Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

(housing, friendships, future exams, all things 2014)
SubwayatNight
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby SubwayatNight » Sat Jul 23, 2011 11:34 am

Hey everyone! I just signed a lease on Warren Street, a block from the fitness center and law building, and I'm looking for a roommate. The rent is $1,100 and it's a 2-bedroom. It's a pretty long apartment and the bedrooms are on opposite sides so there should be a decent amount of quiet privacy. If anyone is interested give me a call at 234.201.4915 or email me at [url]davesisk@gmail.com[/url]. (I would prefer to room with another law student).

P.S. I'm also getting more serious about starting a Rutgers Law fantasy football league now that it looks like the lockout will end. I only have one person that contacted me so far but I hope more might be interested now.

SubwayatNight
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby SubwayatNight » Sat Jul 23, 2011 11:52 am

Does anybody have any advice or personal experiences to share about work study programs? I was offered $4,000 per year but after talking with the financial aid adviser I wonder if it's a good idea.

One point she made is that it would be somewhat impractical to get the full amount because it would require working a lot in addition to our large amount of studying, especially for the first year. So really I would be looking at about half the amount. And because between $6,000 and $12,000 over three years would be a relative drop in the bucket to my full debt she suggested that if I did the program it would be mainly for the experience rather than keeping the debt down. The other factor is this $4,000 would be drawn against federal loans I would be eligible to receive.

I suppose my question boils down to whether or not the work experience and additional reference would be worth it when the time comes to search for jobs. This is also assuming the work study job would be law school related. In my case I already feel I have a lot of experience and good references from working three years in the Ohio legislature but I wonder if this might still be good to have, especially if it involves working with a law professor doing research or something. Another consideration is if we decline the work study offer the first year then we can't get it for the second or third year.

areyouinsane
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby areyouinsane » Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:09 pm

I suppose my question boils down to whether or not the work experience and additional reference would be worth it when the time comes to search for jobs.


God help me, this thread can't be serious? It's some kind of joke, right?

RUTGERS-NEWARK? I guess it's great unless you actually expect to find PAYING jobs/work as a lawyer:

http://www.law.com/jsp/nj/PubArticleNJ. ... hbxlogin=1

and

http://blogs.findlaw.com/strategist/200 ... teers.html

and

http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/loc ... 20454.html

and

http://articles.philly.com/2010-08-14/n ... ewer-cases

Furthermore, you want to spend 3 years in a filthy, dangerous ghetto like Newark? Murders & violent crime are way, way up this year:

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/0 ... rcent.html


Hilarious! Hope you guys make it out alive, although once you're shopping that TTT "degree" around you'll prolly wish you were dead.

get it to x
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby get it to x » Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:58 pm

areyouinsane wrote:
I suppose my question boils down to whether or not the work experience and additional reference would be worth it when the time comes to search for jobs.


God help me, this thread can't be serious? It's some kind of joke, right?

RUTGERS-NEWARK? I guess it's great unless you actually expect to find PAYING jobs/work as a lawyer:

http://www.law.com/jsp/nj/PubArticleNJ. ... hbxlogin=1

and

http://blogs.findlaw.com/strategist/200 ... teers.html

and

http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/loc ... 20454.html

and

http://articles.philly.com/2010-08-14/n ... ewer-cases

Furthermore, you want to spend 3 years in a filthy, dangerous ghetto like Newark? Murders & violent crime are way, way up this year:

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/0 ... rcent.html


Hilarious! Hope you guys make it out alive, although once you're shopping that TTT "degree" around you'll prolly wish you were dead.



Whoa...another trash job of RU-Newark? Could you at least spread the love to Hofstra, St. Johns, Brooklyn, Cardozo, and Fordham students (at the bottom of their class) because they've got to deal with the same job market realities? Also, 3/5 articles you posted relate to Rutgers-Camden . . . not Newark. I'm a current student I know what an RU degree can and cannot do and any prospective student should know the same, but the constant trash job of the school as some sort of death trap is unwarranted.

Zazelmaf
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby Zazelmaf » Sat Jul 23, 2011 1:05 pm

Why so much negativity? I am on the wait list for transferring here, and have heard good things about it.

areyouinsane
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby areyouinsane » Sat Jul 23, 2011 1:15 pm

I'm a current student I know what an RU degree can and cannot do and any prospective student should know the same, but the constant trash job of the school as some sort of death trap is unwarranted.


Dood the NJ "market" is decimated. State AG's paying 0 dollars. Now US attorney's office paying 0 dollars. McCarter no longer has a summer program. Per a recent NY times article on lawyer saturation, NJ was #3 in the nation for surplus lawyers.

