T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

A forum for those current students who are or may be transferring from one school to another. Post any questions, advice, or other transfer related comments here.
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Anonymous User
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T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:38 am

So I'm at a T2 in the NYC area. Here's my situation...I want to work for a plaintiff's firm. I am not after big law. I have good grades but likely have 0 chance at a T14. I'm on a 3.0 curve and its looking like I'm gonna be right around a 3.4. I have no way of knowing my rank but I imagine its decent. I realize that T14 is out but what are the benefits if any of transferring to a school like Fordham, BU, BC, etc. I currently have no debt but would certainly have to take on debt if I transfer. Am I better staying put at my T2 or do I aim for T30 type schools? Please help.

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Re: T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:40 am

Also I should have mentioned this summer I have secured an internship with a solo attorney. It's unpaid but it's good work experience as I will be researching, memo writing, etc. Not Sure if this matters but figured I'd throw it in.

wh3931110
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Re: T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby wh3931110 » Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:05 pm

I made the jump from Marquette to Notre Dame, and am graduating with a better job than I believe I could have obtained at Marquette even with top grades at the time. You still have to work your butt off to get the job you want at schools in T30, but people are more willing to let you in the door and interview, at least that was my experience.

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lasersgopewpew
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Re: T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby lasersgopewpew » Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:45 pm

If you want to stay in the market you're in, and Biglaw isn't something you're interested in, then I'd research your school's placement at the kind of firms you want to work for. Making a move could be worth it for improved Biglaw chances, but you'll be paying a lot more in tuition, not to mention the possibility of losing journal/law review, connections you've made with professors, possible scholarship $$ for ranking, etc.

I don't know if any of the schools you could reach would be cost-effective based on what it is you want to do. You'd likely be able to do that anyway from where you're at.

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Re: T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed May 01, 2013 3:32 pm

But would I stand a better chance at a top plaintiffs litigation firm from a T30?

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LazinessPerSe
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Re: T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby LazinessPerSe » Sat May 04, 2013 8:29 am

Anonymous User wrote:So I'm at a T2 in the NYC area. Here's my situation...I want to work for a plaintiff's firm. I am not after big law. I have good grades but likely have 0 chance at a T14. I'm on a 3.0 curve and its looking like I'm gonna be right around a 3.4. I have no way of knowing my rank but I imagine its decent. I realize that T14 is out but what are the benefits if any of transferring to a school like Fordham, BU, BC, etc. I currently have no debt but would certainly have to take on debt if I transfer. Am I better staying put at my T2 or do I aim for T30 type schools? Please help.


Your rank matters much more than your GPA, just so you know. You're looking to transfer to schools in NYC/Boston, so I'm assuming you want to practice in either NYC or Boston. If that's the case, being at a school in the city/market you're looking to enter generally increases the alumni pool to help you. If you have no idea what city you want to work in yet, I would caution against taking on a lot of debt for that type of work (especially given your internship). If I were you, I'd stay at the T2 if it meant being debt free.

FWIW, do not transfer to a school because it's ranked better, unless you can crack T14. Those are the only real ranks to truly matter. T20-T50 is essentially a wash. Good schools, but largely regional employment prospects.

Anonymous User wrote:But would I stand a better chance at a top plaintiffs litigation firm from a T30?


PS, this is an almost impossible question to answer generally. A T30 in Boston will likely help you less for plaintiff's work in NYC than your TT in NYC, and vice versa.

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kapital98
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Re: T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby kapital98 » Sun May 05, 2013 10:06 pm

I think it mostly depends on your scholarship. Usually I would say don't transfer to a non-T14 unless you are moving to your preferred market. However, you're staying in the same market.

I transferred to a T14 in my preferred market. Transferring is not a fun process. You lose professional and social networks, you lose your relatively good grades, no financial aid, etc. Something else to keep in mind: You have to relearn an entire bureaucratic system and build new networks of people. This is not a fun process. I've been at my new school for an entire year and am just starting to feel comfortable navigating the bureaucracy.

