Almost top 5%

A forum for those current students who are or may be transferring from one school to another. Post any questions, advice, or other transfer related comments here.
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Almost top 5%

Postby Anonymous User » Thu May 18, 2017 10:34 am

If I am very near the top 5% mark at my school (about .2 off), would it be helpful to indicate that in transfer app somehow? If so, how would you/did you do it? My school's administrative services are very lazy and I am not banking on them letting me know my exact percentile rank.

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lymenheimer

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby lymenheimer » Thu May 18, 2017 11:17 am

As in, you're in the top 5.2%, or your gpa is .2 from top 5%?

runinthefront

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby runinthefront » Thu May 18, 2017 12:59 pm

Anonymous User wrote:If I am very near the top 5% mark at my school (about .2 off), would it be helpful to indicate that in transfer app somehow? If so, how would you/did you do it? My school's administrative services are very lazy and I am not banking on them letting me know my exact percentile rank.

If they won't let you know your exact rank, absolutely DO NOT try to calculate that on your own.

Others may disagree with me, but I think these examples are fine:

"GPA: 3.8 | Top 10%"

or

"GPA: 3.8 | Top 5% = 3.812"
Last edited by runinthefront on Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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lymenheimer

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby lymenheimer » Thu May 18, 2017 1:25 pm

runinthefront wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:If I am very near the top 5% mark at my school (about .2 off), would it be helpful to indicate that in transfer app somehow? If so, how would you/did you do it? My school's administrative services are very lazy and I am not banking on them letting me know my exact percentile rank.

If they won't let you know your exact rank, absolutely DO NOT try to calculate that on your own.

Others may disagree with me, but I think these examples are fine:

"GPA: 3.8 | Top 10%"

or

"GPA: 3.8 | Top 5% = 3.812"


except OP would be saying:
"GPA: 3.6 | Top 5% = 3.8"

which is kinda dumb unless the range is actually that wide

eta: also, your first suggestion would be calculating his own rank, if the school doesn't give out 10%.

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby KissMyAxe » Thu May 18, 2017 1:39 pm

lymenheimer wrote:
runinthefront wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:If I am very near the top 5% mark at my school (about .2 off), would it be helpful to indicate that in transfer app somehow? If so, how would you/did you do it? My school's administrative services are very lazy and I am not banking on them letting me know my exact percentile rank.

If they won't let you know your exact rank, absolutely DO NOT try to calculate that on your own.

Others may disagree with me, but I think these examples are fine:

"GPA: 3.8 | Top 10%"

or

"GPA: 3.8 | Top 5% = 3.812"


except OP would be saying:
"GPA: 3.6 | Top 5% = 3.8"

which is kinda dumb unless the range is actually that wide

eta: also, your first suggestion would be calculating his own rank, if the school doesn't give out 10%.


I think you're missing the point. Obviously, he can't lie about his GPA, but I think runinthefront is assuming he's saying he's in the top 5.2% of the class, rather than has a GPA .2 lower than top 5% (as I wouldn't define that as being very near that mark). But I absolutely agree with him that you should indicate you were that close if you actually were.

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby runinthefront » Thu May 18, 2017 1:39 pm

lymenheimer wrote:
runinthefront wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:If I am very near the top 5% mark at my school (about .2 off), would it be helpful to indicate that in transfer app somehow? If so, how would you/did you do it? My school's administrative services are very lazy and I am not banking on them letting me know my exact percentile rank.

If they won't let you know your exact rank, absolutely DO NOT try to calculate that on your own.

Others may disagree with me, but I think these examples are fine:

"GPA: 3.8 | Top 10%"

or

"GPA: 3.8 | Top 5% = 3.812"


except OP would be saying:
"GPA: 3.6 | Top 5% = 3.8"

which is kinda dumb unless the range is actually that wide

eta: also, your first suggestion would be calculating his own rank, if the school doesn't give out 10%.

I just assumed OP meant .02, because I can't imagine any person would think a .2 difference between being within top 5% and out of it is considered "almost there."

I also assumed that if the school was releasing the top 5%, they would definitely release the top 10%, and OP is just in the shitty situation where he's (probably) like top 6% in the class, but there's no official "top 6%" designation.

Lots of assumptions, but OP's situation is (probably) not out of the ordinary for many

ETA: scooped by the poster above.
Last edited by runinthefront on Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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lymenheimer

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby lymenheimer » Thu May 18, 2017 1:47 pm

KissMyAxe wrote:
lymenheimer wrote:
runinthefront wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:If I am very near the top 5% mark at my school (about .2 off), would it be helpful to indicate that in transfer app somehow? If so, how would you/did you do it? My school's administrative services are very lazy and I am not banking on them letting me know my exact percentile rank.

If they won't let you know your exact rank, absolutely DO NOT try to calculate that on your own.

