Michigan Class of 2014

(housing, friendships, future exams, all things 2014)
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thelaststraw05
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby thelaststraw05 » Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:45 am

hipstermafia wrote:i'm not sure you're doing that math right, but to each their own :)


I have done a much more thorough to the dollar budgeting with my wife. In addition to the economic advantage of better being able to get a job in Chicago, it is in fact cheaper.

I apologize for not being willing to share in greater detail my personal budget with someone on the internet.

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hipstermafia
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby hipstermafia » Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:50 am

thelaststraw05 wrote:
hipstermafia wrote:i'm not sure you're doing that math right, but to each their own :)


I have done a much more thorough to the dollar budgeting with my wife. In addition to the economic advantage of better being able to get a job in Chicago, it is in fact cheaper.

I apologize for not being willing to share in greater detail my personal budget with someone on the internet.

i'm certainly not asking you to, or trying to sway you either way - i think both are great schools and i'm about to make the decision between the two myself, but COA at georgetown is not 70k if your wife is already footing the bill for rent in dc

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thelaststraw05
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby thelaststraw05 » Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:58 am

hipstermafia wrote:
thelaststraw05 wrote:
hipstermafia wrote:i'm not sure you're doing that math right, but to each their own :)


I have done a much more thorough to the dollar budgeting with my wife. In addition to the economic advantage of better being able to get a job in Chicago, it is in fact cheaper.

I apologize for not being willing to share in greater detail my personal budget with someone on the internet.

i'm certainly not asking you to, or trying to sway you either way - i think both are great schools and i'm about to make the decision between the two myself, but COA at georgetown is not 70k if your wife is already footing the bill for rent in dc


I am using cost of attendance as a general indicator for discussion of my budget on the internet. When I move to Ann Arbor my wife will be taking a roommate and our living expenses in DC will be half what they are currently. So my living expenses in Ann Arbor will be more than offset by the decrease of living expenses DC. As you may know, the cost of living in DC is a tad higher than Ann Arbor.

I really do know a fair bit about my budget and have it worked out pretty finely.

I guess I will add a disclaimer to a post about my budget that your mileage may vary and it may or may not make economic sense for others to make similar decisions. Each individual should weigh different factors that personally affect their decision.

If anyone has any desire to continue this discussion please PM me.
Last edited by thelaststraw05 on Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

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thelaststraw05
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby thelaststraw05 » Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:59 am

So, I know that these off-campus receptions have already happened in a variety of places. What should I expect when the traveling Michigan show comes to town?

InvictusFortis
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby InvictusFortis » Wed Mar 16, 2011 12:05 pm

I'm going to run the numbers one last time and probably send in my deposit. I found out that the unsubsidized stafford loan starts accumulating interest from day one. I'm also going to look at private sources since some of the gradplus gets up to 8-9%. I'll see what I can find.

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R.R. Raskolnikov
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby R.R. Raskolnikov » Wed Mar 16, 2011 12:32 pm

InvictusFortis wrote:I'm going to run the numbers one last time and probably send in my deposit. I found out that the unsubsidized stafford loan starts accumulating interest from day one. I'm also going to look at private sources since some of the gradplus gets up to 8-9%. I'll see what I can find.


FYI in the financial aid session at ASW they essentially said that if you take out private loans Michigan's LRAP and the Federal IBR essentially don't work because only Federal loans will be forgiven. If you take out a bunch of private loans you're on your own for those. If you're making over 80k coming out of school that's not a big deal, but if you want the option of repayment assistance they very strongly encouraged you to take out GradPlus loans.

Also, while the private loans have a lower interest rate now, they are variable rate so they could rise later. Probably not a big deal in the short term, but if you're paying them off over a long period of time the interest could rise a lot.

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Excellence = a Habit
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby Excellence = a Habit » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:05 pm

R.R. Raskolnikov wrote:
InvictusFortis wrote:I'm going to run the numbers one last time and probably send in my deposit. I found out that the unsubsidized stafford loan starts accumulating interest from day one. I'm also going to look at private sources since some of the gradplus gets up to 8-9%. I'll see what I can find.


FYI in the financial aid session at ASW they essentially said that if you take out private loans Michigan's LRAP and the Federal IBR essentially don't work because only Federal loans will be forgiven. If you take out a bunch of private loans you're on your own for those. If you're making over 80k coming out of school that's not a big deal, but if you want the option of repayment assistance they very strongly encouraged you to take out GradPlus loans.

