Leaving t4?

A forum for those current students who are or may be transferring from one school to another. Post any questions, advice, or other transfer related comments here.
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alwayssunnyinfl
Posts: 4100
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:34 pm

Re: Leaving t4?

Postby alwayssunnyinfl » Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:38 pm

fascinatingnot wrote:I must disagree.

Fact: Unless a T14 (give or take), an average student is substantially more likely not to get a big law job than get a big law job...so why transfer for an unimproved situation.

I've always understood why t14 students have a belief in the superiority of their schools... but a non t14 should have no such beliefs, anything outside the t14 is on the same playing field. A kid the top five of a T4 is most likely going to get a better job than all average students outside the t14, and of the remaining t50, better or equal jobs than 90% of the students.

What people don't understand is there really isn't that much of a difference between top students at T4, 3, 2, and lower ranked T1's. The real difference in the schools is that the average students at the higher ranked schools are better, and most employers understand this.[/quote
clown post bro.[/quote

Fair enough, but would you care to articulate?

Very simple math...top 2-3 percent at T4 has very substantial shot at getting big law and at least a job at a respected firm v. Does Gulc even produce 50 percent in biglaw? Why transfer to a T50 (50-17) where they place at most 10-20 percent in big law, when you are already in a fifty/fifty position? And if you are a top 1%, u are a lock unless you lack majorly in other humanly areas.

To take on an extra 100K to say I went to GULC is not my cup of tea, but I get the rational...but to put on that same debt to say I went to Minnesota or Tulane is laughable...I'm not laughing at the institutions itself, but to think that a transfer up would even remotely be better is sad[/quote

edit: first, tell me more about this: "top 2-3 percent at T4 has very substantial shot at getting big law" cuz i disagree.

it sounds like you want us to agree with you, and tell you that t4 is the way to go.
I wont take the time to try and articulate why t14 are worth it, there are plenty of stickys on that. but i will say this, it does depend on you career path and what you want for urself.
- warning: big generalization coming:: If you want a shot at the biggest cases, and top firms transfer. If you want to do local probate or personal injury, stay at ur school.[/quote

If you are top one percent u are pretty much guaranteed biglaw regardless of the school you go to, I don't have evidence other than word of mouth from kids at my school who claim that many of the top students are making out six figures coming out, but then again neither do you (at least give me credit, its not like I said top 5-10 percent get biglaw, 2-3 percent is like 4-7 people, but we can agree to disagree...)
honestly, what I take offense to is your generalization about the big cases only involving the biglaw firms, and then you take a cheap shot over personal injury...winning millions of dollars for plaintiffs is not a big case? i realize that it is much more riskier and the odds are against you, but partners at successful personal injury firms make more than partners at biglaw firms
not to mention, class actions like the one in against Walmart consisted of a firm of a few people who busted Walmart for 150million (although, it was most likely a big law firm that represented wal mart and lost)

What the HELL is this?

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jessuf
Posts: 12499
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Re: Leaving t4?

Postby jessuf » Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:43 pm

IsTheFatLadySinging wrote:
I am indifferent about where I currently am, and I do not care where I go. I want to work big law anywhere.


You can probably get an NLJ250 firm if you are ok with working in FL and don't transfer. You will get an interview with those firms whether you're at GULC or your t4 because the firms will look at your T4 grades. If the school costs were comparable OR if you wanted NYC or some other market, I'd recommend transferring. However, since you have a scholarship and are okay with working in your current state, it honestly doesn't make much sense to transfer.

I have friends who, as 1Ls from a T3 in FL, have NLJ250 1L SAs. It's totally possible. You don't see much T3/T4ers working at V100 firms in FL, though, unless through diversity hiring. I have no idea what counts as "big law" (I always assume V100), but at my T3 in FL, big law outside of really the top 1% (which is about 4 people) rarely happens unless those people are EIC or moot court/trial team star (with good grades).

tl;dr: Really, the only thing GULC will give you is the opportunity to get lottery interviews with firms that you wouldn't see at your T4's OCI. You can get interviews with FL firms through your old school's OCI or mass mailing, so transferring doesn't seem worth it given your scholarship, rank, and flexibility on location.

opX
Posts: 215
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:29 am

Re: Leaving t4?

Postby opX » Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:51 pm

Jessuf wrote:
IsTheFatLadySinging wrote:
I am indifferent about where I currently am, and I do not care where I go. I want to work big law anywhere.


You can probably get an NLJ250 firm if you are ok with working in FL and don't transfer. You will get an interview with those firms whether you're at GULC or your t4 because the firms will look at your T4 grades. If the school costs were comparable OR if you wanted NYC or some other market, I'd recommend transferring. However, since you have a scholarship and are okay with working in your current state, it honestly doesn't make much sense to transfer.

I have friends who, as 1Ls from a T3 in FL, have NLJ250 1L SAs. It's totally possible. You don't see much T3/T4ers working at V100 firms in FL, though, unless through diversity hiring. I have no idea what counts as "big law" (I always assume V100), but at my T3 in FL, big law outside of really the top 1% (which is about 4 people) rarely happens unless those people are EIC or moot court/trial team star (with good grades).

tl;dr: Really, the only thing GULC will give you is the opportunity to get lottery interviews with firms that you wouldn't see at your T4's OCI. You can get interviews with FL firms through your old school's OCI or mass mailing, so transferring doesn't seem worth it given your scholarship, rank, and flexibility on location.


all valid, but important to consider that some firms do exist that would never hire him because he'd lack the necessary pedigree. (whatever pedigree necessary for that firm)

opX
Posts: 215
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:29 am

Re: Leaving t4?

