Top 10% exactly, 3.81 at Cornell to...

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PinkCow
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Re: Top 10% exactly, 3.81 at Cornell to...

Postby PinkCow » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:36 am

whoacornell wrote:So I applied to transfer to Penn, NYU and Columbia. So far in at NYU and still awaiting Columbia (NYU over Penn so Penn is out). I was deadset on leaving until I did financial calculations.

I currently am getting $25k from Cornell. Factoring in the loss of that, accrued interest, plus COL in NYC, that comes out to, in simple terms, a lot of money. So now I would like to stay.

My issue is that I skipped the writing comp completely. I am wondering how bad this would look come interview time. I want litigation 100%. I was hoping for Cravath, Sullivan, Simpson, Davis Polk, or Paul Weiss. Thoughts?


Sorry OP carry on. Here's a bump.

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rayiner
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Re: Top 10% exactly, 3.81 at Cornell to...

Postby rayiner » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:42 am

quiver wrote:Yeah I have a few different thoughts about this. First, rayiner is completely correct with most of his post, but it assumes that you're going for COA straight out of school. It seems that at least half of COA judges (probably closer to 60%) are still on plan anyway so that would give you a full year at H to make connections with professors. Obviously not ideal, but not bleak either. If you go for district courts first, almost all of them are still on plan so you would have the full year for those as well. Cost being equal, I'd probably side with rayiner and tell you to stay. But with H being quite a bit cheaper, I think I would lean toward going.


I suppose it depends on what OP means by "quite a bit cheaper." At this level, every $10k of savings = over $100/month in your wallet for the rest of your life so it is a pretty big consideration.

That said, even if OP does alumni clerk, his judge's clerks are still going to see two years of grades on his transcript instead of three, and they're still going to see no LR. And lack of LR is definitely going to change how influential professors perceive him. After transferring, I wouldn't say his situation is bleak, but it's not as good as it would have been had he stayed.

My question is: what's the upside? From top 10%+LR at Cornell targeting NYC, there is exactly one firm where transferring could conceivably help, and that's for WLRK. For clerkships, I think it will outright hurt. Down the line, he'll have that HLS degree, sure, but he won't have been in the trenches with the other HLS 1L's building those relationships. Best case, he gets COA from HLS, but even then it will always say Cornell School of Law 2011 - 2012 on his Linked-In. And any recruiter or partner who is going to treat HLS + COA at Cravath differently than Cornell + LR + COA at Cravath is going to be the kind of person who would take note of that.

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quiver
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Re: Top 10% exactly, 3.81 at Cornell to...

Postby quiver » Fri Jul 13, 2012 12:02 pm

rayiner wrote:I suppose it depends on what OP means by "quite a bit cheaper." At this level, every $10k of savings = over $100/month in your wallet for the rest of your life so it is a pretty big consideration.

That said, even if OP does alumni clerk, his judge's clerks are still going to see two years of grades on his transcript instead of three, and they're still going to see no LR. And lack of LR is definitely going to change how influential professors perceive him. After transferring, I wouldn't say his situation is bleak, but it's not as good as it would have been had he stayed.
Depends on the judge I think. Many judges prefer LR but also view a secondary journal as a plus. Some judges don't care about journal at all. I've heard from several district judges in competitive districts that they only look at applications from about six schools (with Cornell not being one of them). With the amount of judges in the country, I think that the lack of LR + H degree and Cornell + LR is probably a wash. And because H will be cheaper, I suggested transferring.

rayiner wrote:Down the line, he'll have that HLS degree, sure, but he won't have been in the trenches with the other HLS 1L's building those relationships. Best case, he gets COA from HLS, but even then it will always say Cornell School of Law 2011 - 2012 on his Linked-In. And any recruiter or partner who is going to treat HLS + COA at Cravath differently than Cornell + LR + COA at Cravath is going to be the kind of person who would take note of that.
This seems silly.

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rayiner
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Re: Top 10% exactly, 3.81 at Cornell to...

Postby rayiner » Fri Jul 13, 2012 12:24 pm

quiver wrote:Depends on the judge I think. Many judges prefer LR but also view a secondary journal as a plus. Some judges don't care about journal at all. I've heard from several district judges in competitive districts that they only look at applications from about six schools (with Cornell not being one of them). With the amount of judges in the country, I think that the lack of LR + H degree and Cornell + LR is probably a wash. And because H will be cheaper, I suggested transferring.


It does depend on the judge, but COA judges seem to really prefer law review. My year at NU, maybe half the people who got Coif weren't on LR (we have no grade-on). Yet, almost everyone with a COA clerkship lined up is on LR. I don't think Cornell + LR versus H transfer no LR is anything close to a wash for clerkships.

quiver wrote:
rayiner wrote:Down the line, he'll have that HLS degree, sure, but he won't have been in the trenches with the other HLS 1L's building those relationships. Best case, he gets COA from HLS, but even then it will always say Cornell School of Law 2011 - 2012 on his Linked-In. And any recruiter or partner who is going to treat HLS + COA at Cravath differently than Cornell + LR + COA at Cravath is going to be the kind of person who would take note of that.
This seems silly.


My point is that HLS is going to give you a very slight benefit over Cornell if you end up at the same firm with the same clerkships from both places. Being a transfer is going to attenuate that benefit. Slightly, perhaps, but it's going to be a slight benefit to begin with.

ajaxconstructions
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Re: Top 10% exactly, 3.81 at Cornell to...

Postby ajaxconstructions » Fri Jul 13, 2012 7:28 pm

Arbiter213 wrote:
ajaxconstructions wrote:
CanadianWolf wrote:OP: You are a likely transfer admit to Columbia. If accepted, go.

If you remain at Cornell & are asked about LR, you risk being viewed as a wimp or a flake. Focus on the scholarship. As I wrote above, you risk losing out to other T-14 candidates with top 10% & law review.

Sure you can get NYC biglaw with your current class rank at Cornell, but you might lose out on some when competing with other top 10% & LR.

Did you apply to Harvard ?

P.S. Just looked at a few of ajaxconstructions earlier posts. Apparently ajax is a Cornell law student in the top 20% who decided not to do the write-on for Cornell's law review. Odd that ajax would now play dumb by suggesting that Cornell's law review is limited to the top 8% grade-ons.


I actually made LR, thanks though.


Odd since you said you didn't do the competition

People ITT are severely underestimating the importance of being on ANY journal. If OP doesn't get work on (for whatever reason- it's not a guarantee, though I can't imagine missing it) he's fucked.


Did do the comp, but obviously judged how bad I did.

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Arbiter213
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Re: Top 10% exactly, 3.81 at Cornell to...

Postby Arbiter213 » Fri Jul 13, 2012 8:14 pm

ajaxconstructions wrote:
Did do the comp, but obviously judged how bad I did.



Been there.




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