Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

A forum for those current students who are or may be transferring from one school to another. Post any questions, advice, or other transfer related comments here.
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Worth it to Transfer?

Stay at TJ (debt free)
9
18%
Transfer to USD
15
29%
Transfer to UC Hastings
27
53%
 
Total votes: 51

jschille
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:24 am

Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby jschille » Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:38 am

Hello All,

I am currently attending Thomas Jefferson School of Law in San Diego. I finished my first year top of my class and the school has given me a considerable sum of money to stay, a nice amount of federal work study money (am able to charge $25 an hour for being research assistant), and have been invited to join the Law Review next year.

I have been born and raised and San Diego and would most likely stay and practice in San Diego, however I am very willing to move if needed.

I applied for transfer and have been accepted to USD and UC Hastings. So, here we go... Is it worth it to transfer?

In a perfect world I would like to work for a large firm right out of school with my two main fields of interest being IP law or Environmental law, but I am open and willing to do anything. Is the switch worth it? Clearly my biggest issues are the debt, my class rank, and not being on Law Review.

Will employers think more of me if I graduate top of my class with numerous awards/achievements from Thomas Jefferson than if I graduate Top ~30% from USD/Hastings?

Any help is much appreciated.

Best,
JB
Last edited by jschille on Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mileslibertatis
Posts: 582
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2012 8:09 pm

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby mileslibertatis » Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:44 am

I don't know what "Rank not published" means on USNews, but it can't be good for jobs or transfer prospects. Do TJ grads get big firm jobs in San Diego?

abc12345675
Posts: 373
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2012 11:27 am

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby abc12345675 » Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:44 am

jschille wrote:Hello All,

I am currently attending Thomas Jefferson School of Law in San Diego. I finished my first year top of my class and the school has given me a considerable sum of money to stay, a nice amount of federal work study money (am able to charge $25 an hour for being research assistant), and have been invited to join the Law Review next year.

I have been born and raised and San Diego and would most likely stay and practice in San Diego, however I am very willing to move if needed.

I applied for transfer and have been accepted to USD and UC Hastings. So, here we go... Is it worth it to transfer?

In a perfect world I would like to work for a large firm right out of school with my two main fields of interest being IP law or Environmental law, but I am open and willing to do anything. Is the switch worth it? Clearly my biggest issues are the debt, my class rank, and not being on Law Review.

Will employers think more of me if I graduate top of my class with numerous awards/achievements from Thomas Jefferson than if I graduate Top ~30% from USD/Hastings?

Any help is much appreciated.

Best,
JB


YES!!!! That TJ degree will follow you around like a black cloud.

If you want to practice in San Diego, I'd transfer to USD for sure. You should be able to participate in their OCI this fall and with your grades from TJ you should be able to get solid interviews.

jschille
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:24 am

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby jschille » Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:57 am

abc12345675 wrote:
jschille wrote:


YES!!!! That TJ degree will follow you around like a black cloud.

If you want to practice in San Diego, I'd transfer to USD for sure. You should be able to participate in their OCI this fall and with your grades from TJ you should be able to get solid interviews.


Employers in SD think that low of TJ even top of the class?
Time to bounce I guess...

jschille
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:24 am

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby jschille » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:04 pm

mileslibertatis wrote:I don't know what "Rank not published" means on USNews, but it can't be good for jobs or transfer prospects. Do TJ grads get big firm jobs in San Diego?


Our Career Services department definitely does try to get our name out to the bigger firms. I have just applied to a summer internship with Best Best and Krieger, Crowell and Morning, and Knobbe Martens Olson & Bear. Obviously we will have to wait and see if I get call backs, but at least they are talking to these larger firms...

User avatar
catholicgirl
Posts: 320
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:34 pm

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby catholicgirl » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:07 pm

jschille wrote:
mileslibertatis wrote: but at least they are talking to these larger firms...


Just because they're doing the bare minimum does not mean you should stay. GTFO

User avatar
androstan
Posts: 2581
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:07 am

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby androstan » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:12 pm

If one generously defines biglaw as 100+ attorneys, TJ places a couple:

--LinkRemoved--

Notice that there are 0 TJ grads in 250+ sized firms.

