Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

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SandScale004
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby SandScale004 » Sun Jun 23, 2013 9:57 pm

Randomnumbers wrote:So instead of being #5 in the class alone, someone else might also be #5? Gee, yeah, that's really gonna hurt things. But when ten of the top 20 or so students transfer out, all the people who didn't leave have a chance at doing better at OCI. From the perspective of trying to get the most people in your class a good job, I don't see the problem. It's not like you lose your rank.


What about when that person stays and is now at a lower rank than people with a lower GPA? Surely like others have said, not all people who apply to transfer actually transfer. How is it fair to punish them simply for putting in a transfer app, but then deciding to stay? It's one thing if the school would readjust the rankings if the person stays, but they don't, per the OP. They just share a rank.

Randomnumbers
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby Randomnumbers » Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:00 pm

Meh. Your complaint seems to boil down to "I worked so hard for this shiny why should someone else also get it" when it doesn't seem to be harming you in any way. Even if you and someone with a lower GPA who now shares or betters your class rank both apply to the same job, you'll still have a higher GPA and employers will see that.

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stillwater
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby stillwater » Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:03 pm

Randomnumbers wrote:Meh. Your complaint seems to boil down to "I worked so hard for this shiny why should someone else also get it" when it doesn't seem to be harming you in any way. Even if you and someone with a lower GPA who now shares or betters your class rank both apply to the same job, you'll still have a higher GPA and employers will see that.


i kinda see what this side of the argument is saying. a donkey isnt a zebra just because you call the donkey a zebra.

Anonymous User
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:59 pm

Randomnumbers wrote:Meh. Your complaint seems to boil down to "I worked so hard for this shiny why should someone else also get it" when it doesn't seem to be harming you in any way. Even if you and someone with a lower GPA who now shares or betters your class rank both apply to the same job, you'll still have a higher GPA and employers will see that.

stillwater wrote:i kinda see what this side of the argument is saying. a donkey isnt a zebra just because you call the donkey a zebra..


I am not really going to argue about the ethics of this procedure. I was simply wondering if other schools did this or not. This was all I was wondering in my OP, and I am satisfied with the response I have received. I don't need you to tell me that it's "fair." It's not. It never will be. I do not agree that this is okay because it doesn't really "hurt" anyone. I don't think it's right, and it seems most schools agree, as they do not do this. I like to earn my awards through my hard work, not through free handouts. Call me naive, I probably am, but I've always been this way. :)
Last edited by Anonymous User on Fri Jul 05, 2013 6:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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minnbills
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby minnbills » Sun Jun 23, 2013 11:11 pm

Out them to ATL this fucking minute.

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$peppercorn
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby $peppercorn » Sun Jun 23, 2013 11:43 pm

stillwater wrote:this sounds unbelievable TTTT

beastienoise
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby beastienoise » Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:35 pm

The re-ranking stuff is ridiculous and transparent. It would be one thing if those who applied to transfer were also allowed to reflect their updated standing in the event that they decided to stay, then it would only be an issue of sharing a rank with those who did worse than you. As it stands now, however, someone who applied to transfer could easily have to claim top 15% while someone with a lower GPA could claim top 10%. The school doesn't rank individually beyond the top 5% so its a significant difference. The school claims that those students applying to transfer were not in the new calculations ,so allowing them to use the updated ranking would be inaccurate; that's bullshit, if those students end up staying then everyone's ranking is equally inaccurate and you should either recalculate or let everyone use the updated rankings.

OP do you care if I out the school?

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txdude45
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby txdude45 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:47 pm

beastienoise wrote:OP do you care if I out the school?


Image

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dsn32
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby dsn32 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:48 pm

Is there a way everyone at the top can hold off on requesting Dean's Certifications, thereby maintaining their class rank, until the deadline then request your Dean's Certs. the next day? If the school is going to act like this, I think the top students should return the favor.

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Jsa725
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby Jsa725 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:49 pm

.
Last edited by Jsa725 on Sun Oct 26, 2014 3:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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IAFG
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby IAFG » Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:51 pm

WTF are you all talking about. The school is doing their students a favor and it's only shady to the extent some students might stay.

09042014
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:55 pm

IAFG wrote:WTF are you all talking about. The school is doing their students a favor and it's only shady to the extent some students might stay.


Transfers feel entitled to the glory they think they earned at the old school. Just look at the threads about putting on their journal offers that they are going to turn down.

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stillwater
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby stillwater » Mon Jun 24, 2013 2:58 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
IAFG wrote:WTF are you all talking about. The school is doing their students a favor and it's only shady to the extent some students might stay.


Transfers feel entitled to the glory they think they earned at the old school. Just look at the threads about putting on their journal offers that they are going to turn down.


its because TTTransfers are most presTTTigious students.

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IAFG
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby IAFG » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:02 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
IAFG wrote:WTF are you all talking about. The school is doing their students a favor and it's only shady to the extent some students might stay.


Transfers feel entitled to the glory they think they earned at the old school. Just look at the threads about putting on their journal offers that they are going to turn down.