Also, while the private loans have a lower interest rate now, they are variable rate so they could rise later. Probably not a big deal in the short term, but if you're paying them off over a long period of time the interest could rise a lot.


Thanks for this. I am so freaking confused about aid in general. I really hope attending the financial aid sessions at ASWs helps clear it up (I'm going to Mich's second ASW).

r6_philly
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby r6_philly » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:08 pm

Excellence = a Habit wrote:Thanks for this. I am so freaking confused about aid in general. I really hope attending the financial aid sessions at ASWs helps clear it up (I'm going to Mich's second ASW).


Anything you need to know about federal aid:

http://studentaid.ed.gov/PORTALSWebApp/ ... /index.jsp

including repayment calculators for your viewing pleasure.

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hipstermafia
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby hipstermafia » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:21 pm

:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

--ImageRemoved--

r6_philly
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby r6_philly » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:24 pm

It's actually higher than that because

- you have to capitalize the unsubsidzed + PLUS interests
- PLUS is a 7.8 percent

However, $1133/month graduated isn't horrible if you make 60k+. Also interest payments are deductible.

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hipstermafia
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby hipstermafia » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:28 pm

r6_philly wrote:It's actually higher than that because

- you have to capitalize the unsubsidzed + PLUS interests
- PLUS is a 7.8 percent

However, $1133/month graduated isn't horrible if you make 60k+. Also interest payments are deductible.

and you end up paying $450,000+ to pay it off

InvictusFortis
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby InvictusFortis » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:30 pm

r6_philly wrote:It's actually higher than that because

- you have to capitalize the unsubsidzed + PLUS interests
- PLUS is a 7.8 percent

However, $1133/month graduated isn't horrible if you make 60k+. Also interest payments are deductible.


Graduated payments increase over time. But, hopefully, so will your salary.

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Excellence = a Habit
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby Excellence = a Habit » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:32 pm

r6_philly wrote:
Excellence = a Habit wrote:Thanks for this. I am so freaking confused about aid in general. I really hope attending the financial aid sessions at ASWs helps clear it up (I'm going to Mich's second ASW).


Anything you need to know about federal aid:

http://studentaid.ed.gov/PORTALSWebApp/ ... /index.jsp

including repayment calculators for your viewing pleasure.


Haha what, this site actually has useful information? I assumed it was just invented to make me bug my parents about their income levels and retirement account burdens! Thanks for the goldmine philly!

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src42
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby src42 » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:33 pm

r6_philly wrote:It's actually higher than that because

- you have to capitalize the unsubsidzed + PLUS interests
- PLUS is a 7.8 percent

However, $1133/month graduated isn't horrible if you make 60k+. Also interest payments are deductible.

I think you can only deduct interest payments up to $2500. At least that's what TurboTax told me this year. :(

InvictusFortis
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby InvictusFortis » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:34 pm

Actually, dumb coworker is dumb....

Does your effective annual interest drop to 5-6% if we resume a healthy level of inflation?

r6_philly
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby r6_philly » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:55 pm

InvictusFortis wrote:Actually, dumb coworker is dumb....

Does your effective annual interest drop to 5-6% if we resume a healthy level of inflation?


It only make a collective difference if your pay increase is outpacing the increase in inflation.

r6_philly
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby r6_philly » Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:57 pm

hipstermafia wrote:
r6_philly wrote:It's actually higher than that because

- you have to capitalize the unsubsidzed + PLUS interests
- PLUS is a 7.8 percent

However, $1133/month graduated isn't horrible if you make 60k+. Also interest payments are deductible.

and you end up paying $450,000+ to pay it off



Don't worry about total amounts. You should compare present values only instead of total debt service because money 30 years away is worth less than money 10 years away (time discount + inflation).

The total debt for 70k loans (72k and 74k for later years) at graduation is 244k, I just ran through my spreadsheet.

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hipstermafia
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby hipstermafia » Wed Mar 16, 2011 2:28 pm

src42 wrote:
r6_philly wrote:It's actually higher than that because

- you have to capitalize the unsubsidzed + PLUS interests
- PLUS is a 7.8 percent

However, $1133/month graduated isn't horrible if you make 60k+. Also interest payments are deductible.

I think you can only deduct interest payments up to $2500. At least that's what TurboTax told me this year. :(

I think there is also a salary cap beyond which point you can't deduct student loan interest payments, not sure what it is of you're claiming dependents or jointly filing, but around 80k if you file independently

Yep, student loan interest deduction for anyone interested:
http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc456.html

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whatshouldIdo11
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby whatshouldIdo11 » Wed Mar 16, 2011 2:35 pm

I'm finally in! Applied 11/5. Very happy to join the conversation. At this point, I'm about 75% sure I'll be attending.

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agora139
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby agora139 » Wed Mar 16, 2011 2:51 pm

whatshouldIdo11 wrote:I'm finally in! Applied 11/5. Very happy to join the conversation. At this point, I'm about 75% sure I'll be attending.

happy to hear you're in!! numbers twin IIRC, right??
Last edited by agora139 on Wed Mar 16, 2011 3:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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AreJay711
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby AreJay711 » Wed Mar 16, 2011 3:02 pm

r6_philly wrote:
hipstermafia wrote:
r6_philly wrote:It's actually higher than that because

- you have to capitalize the unsubsidzed + PLUS interests
- PLUS is a 7.8 percent

However, $1133/month graduated isn't horrible if you make 60k+. Also interest payments are deductible.

and you end up paying $450,000+ to pay it off



Don't worry about total amounts. You should compare present values only instead of total debt service because money 30 years away is worth less than money 10 years away (time discount + inflation).

The total debt for 70k loans (72k and 74k for later years) at graduation is 244k, I just ran through my spreadsheet.


I actually think the only way to do really think about the debt is in per month changes. Huge repayment amounts are scary and people typically can't make good decisions when they think about it that way. Paying it over 30 years really might be the right thing to do but will never look that way when you aggregate it. Hell, with a real rate of return of 7% in the stock market(I know that isn't guaranteed), it might be smart to take the 30 year debt and use the saved money to invest if you have 40+ years to retirement.

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hipstermafia
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby hipstermafia » Wed Mar 16, 2011 3:06 pm

AreJay711 wrote:I actually think the only way to do really think about the debt is in per month changes. Huge repayment amounts are scary and people typically can't make good decisions when they think about it that way. Paying it over 30 years really might be the right thing to do but will never look that way when you aggregate it. Hell, with a real rate of return of 7% in the stock market(I know that isn't guaranteed), it might be smart to take the 30 year debt and use the saved money to invest if you have 40+ years to retirement.

ha, r6 and i actually just had this conversation via pm.

i still don't think I can on that much debt, y'all are braver than i am.

InvictusFortis
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby InvictusFortis » Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:00 pm

hipstermafia wrote:
AreJay711 wrote:I actually think the only way to do really think about the debt is in per month changes. Huge repayment amounts are scary and people typically can't make good decisions when they think about it that way. Paying it over 30 years really might be the right thing to do but will never look that way when you aggregate it. Hell, with a real rate of return of 7% in the stock market(I know that isn't guaranteed), it might be smart to take the 30 year debt and use the saved money to invest if you have 40+ years to retirement.

ha, r6 and i actually just had this conversation via pm.

i still don't think I can on that much debt, y'all are braver than i am.


That's on 200k, or worst case scenario.

r6_philly
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby r6_philly » Wed Mar 16, 2011 5:19 pm

I will run some scenarios and spreadsheets that you guys can use next month when I have more time. I have some made right now in excel, including total loan debt (interests capitalized), and one for total law school present value. I need to combine the 2 into 1 calculator so you can gauge how much debt you will have coming out of school with all the aid offers you have and compare side by side.

I want to convert it to a web site so everyone can use it.

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whathojeeves
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Re: Michigan Class of 2014

Postby whathojeeves » Wed Mar 16, 2011 5:28 pm

r6_philly wrote:I will run some scenarios and spreadsheets that you guys can use next month when I have more time. I have some made right now in excel, including total loan debt (interests capitalized), and one for total law school present value. I need to combine the 2 into 1 calculator so you can gauge how much debt you will have coming out of school with all the aid offers you have and compare side by side.

I want to convert it to a web site so everyone can use it.


You're a god among men




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