Stay put unless you're currently attending at near sticker.

echooo23
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Re: T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby echooo23 » Mon May 06, 2013 11:32 am

kapital98 wrote:Something else to keep in mind: You have to relearn an entire bureaucratic system and build new networks of people. This is not a fun process. I've been at my new school for an entire year and am just starting to feel comfortable navigating the bureaucracy.



Serious question, not meant to sound asshole-ish at all, but is this really a legit reason to not transfer? I mean, I can deal with a year of learning a new bureaucratic system if it means I can score the job I want need, after all those loans. Also, I get the importance of networks, but if networking is more about making friends/acquaintances and keeping in touch with people than just collecting business cards and hitting people up for jobs, then isn't leaving the market not a total loss of that network if done correctly? And isn't it basically no to little loss if transferring in the same market?

In the grand scheme of things I'm more worried about the difference in cost, lost scholarship, and possible drop in grades than about how fun or not fun it's going to be to transfer. But I haven't transferred yet, so what the hell do I know.

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kapital98
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Re: T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby kapital98 » Mon May 06, 2013 11:58 am

echooo23 wrote:
kapital98 wrote:Something else to keep in mind: You have to relearn an entire bureaucratic system and build new networks of people. This is not a fun process. I've been at my new school for an entire year and am just starting to feel comfortable navigating the bureaucracy.



Serious question, not meant to sound asshole-ish at all, but is this really a legit reason to not transfer? I mean, I can deal with a year of learning a new bureaucratic system if it means I can score the job I want need, after all those loans. Also, I get the importance of networks, but if networking is more about making friends/acquaintances and keeping in touch with people than just collecting business cards and hitting people up for jobs, then isn't leaving the market not a total loss of that network if done correctly? And isn't it basically no to little loss if transferring in the same market?

In the grand scheme of things I'm more worried about the difference in cost, lost scholarship, and possible drop in grades than about how fun or not fun it's going to be to transfer. But I haven't transferred yet, so what the hell do I know.


I'm not saying it's a primary reason when considering if you want to transfer. I'm very happy I transferred even though I had to learn an entire new system.

It just sounds like OP has very little benefits from transferring. They have many costs. Learning a new bureaucratic system is just one more cost involved. All the little things add up. Especially when the benefits are seemingly so small.

Jimbo_Jones
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Re: T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby Jimbo_Jones » Mon May 06, 2013 2:06 pm

kapital98 wrote:I'm very happy I transferred even though I had to learn an entire new system.


kapital98 wrote:Learning a new bureaucratic system is just one more cost involved.



What do these statements mean? Can you elaborate? (Good faith questions). Maybe my tolerance for bureaucracy has become so high from working at a corporation with a quarter million people that I have no ability to perceive it at the law school level. Or maybe I haven't been involved enough in the school's operation (part-time student here), or maybe its not as intense at my school as it is at others.

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kapital98
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Re: T2 Transfer to T30? Worth It?

Postby kapital98 » Mon May 06, 2013 4:37 pm

Jimbo_Jones wrote:
kapital98 wrote:I'm very happy I transferred even though I had to learn an entire new system.


kapital98 wrote:Learning a new bureaucratic system is just one more cost involved.



What do these statements mean? Can you elaborate? (Good faith questions). Maybe my tolerance for bureaucracy has become so high from working at a corporation with a quarter million people that I have no ability to perceive it at the law school level. Or maybe I haven't been involved enough in the school's operation (part-time student here), or maybe its not as intense at my school as it is at others.


I'm just noting that you have to learn a new system. My old school (Hastings) had a very nice bureaucratic system. All of the offices were in the same building, which is relatively small, and close to each other. It made going from the registrar, to financial aid, to career services, etc... very easy. I got to know the people and the turn around time is very quick.

Cornell is a large university system. Many of the departments handle things differently than at Hastings. Some of the administration is run by the University while most is run by the law school. You have to meet all of the new deans and department coordinators. The student websites are completely different (Cornell's was created by a fan of Kafka). It's just obnoxious to learn an entire new system.

I assume it's the exact same thing if you transferred from one school to another in undergrad. You've got to relearn all of the things you would have learned as freshman.

Is it a big deal? Not really. Is it something worth mentioning? Yes.




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