I guess you're excited at your future career as a ""volunteer," eh?

Here's a great entry-level gig you guys might want to apply to:

--LinkRemoved--

$19 an hour kinda sucks, but they are willing to cough up a whopping 10% of your health insurance!

ROTFL!

MrAnon
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby MrAnon » Sat Jul 23, 2011 1:20 pm

I for one am curious, what can the RU degree do? What are you doing with it? have you locked up employment?

get it to x
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby get it to x » Sat Jul 23, 2011 1:58 pm

Yep found gainful employment for the summer at a decent mid-sized firm based in NJ. Not what I was originally looking for and had to be flexible about where I wanted to practice, but I got something even having struggled a bit during 1L. I have found that Rutgers carries in NJ far more than I anticipated and that RU alums are very loyal and invested in helping students/young lawyers get a start. Other than that, the degree can do no more than any other school outside of the top-14, but the quality of the education (I know no one cares about that on this site) is excellent and the tuition price is wonderful compared to private schools in the same general geographic vicinity.

I heard rumblings that McCarter and English is starting up their summer associate program again. I don't know if they're coming to campus, but that's what I heard and take it as a sign things might be on the upswing. NJ Law Journal also recently published an article that most of NJ's first and second tier law firms have recovered from the recession. I know that does not equate to firms opening their doors to hire scores of local law students, but things may have stabilized at the least. Regarding the USAO's office, I think it's degrading to any licensed attorney to work for free, but the USAO is not an option for any law student coming out of school directly anyway so it would/should not be on anyone's radar screen. Do I think there are attorneys out there who are willing to "volunteer" to work there in the hopes that when the hiring freeze ends, they will be on Paul Fishman's short list...yes. If you've had the USAO Newark office on your mind for a long time and see this as an opportunity to get your dream job down the line and can support yourself (again I don't know how) then I can see this program getting more than a few applications.

areyouinsane
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby areyouinsane » Sat Jul 23, 2011 2:11 pm

I heard rumblings that McCarter and English is starting up their summer associate program again. I don't know if they're coming to campus, but that's what I heard and take it as a sign things might be on the upswing.


Dood you prolly don't want to work there anyway. I did a 5 month doc review gig at McCarter and man are their associates some fugly chicks. One of them is even kinda bald, like that lady who hosts "Lydia's Italy."

She actually thought she was hot and used to mac on some of the coders. Her perfume was so strong I think she sprayed it on with a crop duster.

areyouinsane
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby areyouinsane » Sat Jul 23, 2011 2:27 pm

I think it's degrading to any licensed attorney to work for free, but the USAO is not an option for any law student coming out of school directly anyway so it would/should not be on anyone's radar screen. Do I think there are attorneys out there who are willing to "volunteer" to work there in the hopes that when the hiring freeze ends.


The hiring freeze will NEVER end. Now that the government can find full-time, licensed attorneys for work for 0 dollars, why would they ever go back to offering a salary? As the old saw goes, "if you wanna work for nothing, you'll be busy from now 'till the end of time."

I heard a rumor that any day now Christie is also gonna shitcan paying law clerks a salary. So you guys headed to Traffic Court and the other bogus "clerkships" that sewers like Seton Hall & Rutgers push will not be paid anything either.

Hell, the NJ attorney general "volunteer" program can't even place all the applicants willing to work for free! Yet you guys have access to all of these articles and want to go to lawschool anyway? You want to join an industry full of people so desperate that they'll work for free to get "experience"?

get it to x
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby get it to x » Sat Jul 23, 2011 2:32 pm

Zazelmaf wrote:Why so much negativity? I am on the wait list for transferring here, and have heard good things about it.


This is just one student's take and are in no particular order.

Pros
In-state tuition - Unless you have significant scholarship to a private school in the NY metro area, Rutgers is probably your cheapest option regardless of academic scholarship assistance.

Educational quality - Professors can be a mixed bag and I'd say on the whole there are more bad than good as far as personality, professionalism (some are like overgrown children), and teaching ability, but the education itself is solid. You won't find yourself unable to work with colleagues who went to higher ranked schools because they were taught things that you were not during 1L at least.

Relatively relaxed atmosphere - the students tend to not get in each other's faces. Yes, there are gunners and general assholes, but I would like to think that the school's public interest focus tends to take the edge off....slightly.