Do they still do this on their clerkship apps

beastienoise
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby beastienoise » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:05 pm

This isn't a question of glory. I'll repeat that I wouldn't mind sharing a rank with someone who did worse, and if I end up transferring I wouldn't care at all. In the event that I'm forced to stay and now have a worse rank than students who did worse than I did, then yeah, I'm a little pissed. If the school wanted to help its students, it should allow those students who failed to transfer to use the new cutoffs; it would be inaccurate but at that point its moot since everyone's rankings would be inaccurate. I don't think looking into the possibility of transferring should mean that if you return to the school you should get treated worse than students who didn't.

Also, no one knew this was going to happen, otherwise I'm sure some top students would have waited to request a Dean's Cert and probably would have received a boost in their rankings for their transfer apps as well.

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IAFG
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby IAFG » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:09 pm

It really seems more honest to re-rank after transfers. That reflects the class as they are available to interview on day 1 of OCI.

09042014
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:15 pm

If they wait til you show up on Day 1, they'll miss OCI. They have to do it this way.

Benjamin1987
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby Benjamin1987 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:15 pm

This school must be outed.

Big Law pays top dollar to attract top talent. How pissed are top firms going to be when they realize they've been paying more than fair market value to acquire this school's students? This is an unethical misrepresentation.

More importantly, how pissed are you (the students competing for Big Law jobs) going to be when we get passed over for a position by someone who got a grade boost at this school? This is an unfair advantage.

At a top 25 school as many as 20 to 30 students could be applying for Dean's Certs. This means, in any given year, there could be major swings in rankings within the top 5 to 25%. This is un-fucking believable!

This kind of shady nonsense is exactly what gives the legal industry a bad name.

OUT.THIS.SCHOOL!

09042014
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:18 pm

Benjamin1987 wrote:This school must be outed.

Big Law pays top dollar to attract top talent. How pissed are top firms going to be when they realize they've been paying more than fair market value to acquire this school's students? This is an unethical misrepresentation.

More importantly, how pissed are you (the students competing for Big Law jobs) going to be when we get passed over for a position by someone who got a grade boost at this school? This is an unfair advantage.

At a top 25 school as many as 20 to 30 students could be applying for Dean's Certs. This means, in any given year, there could be major swings in rankings within the top 5 to 25%. This is un-fucking believable!

This kind of shady nonsense is exactly what gives the legal industry a bad name.

OUT.THIS.SCHOOL!


qfp

Transfer2DC
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby Transfer2DC » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:21 pm

IAFG wrote:It really seems more honest to re-rank after transfers. That reflects the class as they are available to interview on day 1 of OCI.



Seems like a fallacy to me. If a student who was intitally ranked 7/300 and is now ranked 1/293 because the ones above her transfered, she is inacurratley and falsely being identified as performing the best in her class at the time. She should stay 7/300 and employers will never interview anyone higher because they dont exist.

09042014
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:23 pm

Transfer2DC wrote:
IAFG wrote:It really seems more honest to re-rank after transfers. That reflects the class as they are available to interview on day 1 of OCI.



Seems like a fallacy to me. If a student who was intitally ranked 7/300 and is now ranked 1/293 because the ones above her transfered, she is inacurratley and falsely being identified as performing the best in her class at the time. She should stay 7/300 and employers will never interview anyone higher because they dont exist.


Then transfers shouldn't be allowed to recruit at their new schools because they weren't students "at the time."

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IAFG
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby IAFG » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:24 pm

Benjamin1987 wrote:This school must be outed.

Big Law pays top dollar to attract top talent. How pissed are top firms going to be when they realize they've been paying more than fair market value to acquire this school's students? This is an unethical misrepresentation.

More importantly, how pissed are you (the students competing for Big Law jobs) going to be when we get passed over for a position by someone who got a grade boost at this school? This is an unfair advantage.

At a top 25 school as many as 20 to 30 students could be applying for Dean's Certs. This means, in any given year, there could be major swings in rankings within the top 5 to 25%. This is un-fucking believable!

This kind of shady nonsense is exactly what gives the legal industry a bad name.

OUT.THIS.SCHOOL!

Wipe the spittle off your goatee and have yourself a few deep breaths.

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TrialLawyer16
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby TrialLawyer16 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:24 pm

I haven't gone through OCI yet, so my question is:

Do employers at OCI look at rank or just GPA?

And if, for example, OP stayed, I imagine that as an employer it would be strange to see candidate A with a 4.0 and #12 class rank and candidate B with a 3.86 and #1 class rank.

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IAFG
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby IAFG » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:24 pm

Transfer2DC wrote:
IAFG wrote:It really seems more honest to re-rank after transfers. That reflects the class as they are available to interview on day 1 of OCI.



Seems like a fallacy to me. If a student who was intitally ranked 7/300 and is now ranked 1/293 because the ones above her transfered, she is inacurratley and falsely being identified as performing the best in her class at the time. She should stay 7/300 and employers will never interview anyone higher because they dont exist.

That's not what a fallacy is.

09042014
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Re: Re-Rankings at your law school - normal?

Postby 09042014 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:24 pm

And in all seriousness, having a ranking of only students remain makes much more sense than leaving in people who aren't students.

When the boxing champ retires, his belts are removed.




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