Zero. Nada.

jschille
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:24 am

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby jschille » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:17 pm

androstan wrote:If one generously defines biglaw as 100+ attorneys, TJ places a couple:

--LinkRemoved--

Notice that there are 0 TJ grads in 250+ sized firms.

Zero. Nada.


Thanks for this link. This is a great page and I think also helps sway my decision in favor of USD/Hastings. Appreciate it.

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catholicgirl
Posts: 320
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:34 pm

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby catholicgirl » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:19 pm

jschille wrote:
androstan wrote:If one generously defines biglaw as 100+ attorneys, TJ places a couple:

--LinkRemoved--

Notice that there are 0 TJ grads in 250+ sized firms.

Zero. Nada.


Thanks for this link. This is a great page and I think also helps sway my decision in favor of USD/Hastings. Appreciate it.


So, morbidly curious. Did TJ make it hard for you to apply to transfer?

jschille
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:24 am

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby jschille » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:25 pm

catholicgirl wrote:
jschille wrote:
androstan wrote:If one generously defines biglaw as 100+ attorneys, TJ places a couple:

--LinkRemoved--

Notice that there are 0 TJ grads in 250+ sized firms.

Zero. Nada.


Thanks for this link. This is a great page and I think also helps sway my decision in favor of USD/Hastings. Appreciate it.


So, morbidly curious. Did TJ make it hard for you to apply to transfer?



It actually wasn't too bad. The teachers at the school definitely want the best for the students and were very willing and open to help me with the transfer process. The administration will not go out of their way to help you and you will have to follow-up with them for your requests, but was not too bad. My biggest complaint would be trying to contact the Dean. I attempted to contact the Dean (and assistant) for over a month to try to work some deal out (more scholarship money to stay etc.) and eventually just gave up and decided to just go ahead and put my transfer apps in.

After trying to contact the Dean for over a month I told my teacher about the problem and she actually went to the board of admissions and talked to the them on behalf of me. Again, great teachers at the school and they all mean very well, just a terrible rep with a lot of bad apples at the school.

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manofjustice
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Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby manofjustice » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:41 pm

Where is the drop out of law school option?

jschille
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:24 am

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby jschille » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:43 pm

manofjustice wrote:Where is the drop out of law school option?


Why drop out when I have the option to attend USD, Hastings, or graduate from TJ debt free?

CanadianWolf
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Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 4:54 pm

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby CanadianWolf » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:44 pm

Transfer. Nothing posted suggests that you should stay. Plus, a transfer acceptance may prompt your current law school to consider your request for scholarship money.

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lnllnl
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Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby lnllnl » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:45 pm

Did you apply to any other CA schools like UCLA, USC or Cal?

Lord Randolph McDuff
Posts: 1587
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2011 4:37 pm

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:45 pm

drop out of law school would be an option sans grades. this guy is in great shape. firms get to take the top of the class from a law school without the black mark of having TJSL on their bio page. no way you don't get big law if you want it.

Lord Randolph McDuff
Posts: 1587
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2011 4:37 pm

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:46 pm

oh but by the way OP you fucked up massively. would have been auto admit to USC or UCLA.

jschille
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:24 am

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby jschille » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:47 pm

lnllnl wrote:Did you apply to any other CA schools like UCLA, USC or Cal?


Applied to Berkeley, not any LA schools - not the biggest fan of LA. Also have a lady in the picture that works in San Diego or could get a job in San Fran if needed. Got denied from Berkeley yesterday.

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androstan
Posts: 2581
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Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby androstan » Fri Jul 06, 2012 1:28 pm

Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:oh but by the way OP you fucked up massively. would have been auto admit to USC or UCLA.


You really shoulda, OP. Nut up and put up with LA for 2 years.

jschille
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:24 am

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby jschille » Sat Jul 07, 2012 10:52 am

androstan wrote:
Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:oh but by the way OP you fucked up massively. would have been auto admit to USC or UCLA.


You really shoulda, OP. Nut up and put up with LA for 2 years.