Access to New Jersey... Do top-14 grads attempt to access the NJ market for clerkships and some jobs at T1 NJ firms? Yes. Is it a tough market to find a job? Sure. Unlike NY, NJ is very insular and does like to take care of their own. SHU and RU alumni are plentiful and willing to help most of the time.

Relatively new building... the law center was completed in either 1999 or 2000 and is still very nice and secure.

Cons
Geographic location - Without a doubt being situated in the NY metro area is tough. There is a ton of competition for jobs, and things can look pretty bleak at points during the job search. You are not, by far, the only game in town as is the case for many law schools around the country.

Not the Biglaw land of plenty - I guess this could be a pro or con depending on your outlook. If you think that Biglaw is readily accessible from RU-Newark think again. Students at the top of the class have the opportunity to interview for some NYC biglaw firms that RU has connections with (S&C, Debevoise, Cravath, etc.). Even those students strike out for the most part. You have to be flexible with that reality and be able to cope with the very very real chance that you will not be employed by these firms. If you don't like the possibility of practicing in northern New Jersey (at all levels Big-small law) or smaller NY firms seriously consider your other options before enrolling.

Academic support - I know this issue doesn't come up on TLS that much, but if you struggle I have found the support to not be particularly helpful. I know it's graduate school and you are supposed to help yourself as much as you can, but there still are occasions where you might need closer attention. RU still has some work to do in that department.

Faculty Mix - The faculty either runs really young or really old. Personally, I would prefer more faculty members who were in the prime of their careers because they are well-known but still haven't lost their practical touch from when they practiced...if they did so. RU seems to be at a crossroads in terms of bringing in new faculty members and having the old guard retire/die.


Pro or Con

Diversity - RU is fabulous for meeting people from all different backgrounds. There are Ivy-Leaguers and students who went to schools no one has heard of. Street smart students and students who cannot effectively cross the street but write brilliant exam answers. Older students are also in more abundance than elsewhere. Issues arise as to where the diversity emphasis should end. The Minority Student Program has many admirers and a long track-record of success, but students regularly debate whether this program provides an unfair advantage to the 1L class because of the extra help it provides that is not readily accessible to all students. Likewise, spots on the Law Review are also exclusively reserved for MSP students and students have felt that there should be no reservations for the program with the write-on competition being based on ability regardless of participation in MSP.

Commitment to public service - RU heavily emphasizes public service. The low cost of tuition makes working for the government more feasible than perhaps attending a private institution with more debt upon graduation. However, the public sector has shrunk considerably in light of the recession and in no way shape or form should someone assume that "well if I get no-offered from firms, I'll just pick up a job at the public defender's office in XYZ county." Those jobs, while they still exist, are just as difficult to obtain as private firm jobs. I don't know if RU has really grasped the reality of how limited these opportunities are, but I also knew that public sector work really was not for me so my experience with it has been limited.

get it to x
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby get it to x » Sat Jul 23, 2011 2:38 pm

areyouinsane wrote:
I heard rumblings that McCarter and English is starting up their summer associate program again. I don't know if they're coming to campus, but that's what I heard and take it as a sign things might be on the upswing.


Dood you prolly don't want to work there anyway. I did a 5 month doc review gig at McCarter and man are their associates some fugly chicks. One of them is even kinda bald, like that lady who hosts "Lydia's Italy."

She actually thought she was hot and used to mac on some of the coders. Her perfume was so strong I think she sprayed it on with a crop duster.


I don't want to work there. Quite honestly, I was not impressed by many of the big NJ firms. More mid-sized firms tended to produce higher quality work.

areyouinsane
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby areyouinsane » Sat Jul 23, 2011 3:18 pm

I don't want to work there. Quite honestly, I was not impressed by many of the big NJ firms. More mid-sized firms tended to produce higher quality work.


LOL right you are! We used to scroll thru the McCarter associate bios while I was temping there, and most of these mouth breathers are from laughable garbage schools like Seton Hall/NYLS, and got hired because their Daddies work there or their Daddies are federal judges, CEOs, or other "grease" and nepotism. Or they're bottom of the classers from "real" law schools like NYU who got dinged by the NYC biglaw firms and had to ride the PATH out to NJ with their tail between their legs and take a gig at this ghetto-assed dump.

Their offices are also very outdated and borderline embarrassing for a "big" firm. They don't even have their own cafeteria. It's a 1970s era building and the associates share offices. There's one really fat partner who I used to ride the elevator with a lot- he always had a huge hoagie from Subway and mowed it right in the elevator, like something out of a comedy movie or whatever. The lawyers there also dress poorly and are mostly total slobs.