Others may disagree with me, but I think these examples are fine:

"GPA: 3.8 | Top 10%"

or

"GPA: 3.8 | Top 5% = 3.812"


except OP would be saying:
"GPA: 3.6 | Top 5% = 3.8"

which is kinda dumb unless the range is actually that wide

eta: also, your first suggestion would be calculating his own rank, if the school doesn't give out 10%.


I think you're missing the point. Obviously, he can't lie about his GPA, but I think runinthefront is assuming he's saying he's in the top 5.2% of the class, rather than has a GPA .2 lower than top 5% (as I wouldn't define that as being very near that mark). But I absolutely agree with him that you should indicate you were that close if you actually were.


Nah. I get it. Which is why I asked my first question. OP is just an absentee and hasnt said what he meant. I wouldn't define .2 gpa as being very near the mark, but OP may.

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby RaceJudicata » Thu May 18, 2017 3:16 pm

If you are Top 5.2%, then just indicate on Resume that you have 3.whatever GPA : Top 6%

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby Anonymous User » Thu May 18, 2017 5:04 pm

Hi all, OP here,

Sorry for the confusion. I actually meant .02, but as it turns out, I suck at math and its about a .07 difference. I think I'll do what RunInFront said and just put my gpa and what top 5% is. I'll leave it to admissions to decide if its close or not. Thanks for all your responses.

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby RaceJudicata » Thu May 18, 2017 5:22 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hi all, OP here,

Sorry for the confusion. I actually meant .02, but as it turns out, I suck at math and its about a .07 difference. I think I'll do what RunInFront said and just put my gpa and what top 5% is. I'll leave it to admissions to decide if its close or not. Thanks for all your responses.


Seems silly to put a 5% guidepost on resume when you are not in the top 5% (and likely further from it than you think). Find out the top 10% guidepost and put that on resume if you are so inclined. Also, you may actually be hurting yourself to put the percentage at all.

What is your gpa? If its like a 3.8 or something, I'd just leave it as is. If its a 3.3 or something, that makes more sense.

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby runinthefront » Thu May 18, 2017 5:28 pm

RaceJudicata wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hi all, OP here,

Sorry for the confusion. I actually meant .02, but as it turns out, I suck at math and its about a .07 difference. I think I'll do what RunInFront said and just put my gpa and what top 5% is. I'll leave it to admissions to decide if its close or not. Thanks for all your responses.


Seems silly to put a 5% guidepost on resume when you are not in the top 5% (and likely further from it than you think). Find out the top 10% guidepost and put that on resume if you are so inclined. Also, you may actually be hurting yourself to put the percentage at all.

What is your gpa? If its like a 3.8 or something, I'd just leave it as is. If its a 3.3 or something, that makes more sense.

It didn't hurt me during my 1L OCI--at least not in the biglaw sector. And it's silly to think that you'd be hurting yourself to put the percentage at all.

RaceJudicata wrote:If you are Top 5.2%, then just indicate on Resume that you have 3.whatever GPA : Top 6%


You should absolutely, positively not do this, OP. You should never display an unofficial grade percentile, even if you could figure out where you stand yourself.
Last edited by runinthefront on Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby RaceJudicata » Thu May 18, 2017 6:59 pm

runinthefront wrote:
RaceJudicata wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hi all, OP here,

Sorry for the confusion. I actually meant .02, but as it turns out, I suck at math and its about a .07 difference. I think I'll do what RunInFront said and just put my gpa and what top 5% is. I'll leave it to admissions to decide if its close or not. Thanks for all your responses.


Seems silly to put a 5% guidepost on resume when you are not in the top 5% (and likely further from it than you think). Find out the top 10% guidepost and put that on resume if you are so inclined. Also, you may actually be hurting yourself to put the percentage at all.

What is your gpa? If its like a 3.8 or something, I'd just leave it as is. If its a 3.3 or something, that makes more sense.

It didn't hurt me during my 1L OCI--at least not in the biglaw sector. And it's silly to think that you'd be hurting yourself to put the percentage at all.

RaceJudicata wrote:If you are Top 5.2%, then just indicate on Resume that you have 3.whatever GPA : Top 6%


You should absolutely, positively not do this, OP. You should never display an unofficial grade percentile, even if you could figure out where you stand yourself.


OP is transferring, not applying for SA gigs... you aren't pulling the wool over a school's admissions team by making it seem like you are close to a certain class rank. . . Plenty of schools accepting transfers would rather have a 3.9 GPA from a kid in the Top 15% over a 3.4 GPA from a kid in the top 5% because it'll look better on a 509 report. This is also the reason lower ranked schools keep curves low -- so students have a more difficult time transferring out.

And the other point worked for me. . . Granted I went to T2 school, so all of OCI was preselect. I was like 11% or whatever after 1L year, and a whole bunch of firms had GPA cut-offs at 5, 10 or 25%... so in order to not be locked out of 10% firms, I would put 11% and often send an email to the recruiter saying "Despite slightly missing your gpa cutoff, I believe I would be an excellent candidate for x, y, z reasons, etc. etc."

Ended up with several screeners and 3 offers from "10% cut-off" firms that I would have been locked out of had I just went with "Top 25% or even "Top 15%"...

This is not to say my approach is the absolutely correct one -- it just worked for me.

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby Mullens » Thu May 18, 2017 7:01 pm

Anonymous User wrote:If I am very near the top 5% mark at my school (about .2 off), would it be helpful to indicate that in transfer app somehow? If so, how would you/did you do it? My school's administrative services are very lazy and I am not banking on them letting me know my exact percentile rank.


I wouldn't worry about this too much for your transfer app, just don't lie. Admissions officers can probably eyeball your approximate class rank based on your GPA and your 1L school's curve.

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby Anonymous User » Sun May 21, 2017 10:11 pm

OP here,

I do happen to go to a school where they shift their curve up, so I have a 3.85ish, but am not top 5%. I have heard that schools favor applicants with high GPAs even if their correlating rank is actually not that high. Any anecdotes supporting this? Also, will acceptance to my current school's law review and winning my school's moot court competition help at all?

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A. Nony Mouse

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Sun May 21, 2017 11:54 pm

RaceJudicata wrote:
runinthefront wrote:
RaceJudicata wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hi all, OP here,

Sorry for the confusion. I actually meant .02, but as it turns out, I suck at math and its about a .07 difference. I think I'll do what RunInFront said and just put my gpa and what top 5% is. I'll leave it to admissions to decide if its close or not. Thanks for all your responses.


Seems silly to put a 5% guidepost on resume when you are not in the top 5% (and likely further from it than you think). Find out the top 10% guidepost and put that on resume if you are so inclined. Also, you may actually be hurting yourself to put the percentage at all.

What is your gpa? If its like a 3.8 or something, I'd just leave it as is. If its a 3.3 or something, that makes more sense.

It didn't hurt me during my 1L OCI--at least not in the biglaw sector. And it's silly to think that you'd be hurting yourself to put the percentage at all.

RaceJudicata wrote:If you are Top 5.2%, then just indicate on Resume that you have 3.whatever GPA : Top 6%


You should absolutely, positively not do this, OP. You should never display an unofficial grade percentile, even if you could figure out where you stand yourself.


OP is transferring, not applying for SA gigs... you aren't pulling the wool over a school's admissions team by making it seem like you are close to a certain class rank. . . Plenty of schools accepting transfers would rather have a 3.9 GPA from a kid in the Top 15% over a 3.4 GPA from a kid in the top 5% because it'll look better on a 509 report. This is also the reason lower ranked schools keep curves low -- so students have a more difficult time transferring out.

And the other point worked for me. . . Granted I went to T2 school, so all of OCI was preselect. I was like 11% or whatever after 1L year, and a whole bunch of firms had GPA cut-offs at 5, 10 or 25%... so in order to not be locked out of 10% firms, I would put 11% and often send an email to the recruiter saying "Despite slightly missing your gpa cutoff, I believe I would be an excellent candidate for x, y, z reasons, etc. etc."

Ended up with several screeners and 3 offers from "10% cut-off" firms that I would have been locked out of had I just went with "Top 25% or even "Top 15%"...

This is not to say my approach is the absolutely correct one -- it just worked for me.

This all depends on a lot of school-specific stuff. My school gave you your exact rank if you were in the top third, and we were allowed to give out that exact rank (so it wasn't really worth listing top-whatever-% because schools could just do the math and figure out what 7/129 meant). Some schools don't give exact ranks and only tell you top 5%/top 10%. In that case, you can't say "top 6%"' even if you can extrapolate from various measures that you're likely around there, because the school doesn't release that info. You can only give the school-issued info so if you are right off 5% it makes more sense to put what 5% is in the resume, not to round yours to 6%.

I agree though that it's less pressing for transfers since schools want a GPA that looks good and probably have easy access to other schools' curves if they want it.

And OP I think LR and winning moot court are great things to be able to point to, although numbers are still key.

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A. Nony Mouse

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Sun May 21, 2017 11:56 pm

(Also I saw someone put something like "top 5.3%" on a resume once and it just looked kind of sad. We get it, you were soooooo close!!)

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Nonconsecutive

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Re: Almost top 5%

Postby Nonconsecutive » Mon May 22, 2017 10:44 am

A. Nony Mouse wrote:(Also I saw someone put something like "top 5.3%" on a resume once and it just looked kind of sad. We get it, you were soooooo close!!)


Wow. That kind of says more than the rest of the resume, imo.



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