Well, I turned in app for UCLA just for you yesterday. We will see what I get back.

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2014
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Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby 2014 » Sat Jul 07, 2012 11:00 pm

USD is private and expensive as hell and has dismal employment rates. Don't get me wrong they are far better than TJ, but I imagine transfers get absolutely massacred at T2 OCIs.

I'm not saying TJ is a good situation at all, but if someone were to go post elsewhere on this forum about going to USD at sticker they would get their ass handed to them. While TJ only places like 25% of grads in FT Legal jobs, it seems like you are in good shape to get one of them while as a transfer at USD I would think there is a good chance you end up as one of the 55% there who end up un/deremployed.

IsTheFatLadySinging
Posts: 179
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Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby IsTheFatLadySinging » Sun Jul 08, 2012 1:14 am

2014 wrote:USD is private and expensive as hell and has dismal employment rates. Don't get me wrong they are far better than TJ, but I imagine transfers get absolutely massacred at T2 OCIs.

I'm not saying TJ is a good situation at all, but if someone were to go post elsewhere on this forum about going to USD at sticker they would get their ass handed to them. While TJ only places like 25% of grads in FT Legal jobs, it seems like you are in good shape to get one of them while as a transfer at USD I would think there is a good chance you end up as one of the 55% there who end up un/deremployed.


So here is what has been reiterated over and over on the transfer thread this year. "If you transfer, you will still basically be treated 'as if' you were still at your old school." The firms still look at your old school's grades/gpa/rank, and if they would of considered you from your old school, then they will consider you at your new school BASED on your first year performance.

So how would OP end up in the 55% who are unemployed from his new school? If OP was in the top 1-3% at TJ, and 25% find legal employment?

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2014
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Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby 2014 » Sun Jul 08, 2012 11:35 am

I'll dip out as I know you guys know more about it than I do, I just know that I've spent a lot of time looking at how OCI goes for transfers and kids at better schools than USD strike out regularly. Since most transfers tend to be toward the top of their class, you would expect them all to have success at their new school but for whatever reason they often don't.

But like I said, I know far less about it than most here so I'll step away, was just surprised by the overwhelming positive reaction to transferring to USD when other threads encourage people to think twice about transferring to different (better) schools.

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androstan
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Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby androstan » Sun Jul 08, 2012 12:07 pm

jschille wrote:
androstan wrote:
Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:oh but by the way OP you fucked up massively. would have been auto admit to USC or UCLA.


You really shoulda, OP. Nut up and put up with LA for 2 years.


Well, I turned in app for UCLA just for you yesterday. We will see what I get back.


Really glad to see this. Top of your class, even at TJ, you have a shot. Some firms will give you a shot at OCI and, if you interview well and show a good writing sample, they will be more than happy to sell you as a UCLA grad.

jschille
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:24 am

Re: Worth It to Transfer from Tier 4 to Top 60/40?

Postby jschille » Mon Jul 09, 2012 2:22 pm

IsTheFatLadySinging wrote:
2014 wrote:USD is private and expensive as hell and has dismal employment rates. Don't get me wrong they are far better than TJ, but I imagine transfers get absolutely massacred at T2 OCIs.

I'm not saying TJ is a good situation at all, but if someone were to go post elsewhere on this forum about going to USD at sticker they would get their ass handed to them. While TJ only places like 25% of grads in FT Legal jobs, it seems like you are in good shape to get one of them while as a transfer at USD I would think there is a good chance you end up as one of the 55% there who end up un/deremployed.


So here is what has been reiterated over and over on the transfer thread this year. "If you transfer, you will still basically be treated 'as if' you were still at your old school." The firms still look at your old school's grades/gpa/rank, and if they would of considered you from your old school, then they will consider you at your new school BASED on your first year performance.

So how would OP end up in the 55% who are unemployed from his new school? If OP was in the top 1-3% at TJ, and 25% find legal employment?


Now I am a little confused... TJ doesn't do any OCI's, but are you saying that I will fare poorly at OCI's at USD or Hastings implying that the transfer is not worth it?




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