Here's a funny story: I was temping on the big Seroquel case there back in 2008. McCarter was apparently in major trouble before that case came in and the firm was in danger of splitting up. So they poached a partner from a "real" firm and she had a relative at Astra-Zeneca who gave McCarter the doc review portion of the litigation (all the "real" work like motions, objections etc was done in NYC by I think White & Case- you couldn't trust the mouth-breathers at McCarter with anything important LOL). This broad apparently got a big cut of the action from bringing in that case- she was made instant partner and got a limo to work, etc. I saw her once and she was kinda hot in a cougar sort of way.

So McCarter (after landing the doc review) rented off-site space at the US Customs Building across from SH Law and fired up the project. 90% of the coders were SH or Rutgers grads- it was like a class reunion! I got called on a Sunday and was hired over the phone - they said "just show up there 8 am Monday." Back then all you needed was bar admission and a pulse to get these gigs (pulse optional).

So anyway, after a couple months we got to a portion of the doc review where the European docs showed up: stuff was in Swedish, Danish, German, etc. So McCarter hired outside non-lawyer translators to read us the docs so we could decide if they were responsive or not. These translators were some real characters: there was a semi-blind old Japanese woman we called "Yoko Ono" and this incredibly good looking Danish underwear model named Lucas. I was assigned to work with Lucas and all the chicks were ga-ga and asking me "what's he like" and "I'd bone him right here on this desk" and stuff like that.

Lucas, however, "played for the other team." He was always talking about his "partner" and their pad in Chelsea and stuff like that. He also told me that in Denmark an employer would be imprisoned for the kind of shit working conditions McCarter gave us. We literally worked in a converted janitor's closet- there was a "slop sink" in the corner and shelves full of trash bags, floor cleaner, etc. They made a desk for us by putting a 4X8 sheet of plywood on top of 2 sawhorses. We sat in metal folding chairs. I learned quite a bit of Danish from him too. If I was gay I'd def. want a partner like him. He told me he turned gay b/c he got tired of sleeping with hot chicks after awhile because it came so easy for him. Seriously, this guy could walk into a bar and chicks would ditch Derek Jeter to hang w/ this dood.

So anyway, the translators were treated like VIPs compared to us shitlaw temps, since they spoke rare and "exotic" languages and were not very easily replaced. They also got paid a LOT more than us: they were getting 55-75 an hour, and none of them were even lawyers or JDs, just translators. They got car rides home (and the blind lady Yoko Ono even got led into the room by an associate each day b/c she could only see "sideways," apparently). My buddy Holbs had to work with her and she was always having him tilt the screen and rub her neck & stuff like that. She was from Kyoto originally and spoke like 10 other languages besides Japanese. She hardly got any work done because as I said she was pretty much blind, and also she wrote everyone's names in Japanese with those fancy paintbrush-type pens and made little cards & oragamis for people to take home. She was a very nice woman.

McCarter even brought them in these awesome box lunches each day from a gourmet caterer in Jersey City. These swanky lunchboxes had proscuttio and mozz. sandwiches, bottles of Perrier water, a fresh apple & orange, and those exotic potato chips that are all purple and shit.

It was funny watching them all go to the conference room and pick up their grub everyday while we worked right alongside them and got jack shit- we usually ate at the crummy overpriced McDonald's inside Newark Penn Station. Lucas was always like "if you guys are really lawyers, why don't you get a box lunch like us?" I told him that we were just temps and went to shitty schools so they had no need to treat us like anything other than garbage. He found America very interesting and said he was gonna tell everyone in Denmark about how weird life here is. He took pictures of the janitor closet we worked in with his Iphone and sent them to friends back home, and none of them belived he was really working in such squalor. Sometimes if he wasn't too hungry he'd share his box lunch with me, or at least give me the apple or the chips, etc.

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Lawst
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby Lawst » Sat Jul 23, 2011 9:09 pm

Yeah, you can pretty much ignore our friend here - he enjoys trolling the threads. He doesn't say anything about where he went to school or how well he ranked, so his advice is useless. He tells amusing little stories, though, so I guess it's OK to keep him around like some sort of Debbie Downer mascot. Isn't he adorable?

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sunynp
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby sunynp » Sat Jul 23, 2011 9:39 pm

oops. sorry didn't mean to interfere with the topic of this thread. I didn't realize that this thread was meant only for people who are attending. Please accept my apology.
Last edited by sunynp on Sat Jul 23, 2011 11:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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vanwinkle
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Jul 23, 2011 11:01 pm

areyouinsane wrote: God help me, this thread can't be serious? It's some kind of joke, right?

