia, one who has been denied admission to the bar or had his/her license suspended can only reapply after having worked at a Dairy Queen for a year. That's why one is said to have been "DQ'ed" upon suspension or denial of admission. True story, bro.

User avatar
mikeytwoshoes
Posts: 1117
Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:45 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby mikeytwoshoes » Mon May 24, 2010 12:49 pm

FeuerFrei wrote:This thread makes me want Dairy Queen

163.14

User avatar
mikeytwoshoes
Posts: 1117
Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:45 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby mikeytwoshoes » Mon May 24, 2010 12:51 pm

thewuzzles wrote:
FeuerFrei wrote:This thread makes me want Dairy Queen


It's interesting you should say that because in West Virginia, one who has been denied admission to the bar or had his/her license suspended can only reapply after having worked at a Dairy Queen for a year. That's why one is said to have been "DQ'ed" upon suspension or denial of admission. True story, bro.

158

ScaredWorkedBored
Posts: 409
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 12:39 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby ScaredWorkedBored » Mon May 24, 2010 2:17 pm

Assuming full honesty?

-- In five states including Texas, a felony conviction in certain circumstances. Most states view this negatively but you can overcome it by showing rehabilitation & good character.

-- Severe mental illness that impacts ability to function reliably.

-- Major substance abuse issue.

-- The aforementioned case where the guy had run up hundreds of thousands of bad-faith debt. This is fraudulent & dishonest - not good lawyer traits.

-- Any financial fraud crime or similar is probably going to be real dicey considering this is the #1 way attorneys get disbarred.

-- Recent serious criminal conduct of any type. You can get sanctioned or disbarred for this if you do it as a lawyer, after all.

miamiman
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2009 8:55 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby miamiman » Mon May 24, 2010 2:23 pm

how about things that are just uncouth --- ie a prior life as a stripper/escort?

User avatar
mikeytwoshoes
Posts: 1117
Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:45 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby mikeytwoshoes » Mon May 24, 2010 2:46 pm

miamiman wrote:how about things that are just uncouth --- ie a prior life as a stripper/escort?

Did you disclose?

miamiman
Posts: 1486
Joined: Mon Mar 02, 2009 8:55 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby miamiman » Mon May 24, 2010 4:02 pm

mikeytwoshoes wrote:
miamiman wrote:how about things that are just uncouth --- ie a prior life as a stripper/escort?

Did you disclose?




nope. chancing it.

User avatar
mmmadeli
Posts: 88
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 6:54 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby mmmadeli » Tue May 25, 2010 7:38 pm

.
Last edited by mmmadeli on Mon Nov 22, 2010 1:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
mikeytwoshoes
Posts: 1117
Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:45 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby mikeytwoshoes » Wed May 26, 2010 2:25 am

miamiman wrote:
mikeytwoshoes wrote:
miamiman wrote:how about things that are just uncouth --- ie a prior life as a stripper/escort?

Did you disclose?




nope. chancing it.

You're boned and not just in your prior life.

User avatar
AngryAvocado
Posts: 776
Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:22 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby AngryAvocado » Wed May 26, 2010 2:32 am

miamiman wrote:
mikeytwoshoes wrote:
miamiman wrote:how about things that are just uncouth --- ie a prior life as a stripper/escort?

Did you disclose?




nope. chancing it.


:lol: Well played.

User avatar
Kilpatrick
Posts: 1073
Joined: Sun Dec 06, 2009 2:06 am

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby Kilpatrick » Wed May 26, 2010 2:34 am

In Illinois you can't be a Nazi.

User avatar
mikeytwoshoes
Posts: 1117
Joined: Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:45 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby mikeytwoshoes » Wed May 26, 2010 8:39 pm

--ImageRemoved--

Foosters Galore
Posts: 305
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:15 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby Foosters Galore » Wed May 26, 2010 8:48 pm

mmmadeli wrote:I've wondered something similar to this as well -- one of my closest friends in college was charged with a federal felony while we were in school (a computer crimes thing, sort of in the stupid-teenager-shit camp). He eventually plead it down to a misdemeanor by working as an undercover cooperating informant for the FBI for about eighteen months, but he was sentenced and charged and served some time on house arrest and briefly in prison our senior year. The reason I wonder if this is an issue for me is that senior year we were roommates, which means we were on a lease together, and it was a reasonably well-publicized case (though it was more well-publicized in Pennsylvania, where it happened, and not in California where I'll be going to school. But should I worry about the association? He is now a law-abiding citizen, and he was NOT convicted of a felony. And I myself am squeaky-clean.


122.

User avatar
mmmadeli
Posts: 88
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 6:54 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby mmmadeli » Thu May 27, 2010 12:05 am

Foosters Galore wrote:
mmmadeli wrote:I've wondered something similar to this as well -- one of my closest friends in college was charged with a federal felony while we were in school (a computer crimes thing, sort of in the stupid-teenager-shit camp). He eventually plead it down to a misdemeanor by working as an undercover cooperating informant for the FBI for about eighteen months, but he was sentenced and charged and served some time on house arrest and briefly in prison our senior year. The reason I wonder if this is an issue for me is that senior year we were roommates, which means we were on a lease together, and it was a reasonably well-publicized case (though it was more well-publicized in Pennsylvania, where it happened, and not in California where I'll be going to school. But should I worry about the association? He is now a law-abiding citizen, and he was NOT convicted of a felony. And I myself am squeaky-clean.


122.


Well it is true. :p

dslslave
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2009 3:57 pm

Re: What Might DQ One On The Character & Fitness Portion Of The

Postby dslslave » Thu May 27, 2010 7:34 pm

Question:

If you didn't initially report a judicial affairs undergrad incident on your law school app, but you later submitted an addendum to your law school app with that info, and reported it on your bar app, would the bar get upset or care?

A classmate was just asked to explain the inconsistencies. The judicial affairs thing was just a written reprimand, and wasn't anything serious.




Return to “Forum for Law School Students”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests