American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

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haus
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby haus » Sat Jan 17, 2015 10:35 pm

hypebeast wrote:
haus wrote:
scottidsntknow wrote:Um, watch the news sometime? If we're whipping it out and measuring up, I was born there in '92.

Local TV news has just slightly more useful content than a test pattern.


I was born here in the '80s and have lived in the area my entire life. I remember hearing the term "DMV" as far back as middle school. It has become a lot more popular lately, though, mostly because Wale uses it in his songs and radio stations use the term a lot now. Anyways, the term DMV has been around for a while and has become very common since the mid-2000s.

Still does not make it a good idea.

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FSK
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby FSK » Sat Jan 17, 2015 10:36 pm

hypebeast wrote:
haus wrote:
scottidsntknow wrote:Um, watch the news sometime? If we're whipping it out and measuring up, I was born there in '92.

Local TV news has just slightly more useful content than a test pattern.


I was born here in the '80s and have lived in the area my entire life. I remember hearing the term "DMV" as far back as middle school. It has become a lot more popular lately, though, mostly because Wale uses it in his songs and radio stations use the term a lot now. Anyways, the term DMV has been around for a while and has become very common since the mid-2000s.


The DMV area is just as bad as the literal DMV in many respects.

ilikebaseball
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby ilikebaseball » Sat Jan 17, 2015 10:49 pm

just call it the beltway.

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FSK
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby FSK » Sat Jan 17, 2015 10:54 pm

ilikebaseball wrote:just call it the beltway.


My boomer dad calls me an "inside the beltway" person now - he also hates that I'm politically liberal. So lets not use that either.

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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby ilikebaseball » Sat Jan 17, 2015 10:55 pm

but that's what its called.

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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby hypebeast » Sat Jan 17, 2015 10:56 pm

haus wrote:
hypebeast wrote:
haus wrote:
scottidsntknow wrote:Um, watch the news sometime? If we're whipping it out and measuring up, I was born there in '92.

Local TV news has just slightly more useful content than a test pattern.


I was born here in the '80s and have lived in the area my entire life. I remember hearing the term "DMV" as far back as middle school. It has become a lot more popular lately, though, mostly because Wale uses it in his songs and radio stations use the term a lot now. Anyways, the term DMV has been around for a while and has become very common since the mid-2000s.

Still does not make it a good idea.


The DMV is not really an idea or thought, just a slang term for referring to the DC metropolitan area that has gone mainstream and become super common in casual conversation. I understand that you don't like the term because it reminds you of the Department of Motor Vehicles, but it's a common way to refer to the area that's becoming increasingly popular. I'm not really sure what we're arguing about. I'm just bored and trying to avoid all of the productive things that I could be doing.

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fats provolone
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby fats provolone » Sat Jan 17, 2015 10:58 pm

you should all go to american

hypebeast
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby hypebeast » Sat Jan 17, 2015 11:02 pm

flawschoolkid wrote:
ilikebaseball wrote:just call it the beltway.


My boomer dad calls me an "inside the beltway" person now - he also hates that I'm politically liberal. So lets not use that either.


Inside and outside the beltway have been terms from since well before I was even born. I don't understand what's going on in this thread DMV and inside the beltway are both commonly used terms to reference the DC metropolitan area. Just because you don't want people using the term because you don't like it won't make it not a common term anymore, these terms are already part of the vernacular, especially inside the beltway.

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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby hypebeast » Sat Jan 17, 2015 11:07 pm

flawschoolkid wrote:
hypebeast wrote:
haus wrote:
scottidsntknow wrote:Um, watch the news sometime? If we're whipping it out and measuring up, I was born there in '92.

Local TV news has just slightly more useful content than a test pattern.


I was born here in the '80s and have lived in the area my entire life. I remember hearing the term "DMV" as far back as middle school. It has become a lot more popular lately, though, mostly because Wale uses it in his songs and radio stations use the term a lot now. Anyways, the term DMV has been around for a while and has become very common since the mid-2000s.


The DMV area is just as bad as the literal DMV in many respects.


I like living here, but to be fair, I don't really have much to compare it against. DC area gets a lot of transplants though and most of the time when I ask them how much they like DC, they seem to like living here. Most of the kids I grew up with also may have gone away for college or worked elsewhere for a year or two but ended up back here because they wanted to, so it can't be all that bad here.

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chuckbass
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby chuckbass » Sun Jan 18, 2015 3:08 am

I just like calling it ~the district~

So much more bougie

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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby Nebby » Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:55 am

fats provolone wrote:you should all go to american

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haus
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby haus » Sun Jan 18, 2015 11:41 am

If most of the students who do go to American leave after their first year, what is the school doing to do with a that space they will have when the open up the new campus?

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lhanvt13
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby lhanvt13 » Sun Jan 18, 2015 4:15 pm

haus wrote:If most of the students who do go to American leave after their first year, what is the school doing to do with a that space they will have when the open up the new campus?

They're opening up a new campus?! Wtf

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haus
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby haus » Sun Jan 18, 2015 5:38 pm

lhanvt13 wrote:
haus wrote:If most of the students who do go to American leave after their first year, what is the school doing to do with a that space they will have when the open up the new campus?

They're opening up a new campus?! Wtf

http://www.american.edu/buildingAU/tenleyoverview.cfm

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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby AReasonableMan » Mon Jan 19, 2015 7:12 pm

This may somewhat explain American's poor LST score. If 93 above median students are leaving and 44% of the remaining students secure legal employment within 9 months, it's possible the 93 students leaving have a big impact on the employment score. This impacts current students in that it precludes American from regaining T-1 status, and may over time result in stigmatization from employers. If I'm an American student I'm upset because while I should have known my degree was never worth sticker, it's not crazy for me to have expected it would be worth more than it is.

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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby John C. Kunich » Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:18 pm

When you reward something, you get more of it. The U.S. News rating structure has long rewarded law schools based on the characteristics of their first-year applicants and students. By ignoring much of what happens subsequent to the first year, the U.S. News mechanism lures rational utility maximizers like the bright people in charge of George Washington University Law School into doing precisely what they are doing. If the bright people who run American University and other law schools within the GW locality don't like seeing many of their best rising 2Ls transfer to GW, we should expect to see them institute countermeasures.

This game of predator/prey, if you want to call it that, happens throughout the nation, and it affects many law schools. The GW/American example is noteworthy mostly because GW enjoys better than average opportunities to attract rising 2Ls away from other good law schools in the same city. These students would be foolish not to jump at the chance to have the name of a (supposedly) more prestigious law school on their diplomas and transcripts. The leaders at GW know this, and they are doing what good business dictates--maximizing financial gain while preserving (and even enhancing) their competitive edge.

The greater the number of highly-capable rising 2Ls GW can lure away from its nearby competitors like American, the more money GW will have at its disposal. These good students can be expected to graduate and pass the bar on the first attempt at a very high rate of success. They will be likely to secure acceptable law-degree-mandatory employment soon after graduation. They will burnish the reputation of GW throughout their professional careers. And they will probably become generous alumni who will support GW with their charitable contributions for decades to come. Meanwhile, American suffers a decline in tuition revenue from its 2L and 3L class. The students who don't transfer are possibly less capable, and may fail to graduate or to pass the bar at higher rates than those who did transfer. The less-capable students who do graduate and pass the bar may have more difficulty finding appropriate jobs, and may be less able to support American as gift-giving alums. Meanwhile, GW's U.S. News ranking remains high, or even climbs higher, while American's ranking slips. This only feeds the spiral for further rounds of similar phenomena, into the future.

It might make us feel a little better if we castigate the leaders at GW for predatory poaching, but figuring out how to make more money, within the constraints of the law, is what almost all people do, regardless of their job or official title. For countless leaders and managers who are responsible for making and adhering to a budget, one of their duties is to generate a surplus of revenue over expense, whether we call that "profit" or any other term. We have created a monster that menaces legal education.

We tacitly endorse the U.S. News system, with its myriad defects, and we can't pretend to be shocked when GW and other law schools behave in their own self-interest within that system. The U.S. News rankings overemphasize selectivity, along with the UGPA and LSAT statistics of the 1L class, while ignoring these measures for the students beyond that point. They also stress questionable and manipulation-prone criteria such as "peer assessment," "assessment by lawyers/judges," "faculty resources" and "library resources." Any law school that can generate more revenue while preserving the appearance of selectivity/high applicant credentials will be rewarded with more money to spend on other aspects of the U.S. News picture.

Frankly, we need to do more than shame GW for doing what the system encourages it to do. We need to reform the system itself. That, unfortunately, is far more difficult than pointing fingers at law schools that are trying to manage their income and expenses in a responsible manner.

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fats provolone
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby fats provolone » Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:22 pm

what exactly are they doing to "poach" students btw? just accepting applicants?

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moonman157
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby moonman157 » Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:26 pm

I definitely thought that the title was an error and that a GW professor was calling out American for their awful transfer practices, like making students pay back their scholarships if they transfer or whatever. So much shamelessness from so many angles. In a profession that stresses ethics.

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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby kartelite » Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:43 pm

scottidsntknow wrote:
haus wrote:
scottidsntknow wrote:
haus wrote:Please do not refer to this area as DMV, I already have enough mental scar tissue to deal with without dredging up horrific department of motor vehical memories as well.

DMV is a normal name for the area doe

I have working here since '97, I do not think I have heard this usage.

Um, watch the news sometime? If we're whipping it out and measuring up, I was born there in '92.


I moved to Virginia in 1985, went to college and grad school there, and am not familiar with the term. Except in reference to the Department of Motor Vehicles.

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Nebby
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby Nebby » Mon Feb 02, 2015 11:24 pm

Were you in are cuntry Virginia or NOVA?

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lhanvt13
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby lhanvt13 » Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:31 am

Lived in nova for.. Plenty of years . DMV is definitely a thing. Just listen to WTOP on the radio

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chuckbass
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby chuckbass » Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:32 am

lhanvt13 wrote:Lived in nova for.. Plenty of years . DMV is definitely a thing. Just listen to WTOP on the radio

My savior.

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BVest
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby BVest » Tue Feb 03, 2015 6:26 am

There are sources confirming it's a thing, but you won't hear this former district resident using it anytime soon, largely out of concern that my audience will have no idea what I'm talking about.

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Nebby
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby Nebby » Tue Feb 03, 2015 7:26 am

BVest wrote:There are sources confirming it's a thing, but you won't hear this former district resident using it anytime soon, largely out of concern that my audience will have no idea what I'm talking about.

It's so *inside the beltway* to use words that exclude others, though.

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pancakes3
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Re: American prof slams GW for "predatory" transfer practices

Postby pancakes3 » Tue Feb 03, 2015 7:34 am

I've heard a lot more M's saying DMV than D's or V's. Also a lot of the "we're not NOVA. NOVA is a community college."




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