--ImageRemoved--

Don't troll the Class of 2014 forums.

Folks, if he starts posting in here again, PM me and I'll take care of it.

areyouinsane
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby areyouinsane » Tue Jul 26, 2011 2:07 pm

Dam. I'm a night student, so being out at night is unavoidable.

I talked to a student who just finished 1st year. She said people exagerrate, and this is mostly a product of white ignorant fear, inability to understand Urban Areas. Idk, I'm going to check the place out tomorrow. I might be able to bring an old car if there's a place to park the thing.


Wonder if these gunshot victims think it's all an "exaggeration":

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/0 ... in_sh.html

Happened right near the spiffy new Prudential Center too, at 8:30 pm. Newark offers an excellent chance of being shot, even standing in line for pizza:

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/0 ... as_vi.html

Might want to leave your wheels at home too, as car-jackings have skyrocketed:

--LinkRemoved--

A nice young gal I did a temp. project with at McCarter got carjacked on her way home one night at about 9 pm. She was stopped at a light on Broad Street and the kid ran up, stuck a pistol in her face, hopped in and drove off, leaving her stranded alone on the street.

Next day they caught the kid driving the car- and I do mean KID- he was 14 years old!



I'd really hate to see anyone make the mistake of believing the PC bullshit that "things are improving" and "Newark is having a reinnesance" etc. It remains one of the most dangerous cities not just in America but the entire world.

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vanwinkle
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby vanwinkle » Tue Jul 26, 2011 5:51 pm

areyouinsane wrote:
Dam. I'm a night student, so being out at night is unavoidable.

I talked to a student who just finished 1st year. She said people exagerrate, and this is mostly a product of white ignorant fear, inability to understand Urban Areas. Idk, I'm going to check the place out tomorrow. I might be able to bring an old car if there's a place to park the thing.


Wonder if these gunshot victims think it's all an "exaggeration":

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/0 ... in_sh.html

Happened right near the spiffy new Prudential Center too, at 8:30 pm. Newark offers an excellent chance of being shot, even standing in line for pizza:

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/0 ... as_vi.html

Might want to leave your wheels at home too, as car-jackings have skyrocketed:

--LinkRemoved--

A nice young gal I did a temp. project with at McCarter got carjacked on her way home one night at about 9 pm. She was stopped at a light on Broad Street and the kid ran up, stuck a pistol in her face, hopped in and drove off, leaving her stranded alone on the street.

Next day they caught the kid driving the car- and I do mean KID- he was 14 years old!



I'd really hate to see anyone make the mistake of believing the PC bullshit that "things are improving" and "Newark is having a reinnesance" etc. It remains one of the most dangerous cities not just in America but the entire world.

Okay, the last post before this one is you getting banned for trolling. It's pretty obvious that you're not a member of the Rutgers Class of 2014. So:

--ImageRemoved--

BeautifulSW
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby BeautifulSW » Tue Jul 26, 2011 6:30 pm

Well, areyouinsane, at least you know how Cassandra felt.

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Lawst
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby Lawst » Tue Jul 26, 2011 10:14 pm

Thanks, Vanwinkle.

JeffHink
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby JeffHink » Wed Jul 27, 2011 3:37 pm

Track III - Sounds like the Crimlaw prof (Bergelson) has a heavy Russian accent. If that doesn't get you excited I don't know what will.

jodubs
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby jodubs » Wed Jul 27, 2011 4:13 pm

Track IV (5) here!

smoneill89
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby smoneill89 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:04 pm

JeffHink wrote:Track III - Sounds like the Crimlaw prof (Bergelson) has a heavy Russian accent. If that doesn't get you excited I don't know what will.


Track III also! But Bergelson isn't listed on the master schedule and I emailed Anita Walton about it. She said the professor is Thomas for Criminal Law.

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king3780
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby king3780 » Wed Jul 27, 2011 6:06 pm

smoneill89 wrote:
JeffHink wrote:Track III - Sounds like the Crimlaw prof (Bergelson) has a heavy Russian accent. If that doesn't get you excited I don't know what will.


Track III also! But Bergelson isn't listed on the master schedule and I emailed Anita Walton about it. She said the professor is Thomas for Criminal Law.


I had Bergelson and liked her. She was tough, but understandable. Thomas is a legend; he co-authored my Criminal Procedure text with Josh Dressler, whose Crim Law supplement you should definitely get.

AmericaninManchuria
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Re: Rutgers Law | Newark Class of 2014

Postby AmericaninManchuria » Wed Jul 27, 2011 11:30 pm

Track II (12) !




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