Postby opX » Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:02 pm

In the end, IMO, I would rather take the shot and transfer. Worst case scenario I have the same career path that I would had I not have transferred. Work hard, save money, and climb out of debt.
Best case scenario, I get on a career path that I would never have had the chance to have at my t4.
No risk no reward I suppose.

Good luck in your decision.

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Lycurgus
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Re: Leaving t4?

Postby Lycurgus » Thu Jul 05, 2012 7:41 pm

If you are in the top 10% at Suffolk what are the chances you will get into BU?

ItsMyTimeBoston
Posts: 228
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 5:55 pm

Re: Leaving t4?

Postby ItsMyTimeBoston » Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:19 pm

Lycurgus wrote:If you are in the top 10% at Suffolk what are the chances you will get into BU?


Probably pretty good -- 75% chance you'll get in. The application date is long past though, and at least two Suffolk 1l's have already been admitted.

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Lawquacious
Posts: 2037
Joined: Fri Oct 23, 2009 10:36 am

Re: Leaving t4?

Postby Lawquacious » Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:32 pm

concurrent fork wrote:[You have a] SEC internship lined up. .


But you know that SEC internship doesn't pay and won't turn to a permanent offer right? Not saying you're wrong Concurrent, although I do find it a bit interesting that as a transfer student yourself you are trying pretty hard to talk people out of it. Yeah, you got Harvard, but on OTOH you weren't at a TTTT, you came from a T1 right? Maybe even at T20 --> Harvard? Anyway, not bad advice and you def may be right, but it is at best half of dozen v. six of the other if you are talking about the chance to transfer from a TTTT school, where the person doesn't even have fully scholly. Especially for a T14. Even if biglaw doesn't work.
Last edited by Lawquacious on Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Lawquacious
Posts: 2037
Joined: Fri Oct 23, 2009 10:36 am

Re: Leaving t4?

Postby Lawquacious » Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:33 pm

alwayssunnyinfl wrote:
fascinatingnot wrote:I must disagree.

Fact: Unless a T14 (give or take), an average student is substantially more likely not to get a big law job than get a big law job...so why transfer for an unimproved situation.

I've always understood why t14 students have a belief in the superiority of their schools... but a non t14 should have no such beliefs, anything outside the t14 is on the same playing field. A kid the top five of a T4 is most likely going to get a better job than all average students outside the t14, and of the remaining t50, better or equal jobs than 90% of the students.

What people don't understand is there really isn't that much of a difference between top students at T4, 3, 2, and lower ranked T1's. The real difference in the schools is that the average students at the higher ranked schools are better, and most employers understand this.[/quote
clown post bro.[/quote

Fair enough, but would you care to articulate?

Very simple math...top 2-3 percent at T4 has very substantial shot at getting big law and at least a job at a respected firm v. Does Gulc even produce 50 percent in biglaw? Why transfer to a T50 (50-17) where they place at most 10-20 percent in big law, when you are already in a fifty/fifty position? And if you are a top 1%, u are a lock unless you lack majorly in other humanly areas.

To take on an extra 100K to say I went to GULC is not my cup of tea, but I get the rational...but to put on that same debt to say I went to Minnesota or Tulane is laughable...I'm not laughing at the institutions itself, but to think that a transfer up would even remotely be better is sad[/quote

edit: first, tell me more about this: "top 2-3 percent at T4 has very substantial shot at getting big law" cuz i disagree.

it sounds like you want us to agree with you, and tell you that t4 is the way to go.
I wont take the time to try and articulate why t14 are worth it, there are plenty of stickys on that. but i will say this, it does depend on you career path and what you want for urself.
- warning: big generalization coming:: If you want a shot at the biggest cases, and top firms transfer. If you want to do local probate or personal injury, stay at ur school.[/quote

If you are top one percent u are pretty much guaranteed biglaw regardless of the school you go to, I don't have evidence other than word of mouth from kids at my school who claim that many of the top students are making out six figures coming out, but then again neither do you (at least give me credit, its not like I said top 5-10 percent get biglaw, 2-3 percent is like 4-7 people, but we can agree to disagree...)
honestly, what I take offense to is your generalization about the big cases only involving the biglaw firms, and then you take a cheap shot over personal injury...winning millions of dollars for plaintiffs is not a big case? i realize that it is much more riskier and the odds are against you, but partners at successful personal injury firms make more than partners at biglaw firms
not to mention, class actions like the one in against Walmart consisted of a firm of a few people who busted Walmart for 150million (although, it was most likely a big law firm that represented wal mart and lost)

What the HELL is this?



Someone who doesn't know how to use quote function on here yet (it can be confusing at first).

quesniot
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:18 pm

Re: Leaving t4?

Postby quesniot » Mon Jul 09, 2012 6:40 pm

.
Last edited by quesniot on Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

ItsMyTimeBoston
Posts: 228
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 5:55 pm

Re: Leaving t4?

Postby ItsMyTimeBoston » Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:19 pm

bump

Bitonti
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:39 am

Re: Leaving t4?

Postby Bitonti » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:51 am

Not all TTTTs are created equal. Suffolk is ok if you want Biglaw in Boston AND you are top 1%. You have just as good a shot as a person in top 10% from BU/BC. Considering the scholarship and making LR at Suffolk, just stay.

That said, if one's goal is Biglaw, don't go to a TTTT, obviously, because it is unlikely that you will be top 1%. But since OP already is, well, stay put.

FWIW, I graduated top 1% from Suffoll and got Biglaw through OCI. About 10 students out of 500 did. So, tough odds. But OP has a great shot. If he or she cannot transfer into a T14, should keep the money and elite rank, provided he or she plans to remain in Boston. The advantage of BC/BU is that those schools "travel" better. But is that worth tens of thousands in debt? Tough call. Could be my bias, but I would stay put.




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