HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

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johnstorey
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HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby johnstorey » Fri Mar 12, 2010 11:28 am

So Civ Pro I was easy, or at least I knew what I was doing. Big overarching principles: PJ, SMJ, etc...

This semester is different. Its all rules. Just little rules constantly being thrown at me with little rhyme or reason behind them. We are studying the FRCP and my state's rules of civil procedure.

Question: How does one go about studying and preparing to take a test over this material? We are allowed to bring in the FRCP and my state's RCP. What does a test on this material look like?

270910
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby 270910 » Fri Mar 12, 2010 11:29 am

Glannon E&E HTH

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patrickd139
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby patrickd139 » Fri Mar 12, 2010 11:53 am

disco_barred wrote:Glannon E&E HTH


E&E is good for overarching doctrinal stuff, but not nearly as good for rules. The link below is to a practice commentary for the FRCP. Don't buy it (it's updated every year, and major changes are coming this year, so it'll be worthless soon), but I would put money on your library having a copy. It's concise, broken down by rule and tells you everything you need to know.

1) Check out the "Practice Commentary" (Vol. II, not Vol. I)
2) Read, outline
3) ???
4) Profit.

http://www.amazon.com/Federal-Rules-Civil-Procedure-Commentary/dp/B002F55QLG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1268408836&sr=8-1-spell

(This message brought to you by a top 5% student who got an A in rules-based Civ Pro I.)

pandacot
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby pandacot » Fri Mar 12, 2010 2:27 pm

Isn't there a way to access the practice commentary on Westlaw? I may be confusing with something else, but I thought I've seen it mentioned.

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A'nold
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby A'nold » Fri Mar 12, 2010 2:29 pm

Try doing this part of Civ Pro 1st semester and not being able to take the FRCP into the exam.

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AlasLavinia
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby AlasLavinia » Fri Mar 12, 2010 3:27 pm

pandacot wrote:Isn't there a way to access the practice commentary on Westlaw? I may be confusing with something else, but I thought I've seen it mentioned.

This.

I figured out about half way through the semester that doing practice problems with the rules was key. Also, there are only so many areas where the rules create ambiguity and room for testing. To take that one step further, there are only so many ways each question can be asked. Just do as many short-answer questions as you can get your hands on. When you run out, make up your own variations on the ones you have been doing. Try to alter the questions so the result comes out differently.

CALI helps. E&E's helps. Studying with someone else or a group, not so much. You are walking toward a landmine field made of confusion. The more you learn about the rules, the more complexity you see. My $.02.

awesomepossum
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby awesomepossum » Fri Mar 12, 2010 3:35 pm

Image

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patrickd139
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby patrickd139 » Fri Mar 12, 2010 5:15 pm

AlasLavinia wrote:
pandacot wrote:Isn't there a way to access the practice commentary on Westlaw? I may be confusing with something else, but I thought I've seen it mentioned.

This.

I figured out about half way through the semester that doing practice problems with the rules was key. Also, there are only so many areas where the rules create ambiguity and room for testing. To take that one step further, there are only so many ways each question can be asked. Just do as many short-answer questions as you can get your hands on. When you run out, make up your own variations on the ones you have been doing. Try to alter the questions so the result comes out differently.

CALI helps. E&E's helps. Studying with someone else or a group, not so much. You are walking toward a landmine field made of confusion. The more you learn about the rules, the more complexity you see. My $.02.


Practice commentary ≠ Practice problems. HTH.

As for accessing it on Westlaw, you might be able to. I haven't checked.

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AlasLavinia
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby AlasLavinia » Fri Mar 12, 2010 10:21 pm

^ oh, man. Sorry about that. I was posting from a new window and typing the code in myself. I refreshed to an older version while I was working.

A'nold wrote:Try doing this part of Civ Pro 1st semester and not being able to take the FRCP into the exam.


THAT was what I meant to quote.

johnstorey
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby johnstorey » Sat Mar 13, 2010 12:43 am

AlasLavinia wrote:
pandacot wrote:Isn't there a way to access the practice commentary on Westlaw? I may be confusing with something else, but I thought I've seen it mentioned.

This.

I figured out about half way through the semester that doing practice problems with the rules was key. Also, there are only so many areas where the rules create ambiguity and room for testing. To take that one step further, there are only so many ways each question can be asked. Just do as many short-answer questions as you can get your hands on. When you run out, make up your own variations on the ones you have been doing. Try to alter the questions so the result comes out differently.

CALI helps. E&E's helps. Studying with someone else or a group, not so much. You are walking toward a landmine field made of confusion. The more you learn about the rules, the more complexity you see. My $.02.



Where else can I get practice problems from? CALI and E&E don't have much. Glannon's guide might be better, but any other suggestions?
Last edited by johnstorey on Mon Mar 15, 2010 9:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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mikeytwoshoes
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby mikeytwoshoes » Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:32 pm

johnstorey wrote:So Civ Pro I was easy, or at least I knew what I was doing. Big overarching principles: PJ, SMJ, etc...

This semester is different. Its all rules. Just little rules constantly being thrown at me with little rhyme or reason behind them. We are studying the FRCP and my state's rules of civil procedure.

Question: How does one go about studying and preparing to take a test over this material? We are allowed to bring in the FRCP and my state's RCP. What does a test on this material look like?

Buy this book http://www.amazon.com/Students-Federal- ... pd_sim_b_2, chew slowly, rinse, repeat, profit.

BobSacamano
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby BobSacamano » Sun Mar 14, 2010 9:37 pm

mikeytwoshoes wrote:Buy this book http://www.amazon.com/Students-Federal- ... pd_sim_b_2, chew slowly, rinse, repeat, profit.

I'm basically in the same boat as the OP: found Civ Pro to be pretty easy first semester, but this semester seems like a total mess. I think my professor doesn't help matters either, but that's a different story. Anyways, CALI and the E&E are pretty weak on Rules stuff, but I do totally recommend this book. It has a nice breakdown of every rule and what all those annoying little nebulous phrases mean. Plus it has citations galore!

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mikeytwoshoes
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Re: HELP! - CIV PRO 2nd semester is complicated

Postby mikeytwoshoes » Sun Mar 14, 2010 11:14 pm

^what he said.

For instance, this book has a breakdown of rule 13 g:

Core concept

Rule 13(g) allows persons who are already part of the same suit to file claims against other persons on the same side of the litigation. An essential difference between a cross-claim and a counterclaim is that cross-claims are suits against persons who had not, until the cross claim was filed, been opponents of the person asserting the cross-claim. Counterclaims, by contrast, are suits against persons who have already sued the person asserting the counterclaim.

Applications

Procedure

Cross-claims are typically raised in responsive pleadings.

Cross-claims are always permissive.

Unlike permissive counterclaims under 13(a), Rule 13(g) does not create a catigory of compulsory cross-claims.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
It then discusses the Rule in greater depth. Buy this book.




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